Posted on 09/21/2010 7:23:16 PM PDT by marktwain
MADISON, Wis. -- Culver's Corp. is evaluating the possible need for a policy addressing handguns in its restaurants.
The issue came to light after an incident at the East Towne Culver's on Saturday evening.
Five members of the open-carry advocacy group, Wisconsin Carry, met to eat dinner and socialize. The men were all legally openly carrying firearms.
"They started to notice a police presence was gathering around the building so they suspected that somebody had called the police regarding them because they had firearms," said Auric Gold, the group's secretary.
Madison police confirmed that a call was placed to them by a concerned woman who had seen the men in the restaurant.
"She sees some of these people with guns on their hips, and she's concerned enough to call us saying she feels that if she doesn't call and something horrible happens, she would feel terrible that she didn't call," said Joel DeSpain, Madison Police Department spokesman. "She said they weren't doing anything but she thinks we should check it out."
Police responded to the call by approaching the men with the complaint and asking to see identification, WISC-TV reported.
"These individuals were not given any choice; they were simply told they have to provide their ID or they'll be cited for refusal to do it -- for obstruction," said Gold.
"Two of the individuals would not produce identification, saying they didn't need to because they're law-abiding citizens," said DeSpain. "The officers said, 'That's probably the case but we'd like to check it out.'"
The two men who refused to provide identification were handcuffed, ticketed for obstruction of justice and searched until identification was found, police said.
Once police knew they were not felons, their guns were returned.
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Members of the group contend they were not trying to set up police, even though some members were wearing wires to record any such confrontation, WISC-TV reported.
"They didn't come out there with the intention of challenging the law," said Gold. "They didn't come out there with the intention of having an encounter with police. They came out to have a meal, to get to know each other and to socialize. It's as simple as that."
Group members said they believe police might be trying to set them up.
DeSpain said police would not have known the men were having dinner if they hadn't received a complaint.
DeSpain said the group walked around the Capitol and down State Street armed late last winter and had no problems with police. He said there were no complaints.
"If you're a law-abiding citizen, certainly the law in this state is that you can have open carry," said DeSpain. "It's your Second Amendment right and we respect that. But we still need to find out what people are doing when they walk around with guns on their hips because people do get concerned."
Wisconsin Carry said it has its legal counsel looking into whether rights were violated over the weekend. Gold said it would be up to individuals whether or not they pursued legal action on their own.
One man who received a citation for obstruction of justice recently won a settlement from the city of Racine and Racine Police Department for a similar incident.
Madison police said they are also re-evaluating the citations issued on Saturday. Police said the citations could possibly be changed to disorderly conduct.
Culver's Corp. is not making a formal statement regarding the incident, only saying that it's now looking into the possibility of crafting a policy addressing the issue.
Culver's legal counsel is consulting with the Wisconsin Restaurant Association on what action to take.
Culver's said it supports a person's Second Amendment rights and is not taking sides on the issue. However, Culver's said it plans to have a policy addressing the issue in the next few weeks.
Auric Gold? I read that book!
Well I hope Culvers stands by the constitution because I like the place.
This is what it is coming to... Police (government) against law abiding citizens. Not sure how this can be corrected.
You have normal citizens thinking that people carrying guns are a problem - maybe that is where teachable moments should occur.
Or...maybe the law enforcement officers need additonal training. Not sure where this ends...
Somebody with better experience let me know...
In other words, "We don't care what the law says. We're cops and we're going to do what we want."
Get a lawyer. Unless you are operating a vehicle on a public street, you have no obligation to show ANY LEO your "papers".
Hopefully you’ll be able to put the CBST to use. Oh, and thanks again for the ammo advise. I’m gettin range ready. Report coming soon!!
They should have said they were illegal immigrants and hussein says we don't have to show no stinkin' papers!
We like it here too!!
Better butter burger thingy, whatever they call it. It’s good.
Can we all say, “violation of civil rights under color of law?” I’m sure the PD and these cops will learn what that means. BTW, immunity is waived by law - hope he goes after the cops personally.
And its the only place in Texas that I know of that sells frozen custard!
“Auric Gold, the group’s secretary.”
LOL
Wow, I’m hungry now.
Well done! And it's recorded? LOL. The cop's answer proves that he didn't have "reasonable suspicion" that they were committing a crime. He therefore had no right to demand identification. That means the arrest and ticket was unconstitutional, as in a violation of civil rights. Oooops. The tickets don't provide cover. They might if a "cover story" made after the fact could be ginned up to show reasonable suspicion, but the cop's answer negates that. These guys definitely know their rights, and this is going to end well. For them.
Me too.
Culver restaurants?
what is the name of the restaurants?
It would seem commercial suicide to decide agains these people. (also clearly state easy robbery target)
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