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To: wardaddy; lonestar; Pelham; nathanbedford; GeronL
Wardaddy:

You pinged me, I assume for a comment.

While I do not claim to be a theologian, I have frequently quoted the Bible in response to the contrived issues on such oxymorons as "same sex marriage," the efforts to force the Boy Scouts to accept men who reject traditional male behavior as male role models, and other ridiculous examples of the asexual assault on normal human sex roles.

I think the theological emphasis in this particular thread is quite proper, because of the way in which RG3 framed his remarks. However, I certainly agree with your point that one does not have to be sexually pure to rightfully disdain socially destructive behavior on moral grounds.

That said, I would add this. The case against the flaunting of what I describe as "asexual behavior," which would include not only the muscular exercises that homosexuals may engage in, in place of physical involvement with the opposite sex, but the Feminist attack on all things truly feminine, while certainly an immense moral issue, is also an immensely important secular issue as well.

In a healthy society, the goal of the teenaged boy to be an honorable & chivalric man, to be worthy of the love of a lovely young woman; as the goal of a well brought up teenaged girl, to be a model of honorable femininity, to someday be the loyal & supportive wife of an honorable & chivalric man, are the stuff that brings out the best--the societal best--in each sex. Is this really debatable? Does anyone, regardless of theology or lack of theology, really have a rational argument for encouraging what is going on right now, where the romantic ideal of civilized peoples throughout history is being openly trashed in the schools, in the media & in entertainment; even by a "President" who proclaims a second tier athlete who "came out of the closet" his hero, twice in one week?

RG3 is a natural athlete; but neither a philosopher, theologian, or public spokesman. He may be forgiven for a half thought out comment. President Obama? Hardly!

William Flax

261 posted on 08/17/2013 10:23:01 AM PDT by Ohioan
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To: Ohioan; wardaddy; lonestar; Pelham; GeronL
I endorse everything that William flax said in his reply #261.

We should consider that this is first a political forum, albeit a conservative political forum, and that implies that we should think about the political implications of these matters.

In other words do we make politics out of culture? Do we try to impose our cultural views, in this case our religious views concerning sex, on the culture by way of enacting laws?

I'm not sure what we have been doing works, indeed, it might even be counterproductive. The apostles of the Frankfurt School set about to undermine the culture which upheld the political system against the onslaught of communism. Particularly, they sought to undermine the family, the role of the father, impose militant feminism, advanced recreational sex, promote abortion-in short promote everything which undermines faith and ultimately the political structure.

In doing so they align themselves in the eyes of the youth with enlightened attitudes about sex. Conservatives naturally resist these overtures and in the eyes of youth they are regarded as Puritans intruding themselves into the privacy of the bedroom.

This is a battle we are losing. Justice in our cause, logic of our arguments, prudence of a righteous lifestyle and the imprudence of a profligate lifestyle, all have little impact on these young voters. Think Sandra Fluke.

The point is that we have to decide where we want the criminal law to intervene and where we must let culture take its course. I have long advocated that the test should be the existence or absence of an identifiable victim. Thus, living in Germany and having seen legalized, prostitution and having compared with what I saw in America, I conclude that the German system works better. On the other hand, I am unalterably opposed to abortion because of the undeniable reality of a victim, and a helpless victim at that.

Applying this rule across the board might, repeat "might," just improve our chances at the polling booths and in the long run have a more salubrious effect on the culture than the losing battle we are currently waging.

The apostles of The Frankfurt School knew that they must change politics by changing culture from the bottom up. We conservatives who, if nothing else believe in the primacy of the individual, have somehow sought to control the culture from the top down by the enactment of criminal laws. Perhaps we should rethink the political implications of our faith and learn to draw a distinction between what we attempt to achieve in our lives and through our influence and what we try to impose through the criminal law.


262 posted on 08/17/2013 11:19:02 AM PDT by nathanbedford ("Attack, repeat, attack!" Bull Halsey)
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