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Saddly; an awful lot of 'Americans' LIKE being slaves!
Posted on 05/06/2012 8:09:35 AM PDT by Seizethecarp
“I donated and sent a check in already ...this site can be very aggravating but what are we to do?...really..its that important...”
Thank you very much!
IMO, Obama loathes and wants to effectively replace the influence of all forms of religion with the power of the global socialist state...while the shameless chameleon Romney, whatever his shortcomings, does NOT!
I view Romney as being a politician committed first to his election with marketing branding as a “conservative,” and if elected I expect that having no real core he will govern very conservatively to insure mid-term gains and re-election as a conservative without primary opposition.
I have NO expectation that Romney would revert to ANY of his previous liberal stances, especially on abortion or gay rights or the sort of liberal court appointments in MA. If Romney had core beliefs, he would revert, but from all I have learned about Romney on FR (Thanks Jim Rob!) Romney will do what is best for Romney, and that will be to continue to try to prove his conservative bona fides.
I expect him to go straight to the Federalist Society recommended list for his appointments to SCOTUS, while Obama will go to the ACLU and La Raza.
The title of the thread, in the limited space, was intended to convey that ABO FReepers had been called RINOs and dis-invited from FR, not that JR had been called a RINO...
“I can’t donate a lot, but I donated on my last payday and intend to again on my next payday since this FReepathon is going a bit long.”
Thank you very much!
You would have to ask JimRob, but I would expect a “No.”
Voting GOP against Obama because Obama is seen as far worse than Romney as a matter of conscience is not the same as “supporting Romney” and advocating for Romney as some kind of sincere conservative worthy of admiration are two different things.
I don't find relaxation of the ban on “support for Romney” in JR’s TRUCE declaration and I think he has already answered this before.
(Reposting my comment #50 which was totally ignored as to the religious flame wars):
The attacking has gone both ways between ABO and FUMR camps. I am not attacking the FUMR camp at all and never have. I respect the right of conscience of every citizen in making their vote.
The circular firing squad attacking of FReepers by FReepers, including JimRob himself, is requested to be suspended with a TRUCE being declared by JimRob at the linked thread. Some FReepers on this thread appear NOT to have read JR’s TRUCE declaration, yet.
To me, respecting the conscience of fellow FReepers includes NOT declaring my own ABO view to be the only Biblical view and NOT declaring the voting intentions of another FReeper to be a vote “for evil.”
I will vote for the candidate who will do the LEAST DAMAGE to what is left of my precious Republic!
I am voting AGAINST the ineligible Manchurian Marxist.
God will ultimately be the judge my vote, not fellow FReepers.
On this thread, I am inviting fellow ABO FReepers in particular to return to posting FReely on FR, as allowed now by JR, and also to return to DONATING.
Already the thread is getting hijacked into a religious flame war over whose vote and whose religion is most righteous. I intended this thread to be about bringing back ABO FReepers and getting DONATIONS up to include the needed equipment so that we all, both ABO and FUMR FReepers, can have the BEST Free Republic platform for this campaign.
Please take a moment today to consider making or increasing your DONATION to FR and consider going monthly! Please?
See post #856
I am annoyed by people who defend mormonism and know nothing about it but think they do.
I am annoyed by people who defend Romney even though he is a liberal just like BHO.
I am annoyed by people who do not understand the difference between exposing mormonism and mormons and thinking it means the same thing.
I am really annoyed by people who do not like tattoos (which had noting to do with this thread).
place marker
Peter 3:9
But He bears patiently with you, His desire being that no one should perish but that all should come to repentance.
HIS patience WILL reach a point...
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Saddly; an awful lot of 'Americans' LIKE being slaves!
Given NONE of that, because Mit Romney has STAYED in Mormonism since adulthood, evidently indicates that he has blindly accepted the teachings of Salt Lake City. THAT FACT bothers me. It shows he is a shallow thinker; not willing to dig into MORMONism, when the WORLD knows what it stands for; as you so easily pointed out.
Just like ObamaCare (We have to PASS this law to find out what is in it) MORMONism does NOT give up it's weirdness to a casual observer. One MUST go the the rituals to find OUT about the rituals; right MORMON convertees?
Those stolen and barely modified Masonic posturings are not SACRED, as MORMONism loves to claim; but SECRET!
If they WERE 'sacred', you could actually FIND them in the LDS scriptures. One will look there in vain.
Try to find the FULLNESS of the gospel in the Book of MORMON.
It's a fools errand.
2 But Samuel said, “How can I go? If Saul hears about it, he will kill me.”
The Lord said, “Take a heifer with you and say, ‘I have come to sacrifice to the Lord.’ 3 Invite Jesse to the sacrifice, and I will show you what to do. You are to anoint for me the one I indicate.”
4 Samuel did what the Lord said. When he arrived at Bethlehem, the elders of the town trembled when they met him. They asked, “Do you come in peace? ”
5 Samuel replied, “Yes, in peace; I have come to sacrifice to the Lord. Consecrate yourselves and come to the sacrifice with me.” Then he consecrated Jesse and his sons and invited them to the sacrifice.
6 When they arrived, Samuel saw Eliab and thought, “Surely the Lord’s anointed stands here before the Lord.”
7 But the Lord said to Samuel, “Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The Lord does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart.”
8 Then Jesse called Abinadab and had him pass in front of Samuel. But Samuel said, “The Lord has not chosen this one either.” 9 Jesse then had Shammah pass by, but Samuel said, “Nor has the Lord chosen this one.” 10 Jesse had seven of his sons pass before Samuel, but Samuel said to him, “The Lord has not chosen these.” 11 So he asked Jesse, “Are these all the sons you have?”
“There is still the youngest,” Jesse answered. “He is tending the sheep.”
Samuel said, “Send for him; we will not sit down until he arrives.”
12 So he sent for him and had him brought in. He was glowing with health and had a fine appearance and handsome features.
Then the Lord said, “Rise and anoint him; this is the one.”
13 So Samuel took the horn of oil and anointed him in the presence of his brothers, and from that day on the Spirit of the Lord came powerfully upon David. Samuel then went to Ramah.
Yes; let's wait until the convention before we do that!
5 posted on Sun May 06 2012 10:40:00 GMT-0500 (Central Daylight Time) by Seizethecarp: “Persons who believe that their religious beliefs are superior and who denounce others for their ABO view appear to be a tiny minority.”
38 posted on Sun May 06 2012 11:30:27 GMT-0500 (Central Daylight Time) by eastforker: My suggestion would be a policy of no bashing of any religion or lack there of. Attacking some ones faith is the same as a personal attack IMHO.”
I didn't notice this thread until late Monday night. I've waited overnight before responding, but I believe something simply **MUST** be said.
How did we go from
1) debating whether to tolerate those who want to vote for Mitt Romney as the lesser of two evils to
2) debating getting rid of alleged religious bigots?
All I see in Jim Robinson's truce is that he's decided to allow people to publicly say that “Anybody but Obama” is okay and that voting for Mitt Romney is the lesser of two evils.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Jim Robinson still thinks Romney is evil — just a lesser evil. Fair enough.
However, what some people are saying here is that we should stop criticizing Romney or even discussing religious issues. That goes **WAY** beyond anything Jim Robinson has said.
I believe the underlying issue for many of us is, as Graewoulf has said, that there's more than one type of “conservative.” Social issues conservatives are not always trying to “conserve” the same things as economic conservatives. Also, with regard to this specific thread, Eastforker admits in post 719 that he is an atheist, just not a “radical” one.
Here's what Jim Robinson has said: “As a conservative site, Free Republic is pro-God, pro-life, pro-family, pro-Constitution, pro-Bill of Rights, pro-gun, pro-limited government, pro-private property rights, pro-limited taxes, pro-capitalism, pro-national defense, pro-freedom, and-pro America.”
Being “pro-God” isn't the only thing on that list defining conservative, but it **IS** the first thing on the list.
Maybe that should tell us something?
More recently, post 1108, Jim Robinson wrote this: “When I first started FR, we immediately came under attack by atheists, trolls and malcontents, who in many cases attacked us on our religious beliefs, so when I established the first set of rules for forum conduct, I included ‘No religious bigotry.’ Didn’t realize at the time that I would’ve had to qualify that as ‘no anti-Christian bigotry’ but that’s the way it is. I am definitely biased toward God and Christianity. Obviously, I also support Israel, the Jewish people and the Jewish Nation.”
Free Republic is not an atheist site. Sounds to me like Christians and Jews are not the ones who need to be careful what they say around here.
I firmly believe that Mitt Romney belongs to a cult. Both traditional Roman Catholics and evangelical Protestants have to be committed to that same conclusion if they're faithful to their doctrinal statements. In other words, please don't ask me to compromise my beliefs about Romney's religion — Romney won't compromise his beliefs about mine, though he seems willing to compromise lots of other things to get elected.
Does that make me an anti-Mormon bigot? Not by any reasonable definition. I'm willing to vote for a conservative pro-life, pro-family, anti-abortion, anti-homosexual-marriage Mormon under certain circumstances, but there's no way I'm going to act as if Mormons are part of traditional Christianity. They aren't, and the Mormons themselves believe that the “sects” that constitute the rest of the professing Christian world are corrupt and that Mormonism alone has “restored” the truth of Christianity.
In dealing with Orthodox Judaism, I have the highest possible level of respect for my Jewish brothers and sisters and for the nation of Israel, but it would be simple blindness to deny fundamental differences. Israel is our ally and Jewish people deserve the apologies of the Christian world for our horrible and unbiblical history of persecuting Jews, but we cannot minimize the question of whether Jesus is the Messiah. That is the heart of the difference between Christianity and Judaism.
That difference is a thousand times more crucial for wicked religions such as Islam which actively seek to kill and destroy faithful Christians and Jews. I can work with Mormons who, when all is said and done, belong to a religion whose founders had good things to say about the United States Constitution, or with Jewish people whose ancestors valued the United States as a bastion of religious freedom far greater than what they found in Britain or almost all nations of Europe. Islam, by contrast, is inimical to the most basic principles of Western values, in both Judeo-Christian and secular liberal forms.
I'm perfectly willing to cooperate in the political realm with conservatives of any faith or no faith, but the fact remains that all religions are not equal. To admit that is not bigotry, but to deny that is blindness.
Being allied is not the same as being in agreement.
1) debating whether to tolerate those who want to vote for Mitt Romney as the lesser of two evils to
2) debating getting rid of alleged religious bigots?
It's called thread Hijacking.
I would also vote for a Mormon under these circumstances, although it would be with a great deal of hesitation. Nevertheless, this is a moot point as Romney IS NOT a conservative pro-life, pro-family, anti-abortion, anti-homosexual-marriage Mormon and to pretend otherwise would be an insult to the Mormons who actually are.
You have to use the tools at your disposal to advance politically.
The only tool we have to possibly advance a conservative agenda is Romney.
That we are left with Romney is a whole discussion in and of itself, but are we going to use the tool or not?
Many at FR are stating they will not vote for Romney - that is fine, but it misses the fundamental issue at hand - the time to go full bore against the GOP establishment was in 2008. Conservatives didn’t do it effectively for 3-1/2 solid years.
To claim a principled political stand when there is no viable candidate to articulate those principles is simply self-aggrandizement and self-back-patting - in abundant supply here by folks here. “Look at me, I’ve got pure principles” - No, the time for 2012 was 3 years ago. The time for 2016 is now.
If FR is influential as it once was, why are we in this predicament? Will FR be influential for the 2016 race - or the 2014 midterms? Not if FR takes itself out of the presidential race debate in 2012.
Use the leaky bucket to bail out the boat when you don’t have any other bucket. To claim purity of principle by refusing to bail out the boat at all, even with a leaky bucket, is fine, but the boat will certainly sink.
Politics is not a place for purity of principle in the best of times. It would be nice if it was, but it never has been. Right now conservatives aren’t getting much of anything. Unseat Obama with the tool we have, and maybe we’ll get something. Don’t unseat Obama and we get nothing.
Whatever. FR will continue to be a source of news for me... as for the rest, I plan to detoxify. Vaya con Dios.
There’s actually another way to look at it which is to understand that right now, we have in the whitehouse a muslim usurper whose goal in life appears to be taking this country down, and Mitt Romney is basically the only shot we have at putting an end to that.
Once more, my apologies. My call didn’t end until after 1 AM my time and I went straight to bed (with a massive headache - logic and consistancy was not a huge part of the discussion! Add to that having to shout to be heard - the guy refused to turn down his music and you can imagine how I felt at the end of it!)
Let me grab a cup of tea, see if I can evolve to vaguely human and I will answer properly.
Hey! What are you doing on this thread making sense?
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And thanks for the coherent, well thought out and expressed evaluation of the situation.
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