Why we can't close the "gun show loophole"

Denver Gun Rights Examiner ^ | 12 April, 2009 | Dan Bidstrup

[marktwain]

What is the gun show loophole? It is the ability of a person to buy a gun from another attendee at the show, person to person, with no Instacheck to see if the buyer is a felon, or for any other reason should not be able to have a gun. If a person buys a gun from a Federal Fire Arms licensed dealer at the show, they must show ID and get the InstaCheck.

On it's surface, this seems like a bad thing. The ABC television show 20/20 last Friday documented the ease with which a man bought lots of guns with $5,000 cash and filled the trunk of his car. Who is such a rabid gun nut that they wouldn't want to close the "gun show loophole"?

Buying guns at a gun show, man to man, is no different than me selling my neighbor a gun after we wrap up a practice session at the local pistol range.

A gun show is a concentrated marketplace where buyers and sellers gather, but the principle that I can buy or sell something that is legal to own applies at a gun show or over my back fence. It is currently illegal to sell a gun to a minor, a felon, or someone under a restraining order. There are other laws state by state, but those are the biggies. It is illegal to use that gun in lots and lots of ways by anyone. I am told that there are currently about 20,000 laws currently on the books dealing with what we can and can not do with our guns. Right now, we can still buy or sell a gun to someone as long as it is a legal weapon and we observe the laws currently on the books in the state where we do the transaction.

Consider what must be done to close the "Gun Show Loophole":

Everyone who owns guns or wants to buy a gun would have to be background checked, then entered into a Federal database, earning them a gun owner's permit or license

To stay current, these licenses could only be good or a year or two at a time, as circumstances change

Every gun currently in the United States would need to be inventoried, ID'd by serial number and registered to its present owner

Every gun entering the country or manufactured here would have to be ID'd and its sale registered to its new owner, and recorded in a federal database

Every year, you would have to bring your inventory down to the police station, or have a police officer come to your house and inventory your collection to see if there is any change

If you wanted to sell your old .38 revolver to your neighbor, you and he would have to truck on down to the closest FFL dealer and pay some fee to get your neighbor Instachecked, then you and he would have to go to the local police station to make sure their records show the transfer so you stay legal for next year's inventory.

Hey, that sounds just like Representative Bobby Rush's bill, HR45! Remember I told you to write your congressmen and women about killing that bill? I also asked you to write the representatives on the House Subcommittee on Crime, Terror and Homeland Security, asking them to never let that bill out of committee.

Do it. Do it now!

[Yosemitest]

If it's time to bury them, it's time to USE them.
Better to die, killing a tyrant, then cower in the corner.

[TaMoDee]

BIG Crossroads of the West Gun Show at the AZ State Fair Grounds April 25-26 in Phoenix.
See’ya there!

[SirFishalot]

The real myth is that there are any gunshows left which allow on premisis sales without a nics check. Any public gunshow is going to carry liabilty insurance, in fact, if it’s held in any public building, it will almost definitly be required in the rental agreement. There are only a couple of carriers here in the US who will even write policies for gunshows and they all require nics check as a condition of coverage.

Besides that fact, most gunshows are run by professional promoters and they normally hire Off Duty Law Enforcement Officers. Most all of them would not risk working for an organization which didn’t follow all firearms laws as well as require nics checks for any sales made on premisis. Most dealers also figure if they have to qualify buyers with nics, everyone selling there should. The promoters depend on their good name, ability to attract good dealers, ability to attract good employees, and overall safe fun atmosphere for their continued success, so they play it safe close to the law.

[Mikey]

Any gun law is an infringement on our right to keep and bear arms.

“A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks.”

Thomas Jefferson

“Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage then to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.”

Thomas Jefferson, quoting 18th century criminologist Cesare Beccaria in "On Crimes and Punishment", 1764

“The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyrany in government.”

Thomas Jefferson



“Banning gun shows to reduce violent crime will work about as well as banning auto shows to reduce drunken driving.”

Bill McIntire, Spokesman for the National Rifle Association, on Norfolk, Va. council's vote to cancel four gun shows, 1992

“The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will loose.”

James Earl Jones

“To preserve liberty it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them.”

Richard Henry Lee writing in letters from the Federal Farmer to the Republic (1787-1788)

“Gun Control: The assumption that everyone is a potential criminal.”

“The right to buy weapons is the right to be free.”

van Gogt

“A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity.”

Sigmond Freud, General Introduction to Psychoanalysis

“There is no constitutional right to be protected by the state against being murdered by criminals or madmen”.

7th Circut Court, Bowers v. DeVito (1982)



“Without either the first or second amendment, we would have no liberty; the first allows us to find out what's happening, the second allows us to do something about it! The second will be taken away first, followed by the first and then the rest of our freedoms.”

Andrew Ford

* * * * * * *

The fact that most Americans put up 20,000 + unconstitutional gun laws tells me one thing, we in this country have become too soft and complacent in our acceptance of tyranny.

Our forefathers must be spinning in their graves.

------------

The pledge of dependence:

We the sheeple of the united nations socialist states of Amerika hereby acquiesce to our masters that as long as we allowed to continue to live on our gilded cages then our loving master we believe you when you tell us we are truly free.

We are truly free as long as we continue to do what you tell us we can do.

We will continue pay heavy taxes. We will continue to beg for permits and licenses to do what our forefathers actually believed we had a right to do. We will continue to stick our heads in the sand while we get violated over and over and over thanking you our great and loving master.

Please give us another.

[nonsporting]

Here is what Obama and the Dems are proposing for a gun control bill...

I'm familiar with HR45. However, I have not seen bills for (2--ammo accountability), (3--expanded AWB) and (4--Expanded "Lautenbach" amendment). Do you have these available?

[Thunder90]

Google Ammunition Accountability. They have bills pending in many states now, and are currently lobbying for a federal bill which many Dim congresscritters back. Microstamping has been talked about by the Brady Bunch.

The new AWB as described here is backed by Feinstein, Pelosi, Bloomberg, et all

Lautenbach amendment upgrades would be part of the licensing requirement

The licensing requirement comes from HR45. The insurance requirement was a bill tested in IL by one of Obama’s former colleges (Trial balloon for a Federal law)

[Charles Martel]

Expansion of the Lautenbach amendment:

I know that you're copy and-pasting this text from your home page, but there is no "Lautenbach" amendment. The idiot's name is LautenBERG, so you might want to fix that. No point in confusing readers, don't you agree?

[Old Teufel Hunden]

I see you are quoting that right wing extremist Thomas Jefferson. You better be careful on that one. I like your pledge at the end. Humorous, but with a grain of truth in it.

Because the lefties know that they may not take laws and pledges seriously, we do. If we ever do complete the transition to the socialist state there will be some type of pledge required and not the pledge of allegiance to the flag and the freedom it stands for. It will be a pledge to the state.

[Still Thinking]

Can you loan your guns to someone? If so, why couldn’t you rent them? How about a long term lease? Say, a 200 year lease for, oh, I don’t know, say $500, paid up front?

[javachip]

The real myth is that there are any gunshows left which allow on premisis sales without a nics check.

Not a myth at all. There are plenty of gunshows that allow on premises, private party sales without a NICS. Here in Virginia, it's common to see people walking around with a rifle or shotgun and 'for sale' sign slung over their shoulder.

[javachip]

Here in Virginia, it's common to see people walking around with a rifle or shotgun and 'for sale' sign slung over their shoulder.

Just to clarify, that's a common sight at a gun show. Not so common everyday on the street.

[Still Thinking]

Oh, damn, I was getting ready to visit.