Posted on 03/24/2010 3:25:32 PM PDT by lmsii
Just a Question for Discussion.
What would the existing Federal Government do?
Good news from Michigan...still waiting for Vermont!
That’s a nice list
I’m not sure we want all 50, this would be a great opportunity to get rid of a few of the more liberal states.
In the end if we have that much of a majority the Federal government will have no choice but to accept disillusionment.
“I, too, served in the military, and I come from a military family. I know that we took an oath to uphold the constitution, but who decides what is constitutional and what is unconstitutional? If the Supreme Court ruled that something was unconstitutional and the POTUS tried to enforce something that was blatantly unconstitutional, that would be an clear cut decision. But what if the Supreme Court decided that something that in the view of most citizens was unconstitutional as constitutional? Would that make it constitutional? Even if something is ruled constitutional, that does not make it right. To take an oath to uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States is not as easy as it sounds. The Nazis took an oath to their Constitution, too, and they were still condemned as war criminals.”
The United States Supreme court does not have the final word on what is and what is not Constitutional. If it did then there would be no Constitution, only a Supreme court.
The authority instead rest with we the people, and as our tools our States.
Just like the rest of MI could get along a whole lot better without the Detroit/Flint/Jackson corner.
Yeah, uh what if some people don’t want to; and some states; and what about the Constitution; and what about the “new” Constitution; etc.
IMHO, the better approach is to let Brainiac shrink the country down like City of Kandor, then get another bottle for all the ones who want out of Bottle 1.
parsy, the practical
Yeah I could stand to leave Kalifornia and Washington out of the mix. In fact we could mandate all liberals in the states other than Kali and Wash would have to move there and all the Conservatives from those two would come to our States.
The Moderates can all move to Canada.
“The federal government keeps the union together by force of arms. That was the lesson learned from the Civil War. “
It was actually The War Between the States. The Federal Government had a little over 16,000 men in the Regular Army at the beginning. At First Manassas they had something over 35,000, not Regular Army but volunteers from the Northern States. Without the agreement of the Northern States and Northerner volunteers in the beginning, Southern secession likely would not have been stopped.
“As long as the federal government controls the army, much as Rome ruled by the loyalty of the military to Caesar, the imperial hegemony in Washington rules by force. “
The armed forces consist of people from the States mostly. It is paid and supplied with money the fed gov gets from the States (OK, that’s theoretical. They may actually borrow the money.) Out military has no Caesar. If the 50 States decided to eliminate the fed gov, the fed gov would be limited in the amount of force it could apply to them.
“If the military refused to enforce the POTUS’ orders, many states would leave and form a far better government than the one that we have now. “
Not if current State governments are an indication of the government they would form.
“Even if all 50 states decided to form their own government, Washington would not allow that to happen. We would have martial law declared throughout all 50 states and the leaders declared terrorists.”
If all 50 states decided to form a new national government, Washington wouldn’t have the ability to stop them.
“Two years after the Panic of 1893, the US government came close to bankruptcy.”
Oh and we are not at bankruptcy now? Something else happened under Wilsons terms..the Federal Reserve act. That is why our money is worthless.
“We would have martial law declared throughout all 50 states and the leaders declared terrorists.”
Who would enforce It? King obuma’s fat welfare momma brigade doesn’t even have a CP, let alone a squad leader.
The last poll of military officers showed that 90% of them classified themselves as Republican or conservative. Any call-up of the military to attack American civilians is extremely dangerous for king obuma. It’s more likely that the guns will be turned against the federal fascists.
Back then, bankruptcy meant that the USG had run out of money. That is the height of solvency compared to where we stand now, with an estimated $100T in debt and promissory debt. There is no conceivable way around that, other than default.
However, that being said, default may not be as bad as all that. Several States defaulted in the Andrew Jackson caused Panic of 1837, and many nations have done so in the modern area. Portugal just had its debt downgraded to AA, and Greece will likely default to receive an IMF bailout, since the EU have told them to go fish.
A US default will force the feds into a surplus budget, and it will kill imports except for commodities swaps. So if the US wants it, it will have to make it here, which will strongly stimulate the economy.
You have way too much time on your hands.
So General Stupid marches his band of mass murderers through Oceanside and Huntington Beach and kills a few dozen families of Marines. What does General Stupid do when the 1st Marine Division pours out of Camp Pendleton and attacks him, while the 3rd MAW is bombing his flanks? What does General Stupid do when he calls his CP and finds it in flames and his staff hanging from trees?
Yep, sending the military out to massacre civilians will do wonders for inter-service cooperation and unity.
There are no enemy frontlines. There are no enemy camps.
So maybe in your world you’d follow Gen. Stupid. Not in mine.
“Again, who decides what is constitutional and what is not? The authority to determine what is constitutional and what is not is not given to the people to decide, but to the Supreme Court to decide. The Constitution established the judicial branch of government for that purpose. If every person in the United States decided that something was constitutional, except five people on the Supreme Court that decided that it was unconstitutional, it would be ruled unconstitutional. There is a way for the states to change the Constitution by adding amendments. The interpretation of the Constitution is the purview of the Supreme Court.”
The power is not given to the courts either, but the people thou their states granted that power(individually) in joining the union in the first place therefore they must have the deciding what powers they individually agreed to grant.
So to be quite frank, We never ceded that final power, wisely as there can be no way to for such a constitution to serve its function of protecting us from the excesses of the government it creates if the same government is the Final judge of its own authority under that Constitution.
PS: one thing you need to know about the 3 branches and the court is they have the power to enforce the constitution which is to decide something is not constitutional, not to decide something is Constitutional. Because for something to be Constitutional the people thou their states would have had to grant the power to do that thing.
Thus only the people can decided if something is constitutional, but the court in upholding its oath just like the military and the other 2 branches can decide that something is not constitutional and simply not preform the function.
This is no anarchy as remember the people have 1 or 2 other far more general governments, in the form of their state and local governments, the State at least has all the practical domestic responsibility and it also had a practical defense capability in the ability to wage war if invaded or attacked.(using the militia).
So don’t think this is a careless system as it could easily break down, its made to break down(not work) rather then work tyrannically. That was the whole point of checks and balances!
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