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To: Wuli

Perhaps not every instance is an intervention, but if you believe the Bible, you can see in Genesis 29:31 where it says, “When the LORD saw that Leah was not loved, he opened her womb, but Rachel was barren.”

Later on in Gen 30:1-2 it says, “When Rachel saw that she was not bearing Jacob any children, she became jealous of her sister. So she said to Jacob, “Give me children, or I’ll die!” Jacob became angry with her and said, “Am I in the place of God, who has kept you from having children?”

Scripture also says that the cast of every lot is determined by the Lord. In fact, that’s how the Israelites found out what the Lord wanted them to do: they used the urim and the thummin - stones for “yes” and “no”.

There is also Scripture which says that in all things G-d is working for the good of those who love Him, who are called according to His purposes.

I just see all over Scripture where the details of life are held in the Lord’s hands. The story that soonest comes to mind is Joseph who, after he met up with his brothers, consoled them by saying that though they had put him in the dry well and sold him in Egypt in order to harm him, G-d had meant it for good. So even though Joseph’s brothers made their own choices, G-d used those bad choices to bring about some greater good.

And some of His purposes are mentioned in Scripture too. For instance, we are told that we are comforted in our sorrows so that we will be able to comfort others with the same comfort we have received. I have thought of that many, many times as I realize how the loss of 2 children has shaped me to be able to minister to others who have experienced loss.

Mary conceived without any sperm. Her cousin Elizbeth at the same time conceived even though she was beyond child-bearing years. Both children were miraculous, though one was through “natural” means of conception and the other impossible in nature. Nothing is impossible with Him.

We have no way of knowing or proving which instances are interventions and which not, but I see in Scripture that G-d is involved in even very small details in our lives, and sometimes what seems terrible to us is part of a bigger plan.

The Lord didn’t force Judas to betray Jesus. It was Judas’ decision to do so. But G-d did foresee it and did cause the greatest good in the whole history of the world to come as a result of Judas’ sin.

There is no human being who can diminish our real human dignity and worth. No human being who has the power to destroy our life. Nobody can do to us anything except what the Lord allows. It’s usually not what He WANTS, but He and His grace can handle whatever bad comes to us in life. We are crushed but never in despair. If we think that a rapist can defeat or diminish us, we misunderstand who man is and we misunderstand who G-d is. That’s why Jesus said in the beatitudes that the people who are perceived as low and trampled are actually blessed. We’ve been given a greater gift that nobody can take away just by raping us, killing us, or stealing from us.

That’s really a message of joy. Why would anybody not want to know that they are not alone and that G-d makes good even when others give us bad?


79 posted on 10/24/2012 2:32:46 PM PDT by butterdezillion
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To: butterdezillion

Excellent defense of the truth. Very, very well put. I was going to post the very same examples, but you beat me to it.

Samuel’s mother was another incident that points to God opening the womb of a barren woman.

And how can I forget the way the good Lord opened the wombs of the Egyptian mid wife’s who refused to kill the newborn Israelite babies.


81 posted on 10/24/2012 2:39:55 PM PDT by OneVike (I'm just a Christian waiting to go home)
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To: butterdezillion

“Perhaps not every instance is an intervention, but if you believe the Bible”

that’s where we sort of agree

but “we”, and the lives we are talking about are not, Leah, or Rachel, or Jacob, or Joseph, or Mary, or Elizabeth,

and yes, we are “comforted in our sorrows so that we will be able to comfort others with the same comfort we have received” - I said as much, but I also said that is based on our faith that G-d can provide those things for us.

“I realize how the loss of 2 children has shaped me to be able to minister to others who have experienced loss”

I believe it is your faith that has allowed you to use your loss that way, and it comes from your faith, not the loss itself, for by the same faith, the same relationship with G-d others have and do can come to the same understanding by which they provide the same comfort to others in these circumstances. Did G-d have a role in that? Yes, because you had a faith that was open to G-d helping you.

“We have no way of knowing or proving which instances are interventions and which not”

bingo, that’s what I said

“sometimes what seems terrible to us is part of a bigger plan”

and sometimes it’s just ‘cause sh&^%$t happens

“There is no human being who can diminish our real human dignity and worth. No human being who has the power to destroy our life. Nobody can do to us anything except what the Lord allows. It’s usually not what He WANTS”

no people can murder us, or worse, and it has nothing to do with what G-d “wants” or what G-d “allows”, sometimes sh&*^%$t happens

and where IS G-d - He is there for us, always, even when sh&^%t happens, even when sh%^$#t happens He CAN provide comfort, strength and peace, but providing all that for us is not necessarily saying he “wanted” or “allowed” it to happen


86 posted on 10/24/2012 4:54:12 PM PDT by Wuli
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