Mexican officials: No suspects in Hartley death, despite reports

Christian Science Monitor ^ | October 10th, 2010 | Christian Science Monitor

[LouieFisk]

"Mexican officials said Sunday they still had no suspects
and no body following the disappearance of a
McAllen man widely presumed dead after his wife
reported the couple came under attack by “pirates” 10 days
earlier on the Mexican side of Falcon Reservoir."

[Arizona Carolyn]

FYI investigators have already stated they had no financial problems AND unless there is a body you cannot collect life insurance....

[Arizona Carolyn]

Well, a police psychologist on HLN last Thursday evening stated that her inability to tell exactly the same story each time she discusses this case is actually a sign she is telling the truth, said people who create a story to cover a crime tell exactly the same story without any deviations, people who have been traumatized have problems remembering the incident properly at first and their story isn't always coherent from one interview to the next..... given my memory of things at the time my own husband died suddenly I can tell you the shrinks story syncs with my own confused thinking for quite a while -- you think you are okay and thinking straight, but actually it is anything but.<

Also.. she made a statement last week that only someone who has lost their spouse suddenly would say: She said "on one hand she knows he is gone, but on the other that he is going to walk through the door....." I can tell you absolutely that is how you feel when someone you love very much is suddenly gone and you were happy one minute and then in a flash it is all ripped away.

[LouieFisk]

"investigators have already stated they had no financial problems"

Which investigators, Carolyn, you have a link for that info?

"unless there is a body you cannot collect life insurance...."

That's a common urban myth-type misperception, a person can be declared dead by a court even though no body is produced. Also, keep in mind that many bodies were never recovered after the 9-11 terrorist attacks.

[LouieFisk]

Arizona Carolyn -
A little background on "Death in absentia":

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_in_absentia#United_States

[Arizona Carolyn]

Both on Fox News Saturday evening and an hour-long report on HLN Thursday evening. You want to think the worst of this woman, I happen to believe her and have been paying close attention to this, including that MEXICAN boats searching for his body were fired on this weekend in the area of the church they had been visiting.

[RWGinger]

Actually that makes sense. Thank you for explaining it

The other bottom line issue is even if they were there to buy drugs that doesn’t mean he deserved to die over it

I have no doubt the murderers took his body and his jet ski.

Whether they were just foolish or buying drugs he did not deserve to be murdered by thugs

[LouieFisk]

"You want to think the worst of this woman"

No, just interested in the facts of the situation wherever they may lead. If I've written anything that is incorrect, I welcome you to point it out so I can stand corrected.

"I happen to believe her"

That's fine - it doesn't matter what you, me or anyone may believe on this. But as you've noted, the inconsistent stories are of interest. For example, she says that she fled on her jetski, outrunning the pirates to make an escape as bullets whizzed by her head and hit the water around her. In another telling on the Today Show the pirates talk to one another, decide not to shoot her and then they just leave the scene. Quite a very big difference there.

[Arizona Carolyn]

What she said was they talked with each other while pointing their guns at her and she was terrified, they then suddenly went to the main boat that was nearby (a common thing with pirates to have a main boat and little runner boats) and when they did that she took off on the jet ski (have you ever riden a jet ski? They go very fast and you can zig and zag them easily while doing so)......... at that point the pirates gave chase and were firing at her. That is entirely believable if you have been following pirate events around the world, as I have, and reading the stories of the attacks on private yachts.... for example in the Caribbean around Venezuala and up toward Panama. There is actually a map you can click on to show the attacks around the world and read the accounts. Her account has a ring of truth to me... and I honestly think she may well have had some divine intervention in her escape...

[Arizona Carolyn]

I think the drug gang removed his body and the jet ski. They could have easily removed his vest, but his body would not stay submerged, so they really had to move it to land to hide the evidence.

[Arizona Carolyn]

It appears they were such outdoorsy people that I have a hard time believing this was a drug thing, she said he was a history buff and really wanted to see the church. I find that believable...

[LouieFisk]

"she said he was a history buff and really wanted to see the church. I find that believable"

I'm also a history buff, but they's no way I'm gonna illegally cross 2-3 miles into Mexican Territory to a place controlled by violent drug cartels just to take a snapshot!

[Arizona Carolyn]

The church was out of water due to the drought lowering the lake levels... sadly, it seems the church area is currently a very active area with the cartel. On April 30th a boat carrying five American tourists was robbed at the church, in May a fisherman who drifted over the border was almost taken by a boat the had “gamewardin” duct taped to the boat and when he fled they fired at him...

[LouieFisk]

Yeah, Carolyn, even setting aside this story and others, I really don’t know why anyone would venture into the area. I mean, there are certain parts of most large US cities that I’d avoid taking a stroll around in for fun!

[Arizona Carolyn]

So do I, yet people do and they end up dead.

[Hawthorn]

>> AND unless there is a body you cannot collect life insurance <<

I don't think that's necessarily the case. The law may vary from state to state. But then I'm hardly an expert on insurance.

In any case, the couple may have thought they could collect if he simply disappeared without a trace. And/or maybe they thought they could bribe Mexican officials into issuing a death certificate.

(It's my impression that life insurance scams with fake foreign death certificates are fairly common.)

[Arizona Carolyn]

I assume you have both seen this:

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/10/12/mexican-police-official-investigating-border-lake-shooting-dead/

[AuntB]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/10/12/mexican-police-official-investigating-border-lake-shooting-dead/http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/10/12/mexican-police-official-investigating-border-lake-shooting-dead/

[snip]Dennis Hartley, David Hartley’s father, expressed shock and regret at Flores’ killing.

“I just, I’m in shock about this right now,” he told The Associated Press from his Colorado home. “I really don’t have any hope that David will be found. I really hate other people putting their lives at stake. We don’t need more sons lost. If this is true, I’m just really heart broken that this happened.”

A spokesman for Perry said the governor was being briefed and was expected to comment later Tuesday.

[Arizona Carolyn]

thanks, AuntB

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

Bump!