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Amazon closing Tx center amid dispute
AP via Houston Chronicle ^ | 2.10.11 | APRIL CASTRO

Posted on 02/10/2011 1:13:01 PM PST by trumandogz

AUSTIN, Texas — Online retail giant Amazon.com will close its suburban Dallas distribution center after a dispute with the state over millions in state sales taxes.

The Associated Press obtained an e-mail Thursday sent to Amazon employees by the company's vice president of operations. Amazon's Dave Clark writes that the center will close April 12 due to Texas' "the unfavorable regulatory climate."

(Excerpt) Read more at chron.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government; US: Texas
KEYWORDS: amazon; economy; salestaxes; taxes; texas; tx
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To: trumandogz

There’s alot going on here potentially.

1. Amazon probably got expert advice before the move and it turned out wrong.
2. There’s a shift to on-line commerce, much of which avoids collecting sales tax if the shipper is out of state. This is legally incorrect. Tax is due based on ship to location, and should be paid to the state by the receiver if the shipper fails to collect it.
3. The shipper is better able to collect and remit taxes than the receiver. Plus the govenment can regulate business behavior than consumer.
4. So it’s not Texas, it’s all the states shipped to from the facility who are losing out.
5. I expect that this loophole will be closed in the next 5 years and we’ll pay tax on on-line transactions regardless of ship from location. First domestically then later international.

I hate how government has become oppressive and large, but also hate loopholes, whether in my favor or not.


21 posted on 02/10/2011 2:04:57 PM PST by cicero2k
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To: cicero2k

My understanding of the problem is that Amazon has no problem with paying sales taxes on orders in Texas and they have been doing so all along. What they don’t agree to is paying sales tax on items sold into other states and shipped from Texas.

Texas thinks if it ships from Texas the sale was made in Texas and that means sales tax.


22 posted on 02/10/2011 2:15:02 PM PST by JAKraig (Surely my religion is at least as good as yours)
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To: Cicero
The reason Amazon has to fight this is that if they give in to Texas, every other state will jump on them too.

Why should Amazon waste time and money in a legal battle? They don't need Texas as much as Texas needs them. Texans lose all round because of their idiot lawmakers. Employees lose jobs, local businesses lose the employees' business, and Amazon's Texas customers may have to wait a little longer for their books.

Not bad for a part time legislature.

23 posted on 02/10/2011 2:23:10 PM PST by giotto
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To: trumandogz

Good for Amazon.

TX, beware. One only has to look at CA to see where the taxation path leads.

Taxation is just lawful shakedown policy.

Either TX will change teier law in a New York second or Amazon will vote with its feet, jobs and money.

Technology should be on the brink of forcing government to take their taxation policies and stuff them, but the taxation death rattle is still a long way off due to social policy. Social policy???!! How in the hell did we let the government get to a point of making and enforcing social policy????!!!


24 posted on 02/10/2011 2:26:06 PM PST by ratsreek
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To: trumandogz

Wonder if they’d do better from Mexico.

Obama gave a 50Bln dollar tax credit for the Union run GM.


25 posted on 02/10/2011 2:31:34 PM PST by NoLibZone (Obama must be impeached and tried for treason.)
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To: napscoordinator

Its that stupid franchise tax isn’t it?


26 posted on 02/10/2011 2:34:52 PM PST by GeronL (http://www.stink-eye.net/forum/index.php for FR backup site!)
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To: cicero2k

Please tell me, where is it written that we should have to pay tax on something we buy? We need to challenge that fundamental assumption, before its so-called logical extension kills online commerce altogether. And by the way, I don’t agree that online sellers should have to collect sales tax on behalf of the customer’s state, county and city. Why should a business-hostile state benefit from the sale of an item that was produced in a business-friendly state, and sold in another business-friendly state? Let the backward states suffer for their backward laws.


27 posted on 02/10/2011 2:35:36 PM PST by giotto
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To: trumandogz

Reagan was right - government is the problem. If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. If it stops moving, subsidize it.


28 posted on 02/10/2011 2:54:58 PM PST by TexasRepublic (Socialism is the gospel of envy and the religion of thieves)
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To: trumandogz

Sales tax on internet sales has been a growing issue around the country. Amazon is being challenged by others including North Carolina, Rhode Island, Colorado. Texas sent them a bill for $269 million last fall.

Does Sears, Penneys and other major retailers charge a sales tax or collect that sales tax for online/catalog sales? Interesting debate beginning on the subject across the nation.


29 posted on 02/10/2011 2:56:57 PM PST by deport
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To: giotto
Government types want a piece of every dollar every time it changes hands.

Starve the beast;there is no moral reason to pay one penny more than you absolutely mus to the government.

30 posted on 02/10/2011 3:02:53 PM PST by hoosierham (Waddaya mean Freedom isn't free ?;will you take a credit card?)
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To: GeronL

Yes. Right to work type tax.....kinda the honor to work in the state tax. It is seriously ridiculous especially for Texas of all places. If it was New York, I probably would have said, “nothing new”.


31 posted on 02/10/2011 3:02:59 PM PST by napscoordinator
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To: justlurking
I was getting some items from Amazon in a day or two, even with super-saver shipping.

I ordered three Kindle books from Amazon today. Lo and behold, they were here in about 3 minutes. Love it.

I order a fair amount of stuff from them, and they are customer friendly.

32 posted on 02/10/2011 3:22:49 PM PST by Ole Okie
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To: deport

..................Does Sears, Penneys and other major retailers charge a sales tax or collect that sales tax for online/catalog sales? Interesting debate beginning on the subject across the nation................

Yes they do! And if they price e-commerce merchandise the same as retail commerce, collect the sales tax, and charge shipping, they will lose customers big time.

But it’s a hell of alot cheaper to stock a warehouse,(probably the same warehouse that is currently restocking your retail stores) and wave fill orders on massive conveyor belts, and pass some of that savings on to the internet customer, to somewhat equalize with the street price.

Hell, Sears (and Montgomery Ward) was doing that for a century with it’s catalog business, becoming the biggest retailer in the world - (and even appeasing the greenies of the time by recycling the catalog in the outhouse.)

It’s time to level the playing field, and have e-commerce customers pay the sales tax, and have the e-retailer reflect their selling model in their resale margins.


33 posted on 02/10/2011 3:25:28 PM PST by Noob1999 (Loose Lips Sink Ships)
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To: JAKraig

“Texas thinks if it ships from Texas the sale was made in Texas and that means sales tax.”

I am not going to pay sales tax to Texas and my own state both!

It is not the responsibility of Amazon to collect taxes for all the states in this Union which have a sales tax.


34 posted on 02/10/2011 3:46:12 PM PST by SatinDoll
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To: deport

If they have a store in that state will charge sales tax. If they have NO presence in the state , then no they don’t.


35 posted on 02/10/2011 4:20:45 PM PST by bfree (The revolution is coming - OBAMI IS THE ENEMY OF FREEDOM)
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To: giotto

I guess, for a govt to exist, it has to collect taxes somewhere. Options would include:

Collection on Income
Collection on Sales
Collection as part of a Census (yearly, flat rate everyone is enforced on)

A census tax would cost too much time and money, so that leaves income or sales. From there, I would prefer a sales tax over income. But, if we are already paying income, we shouldnt be paying sales as well.


36 posted on 02/10/2011 4:54:19 PM PST by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: JAKraig
"My understanding of the problem is that Amazon has no problem with paying sales taxes on orders in Texas and they have been doing so all along."

Not so according the the article. Amazon argues that "the facilities are separate legal entities that do not give it a physical presence in those states". They're saying they have no nexus in Texas despite the existence of the dist. center and aren't collecting or remitting sales tax on orders delivered within Texas. Same story in 5 other states by the way.
37 posted on 02/10/2011 4:58:12 PM PST by AndrewB (FUBO)
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To: OldNavyVet
“Hide your wallets, Boys, the legislature’s back in session.” Mark Twain

I seem to recall an old saying something to the effect: that "when the Texas Legislature is in session neighbors should keep their daughters in the house under lock and key and their dogs tied up on a short leash." as no one is safe from those buggers.

38 posted on 02/10/2011 4:59:24 PM PST by Ron H. (Impeach the dictator wannabe Impostor!!!)
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To: deport

I think if ecommerce reaches close to half of all commerce, or close, there will definitely be a sales tax on it. It is a new phenomenon, so there isnt much legally written about it, but ecommerce is still commerce.

How would it be fair if Amazon didnt have to pay sales tax while Barnes N Noble did? That would almost look like the govt is subsidizing one vendor against another to give a competitive edge.


39 posted on 02/10/2011 5:00:56 PM PST by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: Noob1999

I think that is a debate that will become hot on FR. The only way to be fair to retailers who are forced to pay sales tax is to force ecommerce to do the same. But there will be a vocal contingent that is against any tax being implemented, because they are against tax and that is their one issue.


40 posted on 02/10/2011 5:05:26 PM PST by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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