Posted on 11/10/2011 8:17:29 AM PST by greyfoxx39
Mark Halperin called it the most important debate moment of Wednesday nights CNBC debate. No it wasnt Rick Perrys brain lapse but instead, Mitt Romneys attempt to re-frame the debate over ideological consistency.
Read this excerpt of the transcript below, and then lets discuss
HARWOOD: as you know. Your opponents have said you switched positions on many issues. It is an issue of character, not personal, but political, you seemed to encapsulate it in the last debate when you said, Im running for office, for Petes sake.
What can you say to Republicans to persuade them that the things you say in the campaign are rooted in something deeper than the fact that you are running for office?
ROMNEY: John, I think people know me pretty well, particularly in this state, in the state of Massachusetts, New Hampshire thats close by, Utah, where I served in the Olympics. I think people understand that Im a man of steadiness and constancy.
I dont think you are going to find somebody who has more of those attributes than I do. I have been married to the same woman for 25 excuse me, I will get in trouble, for 42 years.
(LAUGHTER)
ROMNEY: I have been in the same church my entire life. I worked at one company, Bain, for 25 years. And I left that to go off and help save the Olympic Games. I think it is outrageous the Obama campaign continues to push this idea, when you have in the Obama administration the most political presidency we have seen in modern history.
They are actually deciding when to pull out of Afghanistan based on politics. Let me tell you this, if Im president of the United States, I will be true to my family, to my faith, and to our country, and I will never apologize for the United States of America. Thats my belief.
(Emphasis mine.)
This was an interesting diversion. The question was about Romneys philosophical inconsistency but he never addressed his changing positions on important issues like abortion. Romney is clearly attempting to associate the two things as if to imply that not quitting your job equals not flip-flopping on the issues.
And yet, it wasnt obvious that he had dodged the question. (Good spin isnt blatant.)
Of course, the fact that Romney has been with the same wife for 42 years worked at the same company for 25 years and belonged to the same church his entire life is, I suppose, commendable. His personal life has been steady, boring, and consistent nobody has alleged otherwise.
But does it have anything to do with his changing policy positions?
I would argue this was a very slick example of sophistry.
The notion that there is a strong correlation between being consistent in ones personal life, and being philosophically consistent, is debatable. Does anyone doubt that Mark Sanford with all his faults would be more trusted than Romney to advance a conservative agenda as president? Jimmy Carter was, as far as I know, a good husband does that make him philosophically sound?
This, of course, is not to say that values and character do not matter they do but it is to say that Romneys answer was a non sequitur. Everyone knows Mitt Romney is a decent, respectable person. The question is whether or not he can be trusted to advance conservatism as president.
(And attacking Obama at the end was a nice touch, too.)
Maybe it’s just wishful thinking on my part, but I think Mr. Wonderboy is veering towards some kind of on-screen meltdown or major gaffe.
Things don’t look good behind the Romney Facade. Not to me.
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Maybe hes getting smacked around verbally by his handlers in Salt lake City...
he is making the home team of all “white and delightsomes” look foolish by letting the black boy “seed of Cain ...CAIN LOL...
beat him among the conservatives...read “apostates, whore-of-babylons” so called “Evangelicals”
So last night he made a point of doing some PR for the home team by “affirming” and “sustaining” his so called “church” in order to earn back the Brownie points for his temple recommend badge...
Mormons are always on a short leash and especially if they want to be allowed to run for office...
and he “saved the Olympics”
why Mormons think we are thrilled by this talking point I cant hazzed a guess...
What the international Olympics have to do with running the US is beyond me...
We managed quite well for more than 100 years without ANY Olympics at all...
Yeah the pressure is on for lil Willie Mitty
Hes not use to losing and having to fight...
Maybe his Daddy George will come back to the SLC temple as a ghost and tell him what to do...
Ghosts of dead people in mormon temples giving instructions have happened a lot so the Mormons say...
Why not now ???
Maybe his Daddy George will come back to the SLC temple as a ghost and tell him what to do...Hey, the serial killer Dexter gets advice from his dead dad.
Maybe the serial flip-flopper Willard does too!
(Excellent post, by the way! Bravo!)
My post was not deserving of your inferences or your questions.
Please understand that I truly don’t want to get ornery with you.
I saw your post #3, but I could quickly see that it was about mormonism, so I didn’t bother to read it.
I have read and heard all that I need to regarding mormonism. Frankly, I wouldn’t care what religion Romney was, I flat wouldn’t vote for him, period.
I come from generations of patriots that have served our country and I was brought up to be a patriot. I have served my country, fought for it and if need be, I am willing to do it again, although at 63, I don’t think I’d be drafted. LOL
I am a fallen away Roman Catholic and I am not part of any organized religion, mostly because I haven’t found one I agree with.
In my world, “God, Family and Country” will always be my order of priority.
Darn, I have rambled and written far more than I had intended, so I’ll stop right here.
Romney was the one who brought up his "faith"...twice.
My post was not deserving of your inferences or your questions?
As to my "inferences"...you say you "skipped right past post #3"...and as to my "questions"...isn't that what we do on a debate forum?
I don't know just why you seem to take this personally. I have relatives who have served the country....and it's Mitt and his family who have not.
In my world, God, Family and Country will always be my order of priority. Again, I note that Mitt didn't say God, he said my faith".
Sarah Palin’s written announcement used the order of “God, family country”.
I don’t think she was wrong.
Do you?
No mention of God. Someone who's faith is Scientology could make the same statement...would that indicate he was speaking of our Christian God?
Sarah didn't say her "faith"...but her God.
"I have a lot of faith that gets me though."
And I think...
"Faith in what, exactly? "
I hear you, greyfoxx.
No mention of God. Someone who’s faith is Scientology could make the same statement...would that indicate he was speaking of our Christian God?
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Someone who’s faith is Islam or Wiccan or Hindu could make the same statement...
Romney’s choice or religion is closer to Islam than Christianity...
The founder of Mormonism wanted to be a 2nd Mohammad...
Not a 2nd Jean Cauvin or Martin Luther...
“He is a mormom.”
That’s what the anti Catholics said about JFK “He is a Catholic” meaning they wouldn’t vote for a Catholic and about a million Americans did not vote for JFK because “he is a Catholic”. De je vu all over again.
“Outside of the FOX news pundits”
FOX news hates Romney; it kills them to say anything good about the man. The media hates Romney almost as much as FR does which should give one pause.
grayfoxxx39 - This is the same junk they said about JFK when he was running for President. Almost exactly. That the Pope would be running America. Blah blah blah. Just change the word Mormon to Catholic and you have a re-run of JFK’s presidential run. And JFK lost about a million votes because “I wouldn’t vote for a Catholic”.
"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind.
The first man that committed the odious crime of killing one of his brethren will be cursed the longest of any one of the children of Adam. Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings.
This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin. Trace mankind down to after the flood, and then another curse is pronounced upon the same race--that they should be the 'servant of servants', and they will be, until that curse is removed."
Brigham Young-President and second 'Prophet' of the Mormon Church, 1844-1877- Extract from Journal of Discourses.
Here are two examples from their 'other testament', the Book of Mormon.
2 Nephi 5: 21 'And he had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people, the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them.'
Alma 3: 6 'And the skins of the Lamanites were dark, according to the mark which was set upon their fathers, which was a curse upon them because of their transgression and their rebellion against their brethren, who consisted of Nephi, Jacob and Joseph, and Sam, who were just and holy men.'
August 27, 1954 in an address at Brigham Young University (BYU), Mormon Elder, Mark E Peterson, in speaking to a convention of teachers of religion at the college level, said:
(Rosa Parks would have probably told Petersen under which wheel of the bus he should go sit.)
1967, (then) Mormon President Ezra Taft Benson said, "The Communist program for revolution in America has been in progress for many years and is far advanced. First of all, we must not place the blame upon Negroes. They are merely the unfortunate group that has been selected by professional Communist agitators to be used as the primary source of cannon fodder."
We are told that on June 8, 1978, it was 'revealed' to the then president, Spencer Kimball, that people of color could now gain entry into the priesthood. According to the church, Kimball spent many long hours petitioning God, begging him to give worthy black people the priesthood. God finally relented. |
Sometime before the 'revelation' came to chief 'Prophet' Spencer Kimball in June 1978, General Authority, Bruce R McConkie had said:
"The Blacks are denied the Priesthood; under no circumstances can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty.
The Negroes are not equal with other races where the receipt of certain blessings are concerned, particularly the priesthood and the temple blessings that flow there from, but this inequality is not of man's origin, it is the Lord's doings."
(Mormon Doctrine, pp. 526-527).
When Mormon 'Apostle' Mark E Petersen spoke on 'Race Problems- As they affect the Church' at the BYU campus in 1954, the following was also said:
"...if the negro accepts the gospel with real, sincere faith, and is really converted, to give him the blessings of baptism and the gift of the Holy Ghost, he can and will enter the celestial kingdom. He will go there as a servant, but he will get celestial glory."
When Mormon 'Prophet' and second President of the Church, Brigham Young, spoke in 1863 the following was also said:
"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God is death on the spot. This will always be so."
(Journal of Discourses, Vo. 10, p. 110)
Yeah; Native Americans are althroughout the Book of MORMON; too.
I saw a striking contrast in the progress of the Indian people today ... they are fast becoming a white and delightsome people.... For years they have been growing delightsome, and they are now becoming white and delightsome, as they were promised.... The children in the home placement program in Utah are often lighter than their brothers and sisters in the hogans on the reservation.
At one meeting a father and mother and their sixteen-year-old daughter were present, the little member girl-sixteen-sitting between the dark father and mother, and it was evident she was several shades lighter than her parentson the same reservation, in the same hogan, subject to the same sun and wind and weather.... These young members of the Church are changing to whiteness and to delightsomeness.
One white elder jokingly said that he and his companion were donating blood regularly to the hospital in the hope that the process might be accelerated.
(Improvement Era, December 1960, pp.922-23). (p. 209)
Good; but many others have not.
We tend to post with that vast crowd of uninformed folks in mind.
Did you know that good MORMONs (the GOD pleasing ones) are not ALLOWED to eat MEAT in the SUMMERtime?
(If invited to one of their backyard cookouts...)
The Official Scriptures of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints © 2006 Intellectual Reserve, Inc. All rights reserved. Rights and use information. Privacy policy. |
Not quite, Sandy.
Most Americans knew JFK was a CHRISTIAN.
My job is to INSURE that an awful lot of AMERICANs know that Mitt is a MORMON.
Then we'll see MANY millions not voting for HIM!
Yup; it should.
Mitt should drop out NOW and AVOID giving MORMONism the biggest black eye in a LONG time!
And Mitt 'lost' in 2008 when he couldn't even beat a fellow Rino!
What's that saying?
"Keep on doing what you been doing and you'll keep on getting what you been getting."
Or was it...
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
it kills them to say anything good about the man.
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Youre not dead yet
say something good...
Something that a Conservative would want to know...
Ya know...
Something Conservative...
CRICKETS
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