Marx gets Vatican thumbs up

http://beta.thehindu.com/news/international/article37253.ece ^

[kronos77]

Amid the worst recession in generations, Karl Marx, who famously described religion as “the opium of the people”, got a thumbs up from the Vatican overturning a century of Catholic hostility to his creed.

Marx, who predicted that capitalism would be destroyed by its internal contradictions, has joined Galileo, Charles Darwin and Oscar Wilde on a growing list of historical figures to have undergone an unlikely reappraisal by the Roman Catholic Church, The Times newspaper said on Thursday.

The British daily, quoting the Vatican newspaper L’Osservatore Romano, said Marx’s early critiques of capitalism had highlighted the “social alienation” felt by the “large part of humanity” that remained excluded from economic and political decision-making.

Amid signs of recovery in global financial markets, Christian leaders have flayed the capitalist system for displaying a lack of moral values, arguing that ethical debates needs to be given greater prominence.

Georg Sans, a German-born professor of the history of contemporary philosophy at the pontifical Gregorian University, argues that Marx’s work remained especially relevant today as mankind was seeking “a new harmony” between its needs and the natural environment.

The report quoted Prof. Sans as saying that Marx’s theories may help to explain the enduring issue of income inequality within capitalist societies.

[Mad Dawg]

I’m going to be spending the 2nd week of November in Youngstown at the priory there. I’ll see if I can pick up some history of ethnic parishes and canons and stuff.

[Just mythoughts]

The view Protestants have of the Church starts with the assumption that there is a kind of Secret Police which knows what everyone is thinking and doing and which immediately and effectively suppresses what it doesn't like.

There is NOTHING secret about what Nanny state Pelosi or that old 'lion' that just left the Senate socialistic/marixst believe. So please do not tell me what I view or what I assume to be regarding the workings out of Rome. Christ said you can know them by their fruits.

And there is NO secret that both of these peoples have/had connections right to the seat in Rome.

And it is no secret that some in the hierarchy do in fact push for and demand universal health care if funding for abortion is dropped.

Welll in my world there is NOT a heap bit of difference in 'pills for old American grandmas instead of procedures' to save the almighty dollar. And I heard not 'get behind me' calls when BamaKennedy told one of his religious backers about his partnership with his god deciding who lives and who dies.

It is downright amusing to read the unadulterated hate filled ridicule toward protestants while disregarding with the complete and total blindness to what actually is taking place. I continually read about the mean evil press picking on the Church, when everybody know those heretic protestants are far worse. I know personally what it means to be non-Catholic to Catholics. That is ok because that is what they have drummed into their heads first and foremost.

Now I have stated that I believe with my whole being that every individual has the God given 'right' to choose which path they will take. But I have that same God given 'right', and your rights in the Heavenly Father's eyes do not supersede my rights. I am NOT pushing my beliefs upon anyone but I am taking a stand against those who use the government to do their work.

I can look at nations all around this globe where in those billion + members reside and I can compare and contrast standards and blessings borne out of what our founders founded. Christ said there would always be poor among us, but He never said that it was the Church or any governments duty to take from one by law and give to another. Charity is not and cannot be legislated or it is NOT charity.

Obviously there is a problem in what type of food gets served and what Christ was instructing those who come in His name are serving up. Now I personally speaking find a mountain of hypocrisy of any religious leader sitting upon a vast treasury telling me that it is my duty to pay the way for 'illegal' acts and solicit illegal activity and send me the bill.

And if you read what I did say before there is but ONE Heavenly Father who created all souls, and there is but ONE Savior that IF the individual chooses, but there are named 7 churches. Now just who is it that I protest?

[Mad Dawg]

First FYI. I am a convert to Catholicism. Nobody drummed anything into my head. I converted knowing full well that scoundrels like Kennedy and Pelousy were more likely to get face time with the Pope than I was. Face time with the Pope is not high on my list, much as I love this guy.

Second, I am simply not going to engage further until we reach an agreement about the mendacity of the initial post. I really am not. People can try to take me off topic, and I may go a little way, but I will keep coming back to the starting post.

This is not "shoot and move" combat. Your side does not get to shoot a lie at us and then shift and shoot something else from somewhere else, even were that something else to be true. Somebody has to take responsibility for what is said. First there is accountability about the lie, or there really is no point in my even reading what is written in high dudgeon, especially when it seems to be irrelevant and emotional.

From here what it too often looks like is that a thread about Catholicism or "The Vatican" is just a chance to vent. Why would I, why should I allow myself to be verbally pummeled that way? Getting clobbered, verbally or otherwise, doesn't change my mind.

[Just mythoughts]

You haven’t spent much time over at the Religion Forum have you? There are CONSTANTLY articles posted about what is coming out of the Vatican. Are you saying that you want Catholics to post articles that you conceive to be “negative coming out of Rome”? Did you think that perhaps we don’t see it as negative? We actually read what comes from the Vatican (Rome is a city) and not what the MSM writes about it. So instead of posting all the “negative” things, we spend our time saying, “Have you gone to the source and actually read it or do you believe Anti-Christian Reuters about this?” I swear, if quotes from the Pope were given the same scrutiny as those from GWB or Ronald Reagan, we would have time to actually discuss with you. But the Pope can say “It’s a nice day”, AP writes Pope says “Pope says protestants are damned to hell.” and FReepers take it as gospel. Now if you want to say that it’s my way of “bitterly complaining about all the anti-Catholic bigotry, lies, and etc., etc.” I’m going to tell you that when we complained about the lies and distortions of the words of GWB, the mainstream media said the same. But hey, if you want to dislike the Vatican more than the Mainstream Media’s distortions and blame it on the Catholics, that is your right

I occasionally post on the 'religious' Forum when it is open.

Why would you think your church would be treated differently than Christ? He never sinned and all manner of lies were said of Him and they crucified HIM. Have you never read Job and who it was that God turned loose on him? And after 30 plus chapters of yak yak philosophizing about what Job had done wrong, God told Job to stand up and act like a man.

What I cannot quite figure out is the politics of Rome. What I have personally encountered is there is a multitude of varying degrees of right and wrong. Oh and a guilt factor that weighs down like cement blocks.

Now on any given day how many that work the MSM are Catholics? See now if the claim is that Vatican is where God speaks I have to wonder how many voices does God have because on any given day I can view a Teddy Kennedy grand finale or some priest praising universal health care, without the abortion funding. Or some priest providing sanctuary to illegals while sending me via government the bill for their healthcare and education funding.

OH and just to be clear here Catholics are not the only religion practicing this so called 'compassionate' acts of fighting over souls to save while sending me and mine the bills.

The Ten Commandments are very much still in effect and God had Moses put into writing what would happen IF His children turned their individual or collective backs on Him. And we as citizens of the most blessed nation in all of recorded history, are in this fight against the dissolution of maintaining and practicing in keeping those Commandments. And the popular theme these days is taking the rewards of individual profits and giving in the name of charity to those who won't lift a finger to take care of themselves.

[Just mythoughts]

From here what it too often looks like is that a thread about Catholicism or "The Vatican" is just a chance to vent. Why would I, why should I allow myself to be verbally pummeled that way? Getting clobbered, verbally or otherwise, doesn't change my mind.

Our nation is going to .ell in a hand-basket, and I observe what and who are the players involved in the 'process'. I do not keep track of posts against "The Vatican" or against those 'evil' protestants. I call them as I see them in the reality of what is literally taking place. I take literally the 'promises' made by the Heavenly Father from the beginning and HE never bound me to take any path through a flesh being. As HE sent His only Begotten Son to offer me IF I would life eternal.

[Mad Dawg]

See now if the claim is that Vatican is where God speaks ...

Who makes THAT claim? As far as I can tell, no one makes that claim, but some Protestants claim that Catholics make that claim so that our assailants can take a story like this one and blow it up to absurd proportions.

[Mad Dawg]

“a flesh being”?

[netmilsmom]

You just gave an entire post that had nothing to do with what I responded to.

These were your words

>>There is never a thread posted here that has anything appearing negative coming out of Rome but the posters believe it is their ‘work’ to bitterly complain about all the anti-Catholic bigotry, lies, and etc., etc.<<

See the words “Thread posted here... That means that what you were talking about is Catholic FReepers. Therefore the response given was about Catholic FReepers and how they “bitterly complain about all the anti-Catholic bigotry, lies, and etc., etc.”

You then went off on a five paragraph post about the MSM and how you personally don't like what the Vatican (not Rome, that is a city or a game show host) does.

Wonder why there is no dialog with Catholics? Why we can't even let out a breath of dissatisfaction on FR? Because when we do, we get rants like yours.

[Judith Anne]

I have to agree. How many posts by protestants about Catholics are just excuses to argue about Mary? Before even one page of posts is up, some know-it-all is griping about how we worship statues.

It doesn’t matter what WE say about our beliefs. What matters to them is what they think. No room for anything but bigotry, it appears to me.

[netmilsmom]

I like that we should put up articles “critical” of the Vatican. LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!

1. Often when something is critical, we are the only ones that go to the original documents and read them. Everyone else delights in glee to slam the Pope right along with the MSM

2. We get quoted for all eternity that a Catholic was critical of something so all of us should leave the faith IMMEDIATELY. It goes on someone’s homepage or bookmarked to be brought up again for YEARS

Oh yeah, we’re among friends here. Right.

[Judith Anne]

Yeah, what’s the matter with us? Just a buncha mackerel-snappers who don’t know how to be “properly” religious and who are all going to perdition...

*sigh*

I just can’t make up my mind which of the 2000+ prottie sects is the right one.....

[netmilsmom]

And you know, if a thread comes up slamming a Protestant denomination’s leader, the Catholics are defending.

Let one be posted about the Pope and it’s a free for all.

But we are whiners.

[Judith Anne]

Some of us are “vicious.”

Heh.

I guess that means the comment hit the mark. :D

[netmilsmom]

That’s right!

[nina0113]

I attend a parish other than the one I’m registered in, and last week’s bulletin in the new parish (which I threw out just a few hours ago) had a letter from the pastor about geographical restrictions and getting permission from the bishop to register outside your proper parish. It can be done, but you need to have an actual reason. Also, you’re supposed to give your soon-to-be-former pastor the courtesy of notification of intent to re-register. Attendance at any parish is fine of course, but registration is different.

[Mad Dawg]

Thanks. I wonder what prompted the pastor.

[netmilsmom]

It must be Diocese to Diocese.
Cause I can’t find a thing on it.

I tried “Geographic location parish Catholic”
“Geographic restrictions parish Catholic”
“geographic restrictions parish requirement Catholic”
“How To Find a Good Catholic Parish”

With all these searches, I can’t find anything about requirements. They are required to take you but you can go anywhere. The only problem I could see is if in the 50’s, parishes got too big to handle everyone. Our St. Lawrence begat St. Matthias in 1965, because the congregation got too big. Some were told to go to St. Matthias.

But that wouldn’t happen today.

[Mad Dawg]

FWIW, a discussion:

http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=12242

[nina0113]

I’m guessing an abundance of people who prefer the caliber of his pastoral care to that of their assigned pastor.

[netmilsmom]

“Keep in mind that while all geographic parishes (as opposed to ethnic parishes, or, as they’re properly called, “national parishes”) do have boundaries, kepping to them is not required by law. After 1983 it is just custom.”

Yup, that’s basically what I found.
It’s custom.

Like I said, in the 60s when we were growing by leaps and bounds and the churches were packed, if they split a parish, some people would be forced to go to the new one.

Today, they are not so full.