Mrs. OLA driving the BBB.
Cheers,
OLA
Posted on 04/18/2010 11:18:35 PM PDT by CutePuppy
The federal government is rethinking the way to calculate fuel-efficiency ratings for electric vehicles, a move that will likely result in a significant reduction in the miles-per-gallon claims some auto makers have touted for the battery-powered cars they plan to launch later this year.
Using a preliminary formula released by the Environmental Protection Agency, General Motors Co. last year announced its Chevy Volt would be rated at 230 miles per gallon in city driving, and Nissan Motor Co. said its Leaf electric car would get the equivalent of 367 mpg.
But now the agency is in the midst of finalizing that formula in a way that will deliver more down-to-earth mileage ratings, according to several people familiar with the situation.
"We're working with EPA staff on testing of labels that will provide meaningful information to the consumer," GM spokesman Greg Martin said this week. "What we're finding is that the Volt and other electric vehicles defy conventional mileage labels."
An EPA spokeswoman said the agency hasn't made a decision on testing electric vehicles.
The mileage expectation reflected a new methodology for electric and plug-in hybrid cars that factored in electricity used to try to reach a miles-per-gallon equivalent. The intent was to allow consumers to measure the vehicles against conventional gasoline-powered autos. The final figures will do the same, but the EPA is trying to come up with better ways to compare electric power with gasoline.
To calculate a miles-per-gallon figure for a vehicle that runs either partially or fully on battery power, GM had cited an EPA formula that attempts to convert electric-energy consumption into a gasoline equivalent. The Department of Energy process cited by Nissan considers 82 kilowatt hours of electricity to be equivalent to one gallon of gasoline.
.....
Both automakers have since toned down the statements.
.....
(Excerpt) Read more at online.wsj.com ...
How about energy $/mi?
That’s the correct idea!
Miles per dollar.
including taxes.
I found that quote from GM guy hilarious.
They don’t even get to $/mi and how long they will need to charge, and the entire issues with mobility (which is why they need dual-mode / backup generator or engine) though electric drive train has some advantages.
Didn’t you hear? “Electridicy is fwee.”
Greetings CutePuppy:
Dual mode is an absolute necessity. We have an rechargable 4WD ulility vehicle for our farm, a Bad Boy Buggy. We love our BBB. But given the rugged terrain, even with new batteries; the BBB was never good for the advertised travel distance/time frame between battery charges.
And we learned the hard way early on. The BBB quit in a ravine, about a mile from home. We had to tow the BBB up the hill and home to the wall outlet.
Cheers,
OLA
That is exactly my thought from the beginning of the electric car hype. The mpg ratings have been bogus and misleading, ignoring the total energy cost.
My bet is it won't look so impressive when you run the engine to charge the battery. Just like a Prius gets less than my daughters Cougar and the Cougar will blow the Prius doors off. We once took a trip to Alabama with 3 people and a full trunk and averaged 39.8 mpg. Many hybrids brag about less than 35 mpg. Even in town driving is usually over 32 mpg for her Cougar.
The Volt would be great if you live less than 20 miles from work. Otherwise the engine will charge the battery and that will be the average cost per mile with or without a charge. It will look good because you are basically "coasting" for 40 miles without gas. I figure it shouldn't cost $3-$5 for an overnight charge. At $3 a day, that could be $60 a month not counting gasoline.
They finally figured out that dualmode is a necessity (both for energy availability and redundancy, unless it’s a special purpose / light use / limited range government vehicle), but not only this adds significantly to the cost of vehicle but also puts entire all-electric idea into doubt for mass consumption.
And we are not even talking about the infrastructure and time necessary for charging the batteries. Until and unless they come up with the high capacity portable (drop-in) replacement batteries infrastructure (available in the stations and/or convenience stores) all-electrics will not become a reality in significant percentage of general consumer ownership.
Yeah, it doesn’t take too long or that much effort to figure out the real costs and understand that math just doesn’t work.
That’s probably one reason they keep trying to sell the hybrids and alternative-fuel vehicles on the “save the planet” argument. Of course, that’s because electricity and alternative fuels are “clean” and “green” and are generated “somewhere else” (but not in Saudi Arabia, Iraq or other “evil oil countries”) so it doesn’t cause “pollution” or “global warming”.
I know it was not a funny situation, but this would be my luck. It’s like my cell phone, many times I have forgotten to charge it and dropped a call. Not cool to drop a ride though.
You forgot to add the “unexpectedly lower” MPG tag. Remember it’s not lying or statistical manipulation if you just add that phrase. We all know the EPA is our friend and would never engage in bad science.
Mrs. OLA driving the BBB.
Cheers,
OLA
Not much good at math but an energy dollar isn’t a constant, is it?
On the highway, I can get nearly 30mpg in my 2003 Cadillac DeVille DHS and 24mpg around town. Tell me, who wants to drive cross country in a Cadillac vs a Volt, or a Prius, or a Smart Car? And that’s with a fully loaded trunk, 2 people, and large dog!
I got to see my Volt Engr-ing "gnome" @ a tea party rally on the 15th. Yes it is getting close to a go.
This is a knife in Bob Lutz's heart after he leaves.
It was Lutz's goal to esentially show the stupidity in the EPA/Joan Claybrook system by obliterating it with a paradigm changing drivetrain. The EPA eventually had to agree with their request for a waiver for how the mileage was to be calculated because the way the driveline works is so different it didn't fit in their narrow minded fedzilla mindset boxes.
Like Pelosi's comback after the Scott Brown Victory, it is becoming obvious we are dealing with a different vampire here....
A gasoline pump transfers energy at about 10 Megawatts, a 25 AMP/220 Volt circuit a much more modest 0.0055 Megawatts.
I wonder how many people are going to be electrocuted or die in fires resulting from automobile recharging systems. The electric car is the most hair brained idea of this century. Or as President Obama would phrase it, the beginning of good, sustainable green jobs.
I have a friend who got laid off at 64 from HP (he worked for a unit acquired from DEC). For a retirement job he's working pro-bono for a company that does photovoltaic installations. The cost of a home system is about $35,000 dollars. About $14,000 can be recovered as a tax credit. That means that the home owner is still on the hook for $21,000. For that $21,000 the home owner has the opportunity to generate some of his own electricity, worth about $0.16/kW-hr and to wholesale some electricity to the power company at $0.08/kW-Hr. For a typical home owner whose electric bill is about $80/month the payback period would exceed well over 20 years (he's only able to generate some of his own electricity and then only when the sunshines) assuming that he can borrow money interest free, and there are no associated maintenance costs. One other offset is that the electric companies are compelled to pay $0.50/kW-HR for "carbon credits"!, which still doesn't make this scheme economically viable, or as as President Obama would phrase it, these are good, sustainable green jobs. Photovoltaics are the second most hairbrained scheme of this century.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.