Looting The Dead For A Better World

The Strategy Page ^ | 10/20/2010 | The Strategy Page

[ErnstStavroBlofeld]

In the past two years, the U.S. Air Force retired 252 elderly A-10s, F-15s and F-16s to the "bone yard" (a desert storage areas where many American warplanes are stored when retired, just in case they are needed later.) Sometimes the air force is just saving money, by mothballing and decommissioning a number of active duty airplanes to free up money for upgrades and maintenance on the rest of the fleet. Thus not all the aircraft in the bone yard are old and worn out. In fact, nearly all aircraft sent to the bone yard can fly again, otherwise they would just be scrapped in place. For example, last year, the air force retired the last of its 384 F-15A fighters. Long flown only by reserve units, these are old aircraft, all built in the 1970s. Air force reserve units got the F-15As in the 1980s and 1990s, as active duty units got the new F-15C. But now the F-22 is entering service, and more F-15Cs are going to the reserves. Many of those F-15A flew for over 30 years, and have all made their last flight to the bone yard.

[BlueDragon]

This makes me wonder about mothball procedures. How to protect rubber seals from drying out in the desert heat? ....stuff like that.

We might need or could use some of them, as long as there are still pilots that know how to fly them, active duty or not.

[BlueDragon]

...but most will be scavenged for parts, for those nations still flying what we sold them...

Did the U.S. ever sell any A-10's to other nations? I've not heard or read of it, if so.

[PhilosopherStone1000]

“Mothball” means “dead”. I used to go to school right outside the base wire at Davis-Monthon (Tucson, where planes go to die). You might be able to scavange parts off the planes, but none of them will be flyable after a year or two in the desert sun.

[mazda77]

. . . as opposed to sitting on the tarmack instead of the boneyard? There have been several planes reconditioned from their “mothball” state which is not dead as you claim. Many F-111’s come to me right off the top of my head.

The term was from putting seasonal clothing away protected by the mothballs from of all things moths that would eat away at the fibers if left without protection. This was a very common deal before the luxury of central heat and air systems when people used to keep their windows open while at home and that would let in the moths. Same thing with the aircraft at that particular location. That location was selected because it is the one place in the country where rust corrosion is least expected so that issue is what brought on the “mothball” moniker it has today.

I as well have been to the boneyards several times and what happens is each aircraft is prepared by wrapping the canopies, openings and windows to protect the interior from sun, sand and wind/dust damage. Critical components like engines and avionics are pulled for spare usage for still active aircraft or stored out of the weather. They won’t just chop them up later if there is a chance they can be sold to foreign allies or for replacement parts still. Even some of the “stripped” airframes will be sold as replacements for airframes that have gone past their safe lifespans due mostly to fatigue. So the old worn out airframe is scrapped and replaced by one with far less time on it from the boneyard.

As far as A-10’s being sold to other countries, that I do not know but the Air Force was about to mothball the entire fleet before Desert Storm. The aircraft really stood out even with its lacking of night vision avionics and targeting systems. The “Hog Drivers” simply adapted and used the Maverick Missle infra-read targeting cameras as their night vision capability to stunning success although it was like looking through a soda straw. The Air Force then went on a intensive campaign to refit its ace ground support aircraft with the new modern toys. What is seen in the boneyard today are mostly aircraft damaged from combat and airframes that have gone beyond their “safe” structural integrity lifespan.

[Psalm 73]

"...but none of them will be flyable after a year or two in the desert sun."

But haven't they been refurbishing F-4s at Davis-Monthon to be drone target aircraft?
Although a sad end to a great aircraft, it's more noble to meet one's demise at the business end of a Sidewinder than to slowly rot into oblivion.

[Hulka]

Never sold them outside the USAF, not one.

We have the Hog and when it strafes, it's like the “Fist of Gawd” pounding unholy muslim souls.

[Hulka]

Actually, not so. In the mid-90’s I worked in the Pentagon and we offered C-130B’s from the boneyard to several countries. There were offered under Section 519 as EDA (Excess Defense Article). The aircraft were at no cost but the countries had to pay the cost to knock the dust off and put the aircraft back into flying service, and they were ready to go for less than a couple of million---far less than a new/used (and still flying) aircraft.

We regenerate aircraft from there all the time.

[A.A. Cunningham]

but none of them will be flyable after a year or two in the desert sun.

You don't know what you are talking about.

[usmcobra]

Rubber seals on military aircraft are routinely changed every 100 flight hours or every 400 hours based upon what is called a phase cycle.

As part of the preservation process all fluids are drained from the aircraft and in some cases preservatives are put in in place to save those seals that cannot be removed without a complete teardown of a component.

Davis Monthan is not a junkyard, it is a storage facility where aircraft are stored until they are stricken from service.

[q_an_a]

I think there appears to be some value based upon your statement - but I also believe that there is far too much “saved” that could be used for many things. Taking apart the old aircraft and putting them back togeather would be great stuff for young kids or even older unemployed. Making them into “recycled” materials and trying to learn something NEW about building more cost effective planes - like the A10. War will be different for the next 50 years. Time to think with new eyes.

[ASOC]

I was in Tucson this Aug (not for the faint of heart) and visited D-M and the Pima Air Museum. I really enjoyed the PAM, well worth the few dollars. They now sell bits of older A/C as (talisman? Good luck charms?) - and they now have a full up B-36J on display.

It was sad to see mile after mile of C-130s, B-1s, F-14s and the like baking in the sun. Billions in cost, sitting in the dirt.

With google earth you can take a virtual tour and not melt in the hot sun....

[BlueDragon]

Thanks for the info. Your name here reminds me...
my father worked for Bell when the Cobra was first invented. He has some interesting stories how it came to be.

I have a picture of myself as a boy sitting in the pilot seat of ship #2, or #4. We were not any of the DFW facilities, but at a remote test location that was sort-of "off the books" at the time.

[BlueDragon]

Thanks, I sort of thought thought that was the case.
Goes through ammo like crazy, too. But what else would one expect from a flying 30mm rotary?

[Hulka]

That would be Arlington Municple Airport.

[Hulka]

That would be Arlington Municipal Airport.

[BlueDragon]

Yeah, the Arlington facility wasn't exactly on the official map in that when it first started, and it IS where some of the guys who originally came up with the idea were working. And that is where my father worked. For a long while, they sort-of had a "don't talk about it, much" policy concerning that plant.
Bell had something to do with building the airport, too...but I cannot remember exactly, even though I've had a freeper remind me of the details.

Even though the Arlington facility a little later became more openly a flight test facility, (multiple, everyday overhead flights will do that!) the photo I mentioned wasn't taken there. There would have been no way for us to get away with it there, anyway.

Out in Yuma, during some "put hours on the bird" type of flight testing, they once put me on the scale, then broke out that much ammo from what they were to carry, and I got to ride along as live, "dead weight".

But no early Cobra photos of me in Yuma, either---even though I did get to witness some early live fire rocket tests. Have a couple of old Polaroids of that stuff.

No photo of myself at Oklahoma proving grounds, either...but a few separate missions of flight testing of UH aircraft armed with 20mm and 30mm cannon in OK, did lead to the original germination of the idea of what became the Cobra. There were "ghost frequency" concerns associated with weapon recoil, on top of the other frequencies (vibrations) coursing through the airframe. On a trip back from OK, one of the test pilots broached the solution. Which became the Cobra.

But the photo I mentioned, taken just about the time it was becoming openly acknowledged that such a craft existed in the U.S. ...was taken in Colorado.

Before that, they hid 'em for a while. But used them covertly on a mission or two, smuggling special ops guys into foreign locations. Riding in the weapons bay must have been a bit uncomfortable... I've been told that only 2 of the first 4 special ops guys, made it back from their mission. I think both the birds made it both in, and out.

On another note concerning other than designed for use of that space;
Ship 4 was notorious for a while, of smelling strongly like kahlua liquor, in the weapons bay. Now how did that happen? ;^)

[Hulka]

Interesting.

In the early 70’s, I worked at the Arlington Airport, running the unicom and pumping gas. Great way for a HS student to make cash for his flying lessons.

Watched the Cobra's dance about the pattern and was in awe.