Posted on 12/16/2013 10:07:17 AM PST by SkyPilot
Edited on 12/16/2013 10:11:53 AM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]
GOP lawmakers and military groups have lined up against the bipartisan budget deal making its way through Congress because of a provision that would trim pay for young military retirees.
In a joint statement last week, Sens. Kelly Ayotte (R-N.H.), Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) and Roger Wicker (R-Miss.) said they cannot support the legislation because it
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
What Ryan is doing IS hitting the military hardest. THe leftists in the media don’t care how it’s spun.
WEll, everyone ought to worry about a terrible morale not attracting good people to the military.
“Paying these employed people a “pension” takes money away from the elderly or from lifers, that is, people who actually stayed in the military or job until retirement age.”
Take the example of an average officer. He has a bachelors degree, and, if he’s anything past a captain, which, if he’s retired, he certainly is so, he has a masters. Rare exception not to.
He’s made, on average, an enormously less amount of salary than his civilian counterpart, for instance a pilot or a doctor, and certainly much less so for his education. A civilian pilot, logistics expert, civil engineer, communications specialist, does not require a masters.
He lives (and this goes for girls too) in, often, a remote city/town. His spouse scrambles for a lifestyle every three or so years, ditto kids. And she can forget about a continuity for a career. Very rare when moving around so.
When he gets out of the military, finding a job at 40 plus years old that appreciates the experience, expertise in logistical, communication, leadership, teaching and life skills is almost out of the question, yet he’s only 40 with kids in high school, on way to college; a house to purchase and a whole new life to set up.
He’s been on call 24 hours a day for at least 20 years, if not 28. He’s spent years, many years, months at a time, years at a time, away from home.
The divorce rate is high. Post trauma is high, and that’s if he’s not wounded and disabled.
A lot of the pull is not the salary, which is low, again, in comparison, it is the pension. THese guys are not thinking, gee, how about a welfare scheme, in which I can collect for doing nothing, it’s what can I do for my family and my community by doing a job which gets me potentially getting bombed by an IED while my family fends for themselves during the winter so I can always at least provide for them while being a productive citizen through later years.
I’m sure most of them would take a much lower salary after retirement, or a lower retirement, than they have, all things being equal, and, in case you don’t know it, a lot of them took a 20% hit on salary, lifestyle changing, due to the sequester, which most people only think they themselves took a hit on, not realizing the military WAS, by far, hardest hit.
You don’t hear them complaining.
Read the Kipling Poem above. He had it right, as he has a lot right, having seen action in India.
But when people mistake the military as greedy, lazy, undeserving, they just don’t know what they’re talking about, they don’t know.
But they ought to. Because, whether the military goes into some lame brained LBJ/kennedy Aisan Jungle scheme, or a Bushy Saudi deal, they are prepared to protect this country against all enemies.
Neglect them and underappreciate them at your peril, they take only so much misunderstanding and lack of appreciation.
They are people, and the hardest working, most societally conscientious kind.
“Who the heck else retires at forty, and why?”
You were in the military? Hmm.
Who the heck else goes into a job which is 24 hours on call for twenty years, deployment with 12 hours on for six months straight, for instance, days off numbering a couple?
It’s like dog years.
If you don’t know that, I wonder what you did, but not too much, so don’t bore me with the details.
Union?
Yes, there are all kind of strikes and demands from the military s/
Detroit was run into the ground as was the car industry. Name one thing the military retirees did similar to.
No.
You described our life perfectly. My spouse just retired after 26 years. He’s struggling now to work for military contractors in DC, many of which are now being infiltrated with civilians under 30 who are highly over educated, yet know nothing about how the military operates.
He’s ready to get out of that environment as well, and take his managerial experience elsewhere.
But just as you are, I'm beyond disgusted with Ryan. He didn't even pull back when it was known that any cuts the 'pubs agreed to would be overturned, even though he gave up the sequestor.
The way I see it is that Ryan had the opportunity of a lifetime to be a true conservative and articulate those values. Instead, he was not able to win over enough conservatives. Too many saw through Ryan and Romney could not seal the deal with the voters.
Exactly right! It’s obvious the cuts the Dems agreed to are so they can later say look how heartless the Republicans are. Those will be headlines next year, in time for the election. The Fed prints $85 million a month. I heard Tom Coburn say he can show $25 billion in waste and fraud just this past year. What the hell was Ryan thinking—$26 billion in 10 years. Not to mention giving Dems benefit of increasing taxes with simple majority vote in the senate! Who knew House Rinos would be Reid’s best friend.
Anyone in the military.can manage anything. They usually way underestimate themselves even pilots, if they can deal with inefficiency. The military does that to retain them
Project management - in a field that is secure, medicine, is a good one
” I gave you an example in my post to you and you “conveniently” ignore it.”
You didn’t send it to me. I’m the one who said it is good that Washington pays pensions, unlike the private sector.
As for your example, I went back and looked it up. You ask how anyone could expect to live on an E7 retirement of about $1200 a month, after taxes? Doesn’t sound like much to me either, but on the other hand, that is also the average social security pension that most of us get. How are we expected to live on that?
By the way, is that E7 retirement of $1200 a month the rate for those who retire after 20 years? Seemed to be what you were saying.
I included you in my post so that you could see that the other poster was misleading people by not divulging facts or figures. You appeared to be getting “sucked in” by their nebulous and questionable terminology.
I used but one example, figured that it would be sufficient to show folks what a “full pension” looked like.
I am not counting on SS, are you? I have had my pay reduced for SS every working day of my life, going on 35 years now. Failure to plan is a plan to fail...that is why I’m working a second job, one in the private sector that offers me a pension. A rarity to be sure, but I leveraged my skills, work ethic and other tangibles into a good paying job. Should I be forced to surrender my “full pension” from the military because of my success after my service?
Making up for the lost wages, but never making up for the lost time with my family as a result of my deployments or TDY’s, or the medical issues as a result of my chosen field.
The ~$1200 a month I mentioned is take home for an E7 retired in 2003 after 20 years of service...this includes state and federal taxes + SBP, which is an optional insurance for the surviving spouse should the member die. It then pays the surviving spouse 55% of the members’ retirement pay, before taxes.
Every member’s status is unique, but many are similar enough to use as an example if comparing apples to apples...
Wise words and advice, I will suffer fools to a point, but I cannot and will not suffer liars.
Omitting relevant and key information/facts is a lie, a lie of ommission.
Hold On ... Asking for review. Spit!!!
Ryan has always been one who speaks with fancy fast words that he swears amount to great intellectual victory and in fact are just kick the damn can down the road. His original budget took like 20 years to balance the budget.
If this bill passes the Senate with Republican support I swear I will be their enemy.
This is how Ryan says thank you for putting him on the ticket. I got a new ticket for him.
all these gyrations to save maybe 23 billion over TEN years. Smoke and Mirrors redux. If this passes the Senate with GOP support I will be a sworn enemy of the GOP.
Please consider that a lot of soldiers who retire in their early 40s have worn out skeletons. The military is not a gentle occupation.
Taking from retired military is a poor start at balancing the budget. Kick yourself in the pants for not serving 20 years so you could get the early pension, but don’t kick the soldiers.
IIRC, only around 7% of military stay in till retirement.
How many of those are combat arms?
If you’re retired military, don’t retire in MN.
We’re one of the few states that tax retired military pensions.
20 YEARS IS WHAT?
When someone is shooting at you, 20 years is not anything but LUCKY YOU SURVIVED!
This budget gives money to Illegals but cuts it from Veterans for what.......23 billion cut maybe in ten years maybe? OH wait, it stops a GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN.
You know what else stops a Government Shutdown? STANDING UP AND NOT GIVING UP AND EVENTUALLY THAT SCUMBAG ODUMBI WILL GIVE UP AND OPEN THE GOVERNMENT UP.
All you have to do is explain to the American People what will happen if we don’t stop the wild spending, the wild printing of money.....WE WON’T HAVE A GOVERNMENT TO SHUT DOWN.
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