[Tublecane]

One of the reasons, if not the main reason, the vast majority of citizens are immoral and don’t restrain themselves, if they in fact are, is because of social engineering by the government. You’re not going to solve it without taking away policies which create and support it. Then, when people are on their own, you can have a Great Awakening, or whatever.

I don’t think a person who doesn’t think people would be better on their own—that is, without nanny government—when they must be responsible or die, is actually a conservative. No matter how incapable the people appear at present of achieving anything beyond overriding or starving to death within a couple months.

[CitizenUSA]

There are some very small number of citizen who are incapable of taking care of themselves. They should be taken care of by private charitable organizations. Once you start down the path that it's government's responsibility to take care of the “needy,” there's no end of it. For one, government is incredibly inefficient. That's the nature of all bureaucracies. For another, it incentivizes need. Reward dependency and you'll get more of it.

Right now I don't see anyone seriously advocating for the elimination or drastic reduction in government enforced wealth redistribution. Too many people have too much at stake and really are dependent on maintaining the various programs. That means this ends only after it all comes crashing down. My goal is to prepare me and mine for that inevitable result.

[Responsibility2nd]

One of the reasons, if not the main reason, the vast majority of citizens are immoral and don’t restrain themselves, if they in fact are, is because of social engineering by the government. You’re not going to solve it without taking away policies which create and support it. Then, when people are on their own, you can have a Great Awakening, or whatever.

 

Yes. You nailed it on the point about social engineering. LBJ (our worst president ever) and his Great Society programs have done more damage to the US than anything else. But is that damage really fiscal? Sure. Billions and trillions spent in creating a Welfare State is fiscally wrong, but more than that - it is morally wrong. But yet.... libertarians continue to deny the need for morality in our government and so on we go.