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To: Windflier
I appreciate that you're offended. This subject is intrinsically offensive. But if we don't honestly address the offensive realities of race relations in America verbally, we in this nation will eventually be forced to address them physically.

That being said, I wonder if you could address the point under contention: namely, that some sort of "tribal instinct" lies at the root of the problems blacks have in every part of the world. There must be some reason that Detroit, East St. Louis, and Africa are hellholes, after all. Would you care to speculate on that reason, or do we have to stop talking about this now because you've become offended?

330 posted on 12/09/2009 8:51:11 PM PST by B-Chan (Catholic. Monarchist. Texan. Any questions?)
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To: B-Chan

Tossing out “tribalism” is a collective condemnation. On the whole, black people in the United States have never been allowed to develop a successful social structure. The closest they’ve come was in the “parallel downtowns” of segregated cities, not that forced segregation was right, but there was a merchant class, a professional class, upward mobility and standards of behavior that were upheld.

A wrongheaded approach to desegregation resulted in the destruction of these areas, which were deemed “blighted” and replaced for the most part with federally subsidized structures, bleak public housing, and other visible signs, of the apparatus of dependence. Every leftist effort to “help” since, has encouraged and furthered that dependence. No standards of behavior have been allowed to stand, they’ve been undermined.

Substance abuse, popularized by and defended by the left. Sexual promiscuity, forced into the public eye and made acceptable by the left. Affirmative action, leading to the elevation of black women over black men in the extreme, plus the derogation of marriage has relegated black men almost to the role of bedouin sperm donors ... on and on, it’s been absolutely poisonous, so much so that the Democrats of old, the segregationists and the Klan, couldn’t have destroyed black males more thoroughly if they’d never stopped being segregationist Klan.

That’s what is offensive about a sweeping generalization. Every people has some degree of “tribal” impulse, we seem hardwired for it. People generally trust and associate with those most like themselves, and begin to venture beyond that once a level of comfort and security in society is reached. We’ve seen this occur with every large wave of immigration, of people distinctive enough to have ever been considered “other,” for however brief or lengthy a time.

So long as this association, or the lack of it, is free of force, then there’s nothing inherently wrong with that. It’s a choice, and it’s human nature. Forcing separation, and then imagining that forcing no separation repairs the past, was the genuine fool’s errand. Layer upon layer of force in the opposite direction, layer upon layer of attempts to equalize outcomes with the removal of consequence and the removal of reward, has compounded the problem, to the point that a large number of the black male population in many cities, verges upon becoming feral. There’s no penalty for it, and pop culture glorifies it.

And so, here we are.


339 posted on 12/09/2009 9:24:39 PM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: B-Chan
I wonder if you could address the point under contention: namely, that some sort of "tribal instinct" lies at the root of the problems blacks have in every part of the world.

People like me put the lie to the "tribal instinct" theory. If you want to test that theory, go live in the black community for a couple of years and really get to know people. You'll find out what a complete, and destructive lie that is.

I won't deny that black communities (and nations) everywhere in the world are basically dysfunctional. As far as I can determine, this degraded state of being among blacks has been intentionally caused by malevolent forces. Mostly of the leftist variety.

Blacks who aren't born into the confines of these decrepit communities are totally unlike those they share skin color with. They're more mainstream, and most consider themselves as Americans first, with their race only being of secondary importance.

There isn't a "failure gene", or a "tribal instinct" at work here. What there is, is aculturation and indoctrination from a young age, that sets in place a certain mindset.

This is precisely why I refused to allow my own children to be born in, or to be raised in a monolithic black community. There's a contagion of aberration there that I'm unwilling to allow them to be exposed to.

When I was a youngster, I knew a few white families that never left with the rest of the "white flight". I went to school with some of those kids, and they were alculturated nearly identically to the rest of the kids in the neighborhood. Even their speaking voices were identical to the rest of the community. They knew they were "different", but the black community was all they knew. They fit in pretty well, in that day and age. The boys of one family (the Hubers) were all successively stars on our high school football team.

340 posted on 12/09/2009 9:29:58 PM PST by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: B-Chan
That being said, I wonder if you could address the point under contention: namely, that some sort of "tribal instinct" lies at the root of the problems blacks have in every part of the world. There must be some reason that Detroit, East St. Louis, and Africa are hellholes, after all. Would you care to speculate on that reason, or do we have to stop talking about this now because you've become offended?

Should we just assume that all Irish are lazy drunks who want to fight and have kids based on everything that was said about them in the past or perhaps we should we call them all religious extremist terrorists based on what happened from the 1960s through the late 1990s?

My guess is that you've never met a black person in your life.
405 posted on 12/10/2009 8:38:52 PM PST by af_vet_rr
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