Tennessee family home burns while firefighters watch

Yahoo! News ^ | Dec. 6, 2011

[Free ThinkerNY]

A Tennessee couple helplessly watched their home burn to the ground, along with all of their possessions, because they did not pay a $75 annual fee to the local fire department.

Vicky Bell told the NBC affiliate WPSD-TV that she called 911 when her mobile home in Obion County caught fire. Firefighters arrived on the scene but as the fire raged, they simply stood by and did nothing. "In an emergency, the first thing you think of, 'Call 9-1-1," homeowner Bell said.

However, Bell and her husband were forced to walk into the burning home in an attempt to retrieve their own belongings. "You could look out my mom's trailer and see the trucks sitting at a distance," Bell said. "We just wished we could've gotten more out."

South Fulton Mayor David Crocker defended the fire department, saying that if firefighters responded to non-subscribers, no one would have an incentive to pay the fee.

Residents in the city of South Fulton receive the service automatically, but it is not extended to those living in the greater county-wide area.

[sand lake bar]

Irrelevant. Just like I can’t imagine doctors refusing to render emergency aid to people who hadn’t paid their bill, I can’t imagine firefighters refusing to put out a house fire.

[1rudeboy]

Corporations that were made successful here turned their back on the USA. We needed leaders who were true patriots and instead we got traitors with flag pins who failed to defend our economy and enforce fair trade. They are losers from both sides of the aisle. We needed tariffs and they gave them our free markets.

Apart from the facts that a corporation was not involved in this case, and nor were people with lapel-pins; nor was anyone trying to "defend" the economy, nor "fair trade;" nor would tariffs have helped, and the free market worked in this case . . . you have a point.

[cva66snipe]

They do an often thankless job that's for certain. My county has a county ran ambulance service. All things considered including remote areas they do a good job.

One local VFD puts their lives at risk on Halloween. I won't name the community but I've heard these guys get blocked in by cut down trees, burring tires, morons who want to fight them for putting out house or barn fires, you name it.

[listenhillary]

I think government should force people to buy Chevy volts and health insurance, and flood insurance and life insurance and tornado insurance and earthquake insurance and hurricane insurance and termite insurance and random acts of god insurance.

That way we would save tax dollars and be saved reading stories by Freepers that are closet Statists.

[1rudeboy]

Just like I can’t imagine doctors refusing to render emergency aid to people who hadn’t paid their bill, I can’t imagine firefighters refusing to put out a house fire.

And that is the nut of it. If you know they'll put your house fire out for free, what sort of an idiot would pay the $75? Zuccotti Park, here we come!

[GOPJ]

I suppose they expect to be able to buy car insurance after they wreck their car, too?

I could save if I only had to pay for flood insurance in years it actually flooded. Same with life insurance... get a million dollar policy and only pay for it the day before death. Works for me.../s

[fatboy]

I’m not as a rule this blunt but NoGrayZone, you must be a different kind of stupid. Volunteer firefighters simply means the labor is provided by unpaid firefighters. They still have to have the several millions of dollars of shinny red stuff and 100s of hours of training and a place to house all their stuff. Someone has to pay for this.

You know stupid, not sure about this fire but the one in 2010 involving this same fire dept., the trailer was actually in a different state than the fire dept. Question? Do you pay local taxes for out of state services? No one does. Maybe you should learn something about fire districts and the costs of running a fire department.

I’m a volunteer fire fighter in PA. I don’t get one cent for my efforts although I have all kinds of state and national certifications and a ton of training. I’m also a volunteer EMT. Last January, while on a volunteer ambulance call, I slipped on the ice and broke my left tibia and fibula. I now have a plate, seven screws and a pin in my left lower leg.

Question? Who do you think paid for all that medical and loss of work from my regular job and all the therapy?

Answer: Although I’m a volunteer, the township (or fire district) by law maintains workmans comp insurance for volunteeers. Fire fighting is very dangerous. One of my fellow firefighters fell through the foor of a trailer and has an almost identical tib/fib fracture with internal fixation as mine. If my fire district did not maintain the insurance via tax payer funding we would both be basically screwed.

We cannot train with the state fire academy or through the BCCC without being a member of a fire company and infact we just submitted paperwork to Harrisburg to get water rescue certified and they insisted on knowing who our workmans comp provider is and the policy number before processing our volunteer labor water rescue team application.

The local government is responsible for providing fire protection. The problem is that the unincorporated area where this fire happened does not provide fire protection. They could contract it to a willing fire company or organize their own but they haven’t done so. The awful out-of-county fire dept out of the goodness of their heart offers a subscription service to those who want it. Those who don’t take advantage of it are SOL if their place catches fire. It is really just that simple.

Imagine how you would feel if you lived in the city, pay a fire tax to the dept that offers a subscription service to the rural out-area and your place catches fire. You dial 911 but no response because your tax funded fire dept is out in east bum fu** putting our mrs. too cheap to pay $75.00 per year to protect her single wide and can’t get to your fire for at least 2 hours. Or your 17 year old daughter get’s T-Boned by some hippy in a Dodge Powerwagon and the fire dept can’t cut her out of her car because they are too busy chaising their tails out of district for a person that has no financial investment in your fire department?

Answer those questions and I might applogize for calling you stupid, probably not, but maybe.

[abigailsmybaby]

It’s a real sobering kick in the pants. The idea that voting can make a difference is becoming laughable.

[cva66snipe]

You make a great point about the first fire. South Fulton is in Tennessee and Fulton is in Kentucky. I'm in East Tennessee and this was west Tennessee I think but I do know where South Fulton is.

In Tennessee most VFD {VFD was not the case here though} have mutual aid assist agreements even crossing county lines. If my home was on fire there is a good chance a pumper from a neighboring VFD would be dispatched as well.

[TN4Liberty]

Please someone tell me that they wouldn’t have just sat outside and watched the house burn with a family inside.

I'm not in this county, but grew up with a private subscription fire service. The county couldn't afford to provide it and the private sector offered a cost effective solution for families who needed it. Reduction in homeowners insurance more than covered the dues. At that time, the FD would intervene in a fire if there was a life at stake without question. If the only threat was to property, they would come but not intervene. Even if you are there, it is still costly to fight a fire.

Liberals say that the government has to run Social Security because people are too stupid and undisciplined to save for themselves. Reading comments from conservatives on this thread, I fear the libs may be right. Kind of sad.

[Washi]

You're right.

My mistake.

[Responsibility2nd]

I’m a volunteer fire fighter in PA. I don’t get one cent for my efforts although I have all kinds of state and national certifications and a ton of training. I’m also a volunteer EMT. Last January, while on a volunteer ambulance call, I slipped on the ice and broke my left tibia and fibula. I now have a plate, seven screws and a pin in my left lower leg.

Question? Who do you think paid for all that medical and loss of work from my regular job and all the therapy?

Answer: Although I’m a volunteer, the township (or fire district) by law maintains workmans comp insurance for volunteeers.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

God Bless you fatboy. YOU are a hero.

Now I may be assuming here. But lets assume you and your fellow heroes do something UNAUTHORIZED. Like - say - put out a fire outside your jurisdcition which is in violation of your insurance regs. You put out the fire - your departments insurance liability is canceled.

What good does that do anyone?

Or - you put out that fire and you lose certifications. Again - how does that help?

And all because some idiot is too cheap to pay $75.00?

[Gene Eric]

An incident like this was reported some time ago. I wonder if the story is being recycled.

>> Would have been smarter to put out the fire and bill them $5,000 for the service. Somebody isn’t thinking.

I think somebody is calculating.

[Mike Darancette]

If the fire department gets 1 penny in public money they should be sued.

[turn_to]

Do firefighters take an oath, like the military does with the ‘Oath of Enlistment’? As others have stated, they should of put out the fire and billed them later, with a penalty charge.

[BOBWADE]

Twenty years ago our community was outside of the city limits and the local volunteer fire dept had yearly dues. The membership fee was offset by the reduction in insurance coverage so it was a push. However the mailings and other personal contacts clearly informed the homeowner that the sole purpose of their response if you were not a paid member was to protect life or the nearby home of a paid up member. They would watch a fire destroy a home and would only intervene if there was a potential victim. That was the policy until a tax referendum allowed for public funding and now all residents are served in the event of a fire.

[IslamE]

Here in Pima County, Tucson, and Marana, taxpayers are flipping the bill for grand new fire department resorts on every corner. Just up the road they recently renovated a beautiful home into a wonderful, new fire department location; however, that was not satisfactory for the firefighters, so they constructed a brand new facility for them shortly after renovating the house. It’s a shame more firefighters were volunteers, but that would mean they’d have to put down the xbox controller, refrain from cleaning their fire trucks, couldn’t workout all the time, couldn’t drive their huge trucks to the nearest fender bender, or meet up with other departments for a two hour lunch.

[re_nortex]

That's right, and if ya don't happen to have the cash, we'll sit around and watch your stinking home burn to the ground.

We communicated a few times in the past and I think you know that I'm fairly reasonable, non-argumentative and don't engage in name-calling or personal attacks. As an analytical kind of guy, I'm not wedded to one way of looking at things. As the data emerges, I evaluate it and, if necessary, alter my opinion.

Since I'm open-minded, what are the Conservative arguments that can be made for the fire department to have behaved differently give the circumstances as we know them?

[JustaDumbBlonde]

"If they didn’t pay their fee charge them $1000. If they saved their house I’m sure they’d be glad to pay. Waste of everyone’s time and money."

If they wouldn't pay $75, what makes you think they'd pay $1000? Billl them and they don't pay ... what do you do? Come out and put out another fire next time for which they didn't subscribe?

There was no waste of time and money, if a subscriber's property next door was not burned down by an errant flame or spark.

[fatboy]

cva66snipe, thank you. I wrote some strong words but it’s about personal responsibility. No volly fire fighter wants to watch a fire, we want to put it out. In the case of a entrapment, I’m certain a rescue would be attempted regardless of the financial agreeent or lack thereof.

You mention mutual aid. These are actual agreements between fire districts or local governments. The purpose is to leagally cover the fire company in case of accident or loss. Without a mutual aid agreement there is no legal responsibility on the part of the homeowner if a fire fighter gets killed or a truck damaged.

In the fire service there is a rule of thumb, it goes: Risk Much to Save Much, Risk Little to Save Little. In EMS, it is: The Most Important Person on an Ambulance Call is Me. When I broke my foot, I was of no further use to the patient and a liability to the rest of my crew. As a general statement, a trailer fire out of district falls into the risk little catagory. A fully involved structure fire has temperatures of approx 2000 degrees. No living thing is alive in that environment. I reciently participated in a demo, a gas fed kitchen simulator that had a temperature of 1350 degrees. With full bunkers and on air I thought I was going to die, no kidding.

I cannot tell you how many times I have been to dwelling fires where the renter had no homeowners insurance. They cry to us asking what can we do for them to replace their stuff. Renters insurance is like $100.00 per year.

One other thing, a city fire dept generally relies on hydrants for a water supply. Out in the country where I live, no hydrants. We have 1000 gallons in engine 411, 500 gallons in engine 451 (with CAFS system) and 2100 gallons in tanker 431. Rural fire compnies have to always think about water, how much they have and where they can get some more. The nearest pond or hydrant may be 5 miles away.