Posted on 11/20/2010 11:34:24 PM PST by JohnKinAK
Glenn Beck said today that he has spoken to military experts about the mystery contrail from a few weeks ago and he says it’s definitely not a plane, but rather a two stage missile. He just wants to know where it came from, and he has a theory. Beck postulates that this missile was possibly from a Chinese sub off the coast of California, perhaps as a show of force to the world, but even more so to President Obama.
Click link for video
...I actually worked at Cape Canaveral on compound #16, rigging Pershing II missles with telemetry and then launching them into the Atlantic.Excellent!That 'contrail' looked exactly like the trail our missles left in the sky, at about the same tempature and same humidity. Exactly.
I have also watched shuttles launch and and many Trident missles...
:Perhaps YOU can address some of the key issues around this event:
1 - Could the TV station have "doctored" the video that they released -- perhaps not out of evil intent, but in the pursuit of "good television" -- so that an airplane contrail LOOKED LIKE a missle launch?That is, if they slpiced together different parts of their ten minutes of raw footoge -- mixing up the order of the clips -- so that it APPEARED to change speed and direction in ways that it did not -- would that effect your analysis of what happened?
2 - What does the kind of missile launch that you are familiar with look like -- UP CLOSE?
What kind of SOUND would people on commercial boats nearby hear?
What would a missle launch like you are familiar with LOOK LIKE -- to nearby observers?
What would you expect for observers thirty-five miles away, on shore -- to see and hear during a missile launch like this?
It's the Chicoms. They're sneaky like that.
btw...see where Reagan, Goldwater and Buckley stood on those “cherished moments”
I know who I'm riding with...
Talking self esteem and work ethic was just platitudes then for King and sad too many today buy the hype about the 60s.
I was around then...my formative years and I don't..not now not ever.
If you want me to educate you about what King really wrote (or plagiarized) and who he hung out with I will but you may not care because like Reagan said concerning the Holiday he was reluctant to sign...”it's an untruth that has become a perception which has become a reality”..oh yeah...a Good Republican back then could have easily been a liberal as a conservative...in fact many if not most were...Beck is just plain full of it about Civil Rights and this GOP always great/Dems always bad BS...and his demonization of Teddy Roosevelt does nothing for me either...he's a good town crier...that's about all
Here's some stuff to nibble on if you want to:
If you are a true conservative just take the time to read Martin Luther King's utterances on poverty, socialism, Vietnam and other hot issues and educate yourself. There is no way you can come to the conclusion he was a friend to us...no way at all. His legacy has been whitewashed by white guilt for the uninformed or those too young to know better. I am neither. King was a great orator and marginally less offensive those more radical like Stokely or Huey or H. Rap...that and being killed is his legacy.
Some do, some don't as has been shown by examples on FR and elsewhere. Depends on atmospheric/altitude variables. Here's an example of different effects and persistence:
Additionally, the exhaust trail in question has a shape, depth, density, and opacity that is totally alien to contrails.
Again, not so. Here's a quite similar one from a year prior:
We'd need more information. He says "roughly the same time..." And we'd need to cross-reference with flight data. There are also variations in atmospheric conditions that would cause differences in contrail. I'm not hard core on it being the exact same plane/time/location. That's not necessary to support the contrail hypothesis.
The three videos look like, to me, the same effect: the same type of object causing a relatively common effect.
Thanks for your reply.
Me either
I’m not going to call you names, but I find it ironic but you are calling someone names. LOL
The “contrail” in dispute appears to be right-lit to the west on one side and dark on the other appearing to indicate a south-to-north horizontal flight path (if a plane) or a vertical path if a missile observed to the south...but cannot be the west-to-east plane like UPS 902 observed from the east, if it is only side lit from the west.
You clearly don’t know what you’re talking about. Don’t you know there is a website with contrail and science in it’s name that has shot down any theory that it was anything other than an airplane contrail? You are probably just a Beckbot. ;)
Feel free to call me whatever you like - I don’t need validation from you. The fact of the matter is that Beck is a charlatan and the folks that buy into his nonsense are pathetic, tinfoil hat wearing suckers. He’s like a farmer - he plants the seeds of ignorance, steps back, and watches the tangle of stupidity grow. His harvest is nothing but idiots and their money.
But you don’t trust FReepers who seem to have expertise in missiles? Because?
It's very disheartening to see this event getting twisted into some massive conspiracy and cover up by some forum members. Because that is what it would take to cover up such an event.I know you get a few on every forum but there is a segment here that needs this to be a cover up of wild outlandish conjecture for whatever reasons. Despite massive evidences to the contrary.
It's diminishing the credibility of this forum and I am embarrassed for it.
Do you have any idea how many agencies and entities would have to be in on the cover up? Thousnads of people?
Do you sign up to the above? because if this what you say it was, which is only wild conjecture.
The above is fully necessary.
Huge conspiracy? Yes or no?
” Wake up and embrace a dangerous world. “
And by the way, don’t lecture me on that.
You will find nobody more supportive on defense of this nation and freedom then I.
Here are some comments by a man who is an expert on observing launches out of vandenberg, so well trained on observing such things here in California for many years, maintains a website on the matter.
“As of this morning, I would like to end any further discussion of the mystery “launch” reported on the evening of November 8th. I have determined that what was seen that evening is not a mystery and it was not a launch.
Also, please do not send me any further e-mails on this subject.
There has been speculation on the Internet that the event was a missile launch from a Chinese submarine.
If a foreign power covertly entered the waters adjacent to the U.S. mainland and launched a missile, it wouldn’t necessarily be an act of war, but it would be a major provocation. A provocation of that type could actually backfire by increasing U.S. fears over Chinese naval power in the Pacific. That could lead to a build up of the U.S. Navy’s anti-submarine warfare capability.
During the Cold War, the U.S. Navy was able to locate, track, and if necessary, kill Soviet ballistic missile submarines at sea. As a matter of fact, U.S. attack submarines (subs designed to hunt and kill other subs) reportedly would lurk submerged and meet up with Soviet subs shortly after they left port and follow the Soviet subs undetected for extended periods of time. Furthermore, land-based and carrier-based U.S. Navy anti-submarine warfare aircraft such as the P-3 and S-3 could also detect, track, and kill Soviet submarines.
It is reasonable to assume that the U.S. Navy has at least a partial ability track the movements of Chinese submarines. Furthermore, U.S. early warning satellites and radars (such as PAVE PAWS radar at Beale AFB in northern California) provide the U.S. military with the ability to immediately detect, pinpoint, and track missile launches at sea. The Navy probably also still has a formidable anti-submarine warfare capability that would allow it to quickly locate and kill hostile submarines.
Therefore, I think the assertion that the event of last week was a Chinese weapons test to be highly unlikely.
Again, please do not send me any further e-mails about the supposed mystery launch.
Brian Webb”
the one in dispute, appear evenly under-lit by the setting sun to the west. The “contrail” in dispute appears to be right-lit to the west
These are variables explained by the contrail hypothesis - variations in time, viewing, angle, flight path etc.
I wasn't trying to match this event identically, but to show the effect and that it has occurred in the past. If you wish an explanation focusing on this particular event, contrailscience.com has what you're looking for.
Why would I call you names? I don’t need to do that in a debate, I would simply debate facts. I don’t care what validation you do or don’t need. I commented on the fact that you call people out on their need to call you names or not, while in the same post calling someone names. There is a word for that. Calm down and debate facts instead of getting so emotional.
I don’t know why you should be embarrassed by anything anyone else says. Seriously. There have always been various opinions on FR about all sorts of things. I often see people post things I wouldn’t ever agree with. I don’t lose any sleep over it. I don’t feel personally responsible for it. I just realize that out there are people who see believe things I don’t.
Again, this whole things fascinates me because apparently smart people (and some people who seem to have some expertise) have some pretty diametrically opposed views and seem to be willing to defend those views. I have no idea where the truth lies (since I have pretty much zero expertise in this area).
But, this does not reflect on you as a FReeper. We probably all just need a good stiff drink.
Since I didn't mention any particular theory of Mr. Beck's, you have no basis for assuming what I do or do not dismiss as conspiracy or spurious.
Why degrade his choice of Faith ...
Please don't accuse me, ipso facto, of degrading his faith when I have not done so. I merely observed a fact of life in America that his faith is a hurdle an obstacle. The intellectual basis for Mormonism has been viewed with great negativity since Joseph Smith founded his Church in 1830. Adherents always have to overcome, what seems to many others to be, an inability to use good judgement when evaluating a religious hypothesis. Many believe, that intrinsic lack of judgement may affect judgement in more terrestrial matters, as well. I have not said I agree or disagree with this analysis. I only observe that a challenge exists.
...or blame a greed for the money he earns...
Nowhere did I say Mr. Beck had a "GREED for the money he earns". Anyone who provides a product or service that others want to pay for should be able to do so and enjoy the blessings of that endeavor to whatever level of achievement he/she desires; as long as it's moral, legal, ethical, and honest. I do not infer that Mr. Beck is 'greedy'. Only that for him, the accumulation of wealth may be a stronger motivation than the promotion of conservative or rational ideas. This is often the case for those new to wealth and who have acquired it quickly as has Mr. Beck. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with that. Personally, I just like to be aware of it so that I may make better judgements as to the possible motives of thought leaders and whether its wise for me to follow them.
Mr. Beck is often self described as ADHD. The thought processes of individuals so afflicted can often lurch into the radical. Their speech and behavior are often unpredictable. People with this disorder can be very entertaining.
A few days ago I posted:
I like Beck, too but purely for the entertainment value. I don't take him too seriously as an influencer of my opinion. He's more like an outrageously whacky cousin with whom I often agree and who always makes me laugh.
I stand by that statement.
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