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Would the U.S. Still Lose the Naval War of 2015?
Real Clear Defense ^ | July 2, 2013 | Harry Kazianis

Posted on 07/08/2013 1:48:59 PM PDT by neverdem

Over the last few days I have begun the exhausting, yet wonderful process of moving. Considering the fact I have not moved in twelve years and I am relocating from a suburban single-family home to a small apartment urban setting in Washington D.C. I have some tough decisions to make on what to keep and what to trash.

In going through my endless collection of foreign policy, national security and defense articles (I print everything) I found quite the gem that needless to say made the save box. Instead of cleaning out our soon-to-be former home, I decided to take a small break (please don't tell my wife) and travel down memory lane.

The article in question is one you may know. From the Winter 2010 edition of Orbis, James Kraska's "How the United States Lost the Naval War of 2015" was always a piece that I have gone back to over and over again. In fact, the article was one that sparked my interest in anti-access/area-denial (A2/AD) and the DF-21D. Several years back, myself and fellow CSIS:PACNET WSD Handa scholar Daryl Morini had planned to write a follow-up piece -- but alas -- other projects always seemed to get in the way (I am still willing if you are my friend!).

The article creates a fictional scenario where China "sinks" a U.S. carrier. The scenario itself is rather, well, interesting:

"Americans woke up to a different world the day after the attack. The war was over almost as soon as it had started. Outmaneuvered tactically and strategically, the United States suffered its greatest defeat at sea since Pearl Harbor. The incident—could it really be called a 'war'?—had been preceded by a shallow diplomatic crisis between the two great powers. No one in the West expected the dispute to..."...

(Excerpt) Read more at realcleardefense.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Politics/Elections; US: District of Columbia
KEYWORDS: china
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To: BwanaNdege

How many of those skippers will be in place because they are female, black, or homosexual (Affirmative Action placements) and not because of years of proven service?


21 posted on 07/08/2013 2:20:49 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Inside every liberal and WOD defender is a totalitarian screaming to get out.)
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To: neverdem

We would back down and Taiwan would be lost within a week....

We need to untie Japan’s hands and Taiwan’s hands because another Obama will sink both of them by lack of strength....


22 posted on 07/08/2013 2:20:55 PM PDT by GraceG
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To: neverdem

‘In 1996, at the end of the Third Taiwan Strait
Crisis, PLA General Xiong Guangkai warned a visiting U.S. envoy, ‘‘. . . you care more about Los Angeles than you do about Taipei.’’’

Yeah, and they care more about Peking than Taiwan...

The destruction of a carrier would call for the destruction of similar value military facilities of the attacker.
Nuclear war would be inevitable- unless a cowardly fool is in the White House ... I guess that’s why the author picked 2015 for the scenario.


23 posted on 07/08/2013 2:22:57 PM PDT by mrsmith (Dumb sluts: Lifeblood of the Media, Backbone of the Democrat Party!)
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To: papertyger

How about a fictional scenario where the Chinese launch an SLBM off Catalina Island prior to an economic summit...?

Oh SNAP!!!


24 posted on 07/08/2013 2:23:24 PM PDT by GraceG
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To: neverdem

I hate to say it, but it -is- a done deal!
Our ‘fearless Ferdinand’, displaying a loss of words over what is going on in Egypt, and the loss of his puppet Morsi, would be completely dumbstruck and mentally paralyzed, ESPECIALLY if it were the Chinese, to do the dirty!

We have also already lost this, because all the free-thinking, knowledgeable military leaders have been sacked, in psychological narcissistic fears of a military sacking of the President. (not bad to dream, though.)


25 posted on 07/08/2013 2:24:52 PM PDT by Terry L Smith
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To: null and void
Wars are lost in the White House and Congress.

Wars nowadays are lost on television, in the Media, just like Walter Cronkite summarizing the results of the Tet Offensive incorrectly and saying we could never win--when for all practical purposes the Viet Cong had just been eliminated as a major force in the war.

The White House and Congress may make the decisions which get us in a bind, but the media proclaim wars to be "unwinnable". Then the WH and Congress respond to the polls...

26 posted on 07/08/2013 2:28:58 PM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing)
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To: Sherman Logan

Where did you find the “not equal to” sign?


27 posted on 07/08/2013 2:31:54 PM PDT by neverdem (Register pressure cookers! /s)
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To: Jeff Head

Ping!


28 posted on 07/08/2013 2:33:57 PM PDT by Disambiguator
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To: neverdem
≠ just copy and paste it for the future
29 posted on 07/08/2013 2:36:26 PM PDT by George from New England (escaped CT in 2006, now living north of Tampa)
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To: USS Johnston

ping


30 posted on 07/08/2013 2:40:50 PM PDT by laplata (Liberals don't get it. Their minds have been stolen.)
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To: neverdem
Would the U.S. Still Lose the Naval War of 2015?

Yup.


31 posted on 07/08/2013 2:42:19 PM PDT by Yo-Yo
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To: neverdem
& # 8 8 0 0 ;

leave out the spaces

32 posted on 07/08/2013 2:49:12 PM PDT by reg45 (Barack 0bama: Implementing class warfare by having no class.)
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To: GraceG

We need to untie Japan’s hands and Taiwan’s hands because another Obama will sink both of them by lack of strength....


I am pretty sure Japan and Taiwan have already untied their own hands.


33 posted on 07/08/2013 2:50:38 PM PDT by laplata (Liberals don't get it. Their minds have been stolen.)
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To: George from New England; Sherman Logan
≠ just copy and paste it for the future

I'm looking for other symbols also, e.g. less than or equal to.

34 posted on 07/08/2013 2:56:31 PM PDT by neverdem (Register pressure cookers! /s)
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To: neverdem

The basic premise of the article is that the ChiComs are prepositioned to exploit, on humanitarian grounds, the sinking of a CVN by rescuing the surviving crew.

It neglects to consider the fact that a CVN doesn’t go anywhere without at least one (usually two) Aegis Cruisers, 2 or 3 Aegis Destroyers and a couple SSNs. THEY’D be the ones picking up the survivors ... and turning back (if not just blowing to hell and gone) any ‘rescue flotilla’ that suddenly appeared in the area offering to help.

There’d be MOUNTAINS of evidence showing the ChiCom culpability in the attack, from the moment the ballistic missile lit off.

The biggest misconception about a naval war with China is that the US would send one or more carriers on a “Charge of the Light Brigade” style sweep up through the Strait. Not a chance of that happening - the carrier(s) would provide supporting cover (CAP, offensive fighter sweeps, long-range SEAD) from well East of Taiwan while SSNs, SSGNs and strategic bombers (B-2s and B-52s with CALCMs) took the fight to the Chinese mainland and naval forces. The ChiComs could try to pop off some “guided” (as they claim) ballistic missiles at the carrier, but even if they had something that was actually capable of distinguishing a CVN AND accurately guiding onto a target maneuvering aggressively at 30kts, the missile would still have to run the Standard SM3 (ABM missile) gauntlet thrown up by the carrier’s Aegis escorts.

The only thing stopping the US from reducing the ChiComs to a land-based continental power (IOW, obliterating their navy) would be political restraint by the President ...


35 posted on 07/08/2013 2:59:17 PM PDT by tanknetter
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To: BwanaNdege

Did you know William Tell is a fictional character?

Useful as a metaphor, though.


36 posted on 07/08/2013 3:04:35 PM PDT by warchild9
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To: neverdem
The last time an Oriental power attacked our capital ships in the Pacific didn't work out real well for them.

That said, if a moron like Obama would be President he probably wouldn't do a thing about it.

37 posted on 07/08/2013 3:07:38 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: neverdem

Symbols in Word.

Had to open a Word document, insert the symbol and the copy and paste it into FR.


38 posted on 07/08/2013 3:10:36 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: neverdem

If the ChiComs are willing to use aircraft launched tactical nulear weapons, It would be an interesting time to be at sea.

If a war goes nuclear, it will do so first at sea.


39 posted on 07/08/2013 3:23:20 PM PDT by Citizen Tom Paine (An old sailor sends)
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To: Smokin' Joe

Yep. Next to the pure advocacy coverage given to 0bama from day one, the Tet lie is about the worst betrayal the press has ever committed against the American people.


40 posted on 07/08/2013 3:48:13 PM PDT by Trod Upon (Every penny given to film and TV media companies goes right into enemy coffers. Starve them out!)
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