Hollywood and the MSM created these monsters, and now Hollywood and the MSM will blame the tools, not the cultural wreckage they wrought. Let's turn the focus back around where it belongs.
Posted on 12/15/2012 7:57:59 AM PST by marktwain
Backers of laws that let pretty much all law-abiding carry concealed guns in public places often argue that these laws will sometimes enable people to stop mass shootings. Opponents occasionally ask: If that’s so, what examples can one give of civilians armed with guns stopping such shootings? Sometimes, I hear people asking if even one such example can be found, or saying that they haven’t heard even one such example.
Naturally, such examples will be rare, partly because mass shootings are rare, partly because many mass shootings happen in supposedly “gun-free” zones (such as schools, universities, or private property posted with a no-guns sign) in which gun carrying isn’t allowed, and partly for other reasons. Moreover, at least some examples are contested, because it might be unclear — as you’ll see below — whether the shooter had been planning to kill more people when he was stopped. But here are instances that I have seen, not counting killings stopped by people who were off-duty police officers (or police officers from other jurisdictions) at the time of the shooting.
1. In Pearl, Mississippi in 1997, 16-year-old Luke Woodham stabbed and bludgeoned to death his mother at home, then killed two students and injured seven at his high school. As he was leaving the school, he was stopped by Assistant Principal Joel Myrick, who had gone out to get a handgun from his car. I have seen sources that state that Woodham was on the way to Pearl Junior High School to continue shooting, though I couldn’t find any contemporaneous news articles that so state.
2. In Edinboro, Pennsylvania in 1996, 14-year-old Andrew Wurst shot and killed a teacher at a school dance, and shot and injured several other students. He had just left the dance hall, carrying his gun — possibly to attack more people, though the stories that I’ve seen are unclear — when he was confronted by the dance hall owner James Strand, who lived next door and kept a shotgun at home. It’s not clear whether Wurst was planning to kill others, would have gotten into a gun battle with the police, or would have otherwise killed more people had Strand not stopped him.
3. In Winnemucca, Nevada in 2008, Ernesto Villagomez killed two people and wounded two others in a bar filled with three hundred people. He was then shot and killed by a patron who was carrying a gun (and had a concealed carry license). It’s not clear whether Villagomez would have killed more people; the killings were apparently the result of a family feud, and I could see no information on whether Villagomez had more names on his list, nor could one tell whether he would have killed more people in trying to evade capture.
4. In Colorado Springs in 2007, Matthew Murray killed four people at a church. He was then shot several times by Jeanne Assam, a church member, volunteer security guard, and former police officer (she had been dismissed by a police department 10 years before, and to my knowledge hadn’t worked as a police officer since). Murray, knocked down and badly wounded, killed himself; it is again not clear whether he would have killed more people had he not been wounded, but my guess is that he would have.
So it appears that civilians armed with guns are sometimes willing to intervene to stop someone who had just committed a mass shooting in public. In what fraction of mass shootings would such interventions happen, if gun possession were allowed in the places where the shootings happen? We don’t know. In what fraction would interventions prevent more killings and injuries, as opposed to capturing or killing the murderer after he’s already done? We don’t know. In what fraction would interventions lead to more injuries to bystanders? Again, we don’t know. Finally, always keep in mind that mass shootings in public places should not be the main focus in the gun debate, whether for gun control or gun decontrol: They on average account for much less than 1% of all homicides in the U.S., and are unusually hard to stop through gun control laws (since the killer is bent on committing a publicly visible murder and is thus unlikely to be much deterred by gun control law, or by the prospect of encountering an armed bystander).
Still, people have asked for examples of some shootings in which a civilian armed with a gun intervened and brought down the shooter — so here they are.
Of course, when a mass shooting is stopped by an armed citizen, there are not as many victims. Critics can always claim that it is then not a "real" mass shooting.
Hollywood and the MSM created these monsters, and now Hollywood and the MSM will blame the tools, not the cultural wreckage they wrought. Let's turn the focus back around where it belongs.
Seems like there was one at a Georgia college (Law school maybe) some years ago where someone went to his car and got a gun and killed a potential mass killer.
Thanks for posting!
I have tried, lately, to remind people of what happened in Kennesaw when they *mandated* a firearm in every household.
An *immediate* drop in violent crime of more than 85%.
Entertainment has a way of coaxing the lowest common denominator out of people, but again people also have the ability to refuse entertainment It takes two to do that tango.
I don’t buy the games and movies angle by themselves. You or I wouldn’t behave any differently after playing thousands of hours of violent games.
Now combine them with liberal indoctrination coming from the schools where “reality” has become a subjective concept and you have a recipe for disaster.
Its also important to note that our parents probably didn’t allow us to watch very violent movies or play the games. We were expected to make those decisions for ourselves as adults.
At a local high school, an armed deputy shot an armed would be intruder stopped at the restricted entry point
Yahoo has this story on their site saying that a motive has not been found for the killings.
Crazy people don’t need motives. They make one up in thier crazed minds.
And Kennesaw really was only a “strong suggestion.” It was easy to opt out as conscientious objector. Anyhow, robbers felt it wise to move on to easier pickings.
I think you can up your confidence level on #4.
The guy shot a couple of people in the parking lot and was stopped by being shot on his way into the church.
What do you think he was planning to do in there? Pray for forgiveness?
A well-placed shot at the head of a crazy artist from Austria would have stopped a mass murder.
But then again, he made sure there were strict gun laws in place to protect his sorry....uh protect the children. Yeah, that’s what it was!
The same MSM that would scream “hate” in a new york millisecond.
Travis, where is that cartoon drawing showing the dead laying around, where guns are bad? I need it for my facebook page, thanks.
Islamic terrorists are already seeing a prime opportunity here, this school shooting was one person, terrorists will no doubt plan on several dozen school shootings across America.
All they need is a political map to see where schools are in a blue zone.
Either take your kids out of school or arm the school, no middle ground allowed here. Evil has struck and is about to strike again.
Mr. Hitler and Austria — it took two to tango.
Yep. While the population doubled, too.
There is something else that has changed the culture. They don’t lock up crazy people. The do-gooders claimed that these people would be okay on the streets if they would just take their medications. Well, they don’t usually take their medications because they think they are okay without the drugs.
Do you think the LCD will refuse the elixir or violent, cruel entertainment?
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