Posted on 12/22/2010 9:37:01 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld
Bet it seemed like a good idea at the time!
Not a pilot, but I've ridden in them enough and talked to their pilots enough (and okay, I have some "unofficial" hours of flight time) to help explain a little bit of what happened.
All aircraft, fixed or rotor wing, fly best in cooler air because the air is more dense and the wing gets better lift. Keep in mind that the best air for lift is "undisturbed" air. Vortices (horizontal "corkscrew" patterns of disturbed air) left from preceding fixed-wing aircraft, and the "doughnut" pattern of air movement created by a spinning helicopter rotor (you see this a lot in the movies when a helicopter flies through smoke) are all "disturbed" air and make it harder for the wing or rotor to get lift.
When a helicopter first takes off, it is in that "doughnut" pattern of air and it is harder to get lift, but once it starts moving forward, the air is "clean" or undisturbed, and the lift is better. In this case, the helicopters had done just the opposite - they had gone into a hover and had lost the "clean" air that once helped them to stay aloft. This in and of itself wouldn't make a helicopter go down as long as the pilot is taking into account the disturbed air and adds "power and pitch" (explained below.) Now, add to the situation the fact that higher temperatures (higher temps equal less dense air) make for even lower lift... and then add to the equation that the aircraft over water is in a higher humidity environment which in turn further decrease the density of the air, the ability of the wing or rotor to produce lift, and to some extent decrease the power made by the aircraft engine. You can see what is starting to happen here. Aircraft can be very tempermental when it comes to temperature and air density. There is an old saying that altitude is your friend, in that it gives you time to correct mistakes. In this case, they had very little altitude. But I would be willing to bet that the pitch control (controls the amount of "bite" that the rotor takes out of the air) is bent upward, and there is a lot more slack in the throttle control (engine power) than there was earlier that day. Someone had to have yanked straight up on the pitch and given the helicpoter all the throttle it had - and they pretty much kept it on a straight line with the pedals while they were doing it. I can't condone the actions that got the helicopters wet, but I do have to say that it was one heck of a recovery...
Aircraft can throw you for a loop every now and then if you don't keep your wits about you. You have to be observant of not only everything that is going on with your aircraft, but also the type of terrain over which you are flying. At 500 feet, I've been bumped up an additional 200-250 feet above ground level just by flying over a big asphalt parking lot - the heat can provide a sudden updraft. I've "ridden the roller coaster" on days when, from the ground, all would seem calm - just the difference between flying over pastures and then flying over wooded areas. I've also lost friends that had their aircraft suffer "catastrophic airframe failure" when they dropped 2000 feet in a matter of seconds due to sudden changes in the atmosphere (27,000 AGL to 25,000AGL in 19 seconds in an AeroCommander - the wreckage was strewn over 5 miles.)
The main thing here is that no lives were lost... Anytime someone damages an aircraft to that extent, the instructor pilot is held responsible for the situation and has to stand tall before the man. It's just the way it is... If the two instructors are really as good at piloting as the recoveries indicate, I would say that they will be back on instructor duty as soon as the dust settles and the publicity dies down. I do not believe this was some "stunt" but rather some miscalculation on the part of both student and instructor. Anytime you have a helicopter hit the water that hard, you run the risk of having it "roll over" and then it's the end. The recoveries were indeed pretty awesome.
Regards,
Raven6
I appreciate the details. I’m sure others will too.
Despite any irresponsibility factors, the handling was pretty impressive. Good to get an objective opinion. Thanks!
Sorry to hear about your buddies.
I remember that joy ride.
The altitude of Lake Tahoe is 6,000 feet... may add some more insight in this. Flying out of Tahoe airport can be really tricky from what some of my pilot buds tell me!
I am a former Navy Aircrewman. Navy pilots are more responsible than this.
The instructors are getting their just desserts!!
My husband is a former Naval Aviator, flying jets off of a carrier.
While I agree that these actions may be irresponsible, they aren’t unexpected.
When you have a class of men such as these, stupid stuff happens at times.
I’m not letting them off of the hook, I’m just saying that it comes with the territory.
They are Type A personalities, and very cocky...........which is the type of personality needed for military flight missions.
Higher humidity would INCREASE the density of the air, wouldn't it?
Flown only fixed wing, but I thought all helo’s ran full throttle or close to it 100% of the time.........
AhHa! look at that U.F.O. in formation behind “The One”
H2O molecules are not as heavy as N2 or O2 molecules, however air at normal climatic temperatures and pressures also can’t hold a very large proportion of water vapor so it can not affect overall air density very much. Condensation of water on cooler surfaces might interfere with their aerodynamics.
Regarding Helos running full throttle -
A gas turbine engine runs like a constant speed prop
recip engine set up.
Run up the engine to performance RPM. You do the same
in a Cessna 182 or other constant speed prop.
Then increases the pitch of the blades. More fuel is
added, the governor holds the rpms at the same speed, but
more power comes out the shaft.
A chopper goes up, a plane goes forward.
What is seen in a gas turbine is that the compression blades operate at their own rpm, which is different from a recip. The later set of blades which captures the power is the one that stays constant.
So saying they run at full throttle is mis-leading as the compression stage changes rpm to maintain constant rpm on the output, thus power.
did that help?
I had them in 1963-1964. A majority, in fact.
I was a student pilot in R-22s years ago. I wouldn’t fly with a CFI who even had a reputation for taking chances like that. Looks like hot-dogging that narrowly missed becoming a full-blown tragedy. It looks like the ship on the right was engulfed in spray kicked up by the rotor wash.
It’s been a very long time for me, but my recollection is that one puts on one’s serious face when doing things with helicopters- no screwing around at all.
Just because we’re talking about helicopters in the water...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqqKe1AxfHk
” The Sept. 13 incident became public because a bystander caught the event on video and posted it on YouTube. “
the even became public because THEY DID IT, and shouldn’t have
We flew through a cold rainstorm once- it was like flying in a car wash. There was a leak up at the top of my door, and a steady trickle of cold water running down my neck, and I couldn't do a thing about it. LOL!
The old school term is "Settling with Power"... although the blade design on the H60 pretty much negates that... I think they were having a little fun and got on the collective a "little" slow.
All I can say is thank god the use of Youtube and such wasn't main stream when I was flying as most of the Strike Rescue bubba's might have lost our wings. ;-)
Some of our treks cross country in the old HH1K Gunships and then the HH60H's were VERY exhilarating to say the least... I have very little fear left in me, as most of it was used up in helo's :-)
What these two did is nothing compared to the culture of 40 years ago.
“Hey skipper, watch this!”
If you're gonna pull a stunt, ya gotta be good enough to get away with it, and you certainly do not cause damage. A couple of my squadron mates for instance would get into ground effect over a smooth ocean surface and drop the tailhook into it. It made for an impressive photo. Still stupid.
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