Posted on 08/26/2012 6:32:13 AM PDT by Zakeet
It's official. The New York Police Department have admitted that all nine people wounded yesterday in the Empire State Building shootout were from bullets they fired at Jeffrey Johnson.
CNN's David Ariosto reports the NYPD said the two officers that confronted Johnson fired a total of 16 shots. "One officer shot nine while another one shot seven," they said. Police commissioner Ray Kelly explained the injured bystanders were hit by ricocheting bullets. The shots hit "flowerpots and other objects around, so ... their bullets fragmented and, in essence, that's what caused the wounds."
[Snip]
The next question the NYPD will have to answer is why the two officers needed to fire 16 bullets to take down one man who, as we can see in the video, was only a few feet away from them.
(Excerpt) Read more at theatlanticwire.com ...
You failed to mention the three innocent citizens who got shot directly. THat means they could have killed 3 innocents while killing 1 perp.
Why is it so easy for you to blow off the shooting off the bystanders?
The community here is telling you that police need to do better. It may be difficult. If the current officers can’t handle the difficulty, we need to train them or remove them and get some who can handle it. That’s what happens in other professions.
Don’t tell me it can’t be done when it is being done by our soldiers.
And the NYPD is not the finest police department in the world. That’s utter non-sense.
There were fewer than 10 hits. Some of the perp's wounds were exit wounds, which leads to the problem: ball ammo. Over penetrates, exits the target, and by the time he realizes he's been hit, the cops have fired another dozen rounds in his general direction.
Jacketed Hollow Point was what they needed.
Because they can.
Why would anyone want to live/work in New York
Little mikey is an arrogant 1%er who has no bal*s and is led around by is wife who wears the pants.
But then again the people who live in New York elected this moron, so I suppose you have to live with him.
Go luck with your choice.
Because they got hit. But that’s not important right now.
No vital organs hit...
I suspect that most of the arm chair critics have never even been to Mid-town Manhattan at 9:00 am on a work day. There were probably more people within a hundred yards of the shooter than than the total number of people who live in the little towns and villages where these critics reside.
With that said, I know several NYC cops, and I'm willing ot bet that I spend more time at the range in a month than they spend in a year.
I don’t think the cops were really prepared to face this situation. Two or Three bystanders but Nine is a disaster. Bloomberg has not been helping anything with his crazy statements of late. Most if this backlash is not against the NYPD but Bloomberg.
Yeah, not only that, the cops weren't even trying to shoot anybody, they were just cleaning their guns and they went off.
What is stupid is your post.
“You discharge 9 shots.”
What the hell for?
You cant place one shot from 8 feet away?
If I were mayor the first thing I would do is require
monthly range qualification.
Rule number 1.
DO NOT shoot the bystanders.
They can't have it both ways.
If the bullets fragmented, they are not ball ammunition and thus, no wounds from over penetration, and even ricochets are unlikely.
Ergo...bystanders were shot by police "spraying and praying."
What would you do, shoot us for not swallowing bullcrap?
I watched the video. Looks like they called him out from several yards away. He drew his pistol from a bag, but he didn't point it at them immediately. I suspect he was looking for suicide-by-cop.
They probably could have just walked right up to him without calling him out and taken care of it one way or another without increased risk to the bystanders. I suspect poor judgement influenced the outcome. And yes, it is a judgement call, and yes, the police are responsible for having good judgement. Especially in a place like New York which is effectively a no-self-defense zone.
Here’s one:
http://distilleryimage2.s3.amazonaws.com/187c21846ccb11e1989612313815112c_7.jpg
LOL. I want one! My Kimber 1911s suck compared to that!
I agree - a Type 3 Malfunction could be described as “two rounds in the chamber”. He probably wasn’t trained well enough to know what to do to clear it. Glocks will do it too, BTW: http://thegunzone.com/glock/phase3.html
Anyone have a link to the video footage of the cops’ performance during this mayhem? Certainly sounds like the sort of thing I would expect from them.
Does that numbskull want to weigh in who - on a thread a few days ago - was making the case the the gov needed billions of rounds of hollow point ammo to train because “you train with the ammo you carry”. If these guys trained at all, it sure sounds like the exact type of ammo had little to do with their performance under pressure. Page 3 on this link presents some thoughts on the inherent realities: http://www.firearmstactical.com/pdf/fbi-hwfe.pdf
Another good one: http://www.gunthorp.com/What%20happens%20in%20a%20gunfight.htm
http://www.dudeiwantthat.com/gear/weapons/double-barrel-pistol.asp
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Sweet! I think the two cops were simply following Mayor Bloomberg’s new rules of engagement.
1. See perp
2. Draw sidearm using your dominant hand
3. Point sidearm in the general direction of the perp
4. Using your non-dominant hand cover your eyes so the real-time sight of the effects of your shooting will not psychologically damage you.
5. Using jerky hand/finger movements, quickly jerk the trigger repeatedly until your weapon is empty. Remember to keep your eyes sheltered.
6. Drop your non-dominant hand from your eyes and check out the damage.
I forgot where the “avoid 16 ounce sugary drinks when you visit convenience stores fits into the rules.
With all due respect to you, I find it hard to imagine many, or any police officers taking the job to be of service to the public...If you did, well 'good on ya'...
So what is the protocol??? At what point in a shooting are you guys instructed to quit firing??? Are you guys instructed to put as much lead downrange as possible in the shortest amount of time in hopes that some or most of the lead will hit and disable the target???
When you are in a hole stop digging. You have confused my criticism of what lead up to gun fight with the gunfight. But I do criticize your inability to think clearly. My post is in black and white before you, you had as much time as you needed to comprehend it or have someone explain to you, yet you became befuddled just as with the video evidence of the shooting in New York. If you were indeed on the street, I can imagine the creative incident reports you have written. Surely your time behind a desk was of value the citizens of New York.
Sigh.
The cop bashing was starting to feel like 16 plus nine bullets.
People do not get how crowded with pedestrians Manhattan is.
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