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The Mysterious Missing Missiles
The Strategy Page ^ | 3/04/2010 | The Strategy Page

Posted on 03/04/2010 10:12:52 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld

In the last few years, intelligence analysts have noted that very few portable anti-aircraft missiles have been discovered in any of the thousands of Taliban and al Qaeda weapons caches found in Afghanistan. It is generally believed, at least by the mass media, that there are thousands of these portable missiles, particularly the Russian SAM-7 (and some later versions) on the black market. Maybe, but not really. Part of the reason is that it is easy to track a missile, used in a successful attack on military or commercial aircraft, to the country (or even factory) or origin. For that reason, few of these missiles apparently make it into the black market, and many of those that are there, are too old to be useful. The manufacturers do not want to take the heat for a crashed airliner. It's bad for business. While the SAM-7 is still made, many of those available to terrorists are old and basically useless. Some later model Russian missiles have been recovered in anti-terrorist raids in Iraq, and some of these also had become inoperative due to age or poor handling. There are still some American Stinger missiles from the 1980s Afghan war out there, but their batteries have long since died, rendering the missiles useless. Russian made missiles suffer from the same problems, and all these missiles have other components, like the rocket motor, that do not age well.

(Excerpt) Read more at strategypage.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: afghanistan; alqaeda; fim92; manpads; portablemissiles; sa7; sa7grail; sam7; stingermissiles; taliban
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1 posted on 03/04/2010 10:12:52 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld
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To: sonofstrangelove

Mostly used up in IED/Road-Side bomb type devices over the past few years?


2 posted on 03/04/2010 10:18:09 PM PST by Imperialist
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To: Imperialist
Maybe. But that still does not account the glut of Stinger missiles given to the Mujaheddin in 1980s and Russian SA-7 missiles.
3 posted on 03/04/2010 10:19:56 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld ("I have learned to use the word "impossible" with the greatest caution."-Dr.Wernher Von Braun)
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To: sonofstrangelove

I’m not so worried about SA-7s - they have a nasty habit of not working at all, and an even nastier habit of exploding-on-launch. Some of them even have an amusing habit of circling back on launch and blowing up the guy who launched it.

You would have better results with massed rifle fire.


4 posted on 03/04/2010 10:20:44 PM PST by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: sonofstrangelove
Most Afghan anti-air systems are in the heavy machine gun range, they sometimes fire RPG's against helo's but the inaccuracy of those weapons means they have to get lucky to hit anything. They do have a very few missile based anti-air systems, but they are very expensive and hard to transport, which makes them less than ideal.

The Muj had the US spending a billion a year supplying them with arms (including sophisticated anti-air systems) when they fought against the Russians, Iran isn't spending that much or giving them as good weaponry. Most people don't remember (and the Afghans being primary here) that it was the US, Pakistan and Egypt that really won them their victory against the Russians, now they have no allies.

Without a major state backing them, the Taleban are just primatives using small arms and some RPG's. Why else do you think they've turned to the IED as their weapon of choice.

5 posted on 03/04/2010 10:22:44 PM PST by world weary
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To: Spktyr

The CIA shipped a batch of 300 Stingers to the rebels in 1986 and 700 more the following year. Where are they?


6 posted on 03/04/2010 10:23:21 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld ("I have learned to use the word "impossible" with the greatest caution."-Dr.Wernher Von Braun)
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To: sonofstrangelove

Any Stinger missiles issued to the Muj in the 80s are now dead, their chemical batteries and argon injection system having long since expired.

Even if you somehow managed to recharge the units, you really don’t want to fire them because after about 10 years the solid rocket motor starts developing cracks and other problems. At which point - explode-on-launch.


7 posted on 03/04/2010 10:23:53 PM PST by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Spktyr

It is rumored that some made it way to North Korea to fix the power problem.


8 posted on 03/04/2010 10:25:08 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld ("I have learned to use the word "impossible" with the greatest caution."-Dr.Wernher Von Braun)
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To: sonofstrangelove

I guess you would have to count the number of SOviet aircraft splattered across the sandbox, for a start, eh?


9 posted on 03/04/2010 10:27:04 PM PST by ASOC (In case of attack, tune to 640 kilocycles or 1240 kilocycles on your AM dial.)
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To: Spktyr

The mujahideen also dispensed Stingers to their Islamic allies. Among the lucky recipients were rebel groups in places like Tajikistan, Chechnya, and Algeria. Meanwhile, the Pentagon approved the sale of Stingers to at least 21 countries, mostly NATO allies but also Israel, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, and South Korea. The Soviets stole design data and Stinger components from the Greek army and used the information to build the SAM-14 Gremlin, which is said to be a virtual copy of the Stinger


10 posted on 03/04/2010 10:27:07 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld ("I have learned to use the word "impossible" with the greatest caution."-Dr.Wernher Von Braun)
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To: sonofstrangelove

The Stinger’s been cloned elsewhere, too - but the original Stingers we issued the Muj are long dead. If you somehow found a lone survivor and managed to overhaul the BCU unit (good luck with that), it would almost certainly explode when you fired it. The BCU can only last five years and the rocket motor ten at the outside.


11 posted on 03/04/2010 10:27:51 PM PST by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: sonofstrangelove

I dunno, there have been probably thousands of IED explosions over the past 5 years in ‘stan and Iraq... Some pretty big ones too... If they can’t fly, blow’em on the ground? Just saying...


12 posted on 03/04/2010 10:27:58 PM PST by Imperialist
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To: ASOC

It was a very effective anti-aircraft weapon.


13 posted on 03/04/2010 10:28:23 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld ("I have learned to use the word "impossible" with the greatest caution."-Dr.Wernher Von Braun)
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To: sonofstrangelove

Yes, but those aren’t going to be the original Stingers we issued to the Angolans or Muj any more and therefore aren’t our responsibility.


14 posted on 03/04/2010 10:30:05 PM PST by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Spktyr

But we knew who had them


15 posted on 03/04/2010 10:31:40 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld ("I have learned to use the word "impossible" with the greatest caution."-Dr.Wernher Von Braun)
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To: sonofstrangelove

They have aged and are inoperative.


16 posted on 03/04/2010 10:37:56 PM PST by Eagles6 ( Typical White Guy: Christian, Constitutionalist, Heterosexual, Redneck.)
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To: sonofstrangelove

So? What difference does that make in a world where the Soviets/Russians and Chinese hand out MANPADS to nearly anyone for free and the French will sell anything they have for cheap?

By the way, the SA-14 was also a sick joke; and it predates the Stinger. The SA-18 (current Russian MANPADS) predates the Stinger transfers, too, and it still isn’t nearly as effective, even given the latest upgrades.

I would be MORE worried about just where all of the French Mistral missiles have gone.


17 posted on 03/04/2010 10:39:31 PM PST by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Eagles6

The Russians reversed engineered the Stinger in built the SA-14 Gremlin. There are clones out there


18 posted on 03/04/2010 10:39:58 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld ("I have learned to use the word "impossible" with the greatest caution."-Dr.Wernher Von Braun)
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To: Spktyr

But there are clones of the Stinger out there and makes them dangerous as the parent.


19 posted on 03/04/2010 10:41:06 PM PST by ErnstStavroBlofeld ("I have learned to use the word "impossible" with the greatest caution."-Dr.Wernher Von Braun)
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To: sonofstrangelove

That’s an interesting comment considering the SA-14 entered service in 1974 and the Stinger entered service in 1981.

I’m pretty sure they didn’t reverse engineer something that first appeared 7 years in the future.


20 posted on 03/04/2010 10:44:15 PM PST by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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