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To: grey_whiskers

“I don’t want them forgotten, I want them avenged.
Thoughts similar to the following have crossed my mind many times since 9-11.
I am torn: we are commanded to forgive our enemies, but also to stand against evil.”

This is the great conundrum that Christianity, and The West, faces.

In order to vanquish and eradicate Islam — the sworn enemy of all things free (as we in The West understand “freedom”) — The Christian West will have to resort to violence, even barbarity, that eclipses almost anything humanity has ever known.

Very few openly wish this to happen. But — if The West is to indeed “win” — it MUST happen.

From this reality there can be no escape. Perhaps that is why The West, certainly up to this point, is unwilling to face it. There are some futures so dark that one desires to simply turn away. But — as a well-know lady writer has said, “We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of reality”.

It was Christianity that made Western Civilization possible.

But could Christianity — the tolerant creed that “turns the other cheek” in an effort to “forgive our enemies” — also become the force that stays our hand and causes the loss of that very civilization?

Just wonderin’....


161 posted on 09/09/2011 9:22:41 PM PDT by Grumplestiltskin (I may look new, but it's only deja vu!)
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To: Grumplestiltskin; nathanbedford
Thanks, Grumple.

nathan, *PING* to Post #161 this thread...

g_w

174 posted on 09/09/2011 10:07:45 PM PDT by grey_whiskers (The opinions are solely those of the author and are subject to change without notice.)
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To: Grumplestiltskin

Jesus told us to turn the other cheek, sure.

He also told us not to be patsies and be perennial victims, either. Immediately before He left us, he demanded that those who followed him arm themselves - not for revenge, marauding or banditry, but to defend themselves against those who would harm them. Luke 22:35-36, to be specific.

From the Bible, I take it thusly: Jesus tells us to let the slings and arrows (insults and affronts) of everyday life in stride and not to let them get to you, let alone start feuds. But when attacked, one is to defend oneself.


189 posted on 09/09/2011 10:53:34 PM PDT by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Grumplestiltskin; grey_whiskers
I do not think it is Christian forbearance or even fastidiousness which causes us to shrink from "resort [ing] to violence, even barbarity" in defending ourselves against the onslaught of medieval Islam. I think it is a lack of clear thinking.

It is not Christianity which has distorted our thinking but pernicious intellectual and epistemological doctrines which have distorted our collective sense of purpose. There is nothing inherently Christian about prostrating a society defenseless before its enemies. The Christian message is an individual message. Certainly, the Israelites of the Old Testament were not a bunch of handwringing pacifists. They were very willing to slay the Philistines whenever they got the chance.

It is a historically true Judeo/Christian philosophy which permits a just war against evil in defense of the good. Our problem has been predicted by the Bible, we are unable to distinguish good from evil, indeed, we have gotten to a place where we call good evil and evil good.

This is the baleful results of a departure from Christian principles and it is best exemplified by The Frankfurt School. Without exploring its doctrine for the nth time, let it suffice here to say that The Frankfurt School has succeeded in subverting our intellectual, religious, and media culture with a nihilist doctrine which calls itself "critical thinking" the purpose of which is to "deconstruct" everything which holds a moral and a civil society together. In the process it vitiates our ability to distinguish good from evil and to commit to any positive good.

I believe that a restoration of Judeo-Christian values would energize the war against this evil and medieval jihad.


233 posted on 09/10/2011 7:12:32 AM PDT by nathanbedford ("Attack, repeat, attack!" Bull Halsey)
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To: Grumplestiltskin
"The Christian West will have to resort to violence, even barbarity, that eclipses almost anything humanity has ever known."

Obama and the water carrying boot licking butt boys in the MSM will do all they can to make sure that people will not be appointed as military leaders who will do as you have posted.

"But could Christianity — the tolerant creed that “turns the other cheek” in an effort to “forgive our enemies” — also become the force that stays our hand and causes the loss of that very civilization?"

Sadly, yes.

259 posted on 09/11/2011 8:34:57 AM PDT by Enterprise ("Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire)
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