Then they need to read This quick reference guide to "assault weapon" identificatin.
Posted on 03/23/2009 10:24:17 AM PDT by Drew68
When Oakland police Sgts. Ervin Romans and Daniel Sakai burst into an apartment on 74th Avenue on Saturday, they knew they were entering a dangerous situation. After all, they were looking for a man who had already killed two police officers.
What they didn't know was that the killer, Lovelle Mixon, had somehow gotten hold of an AK-47 assault rifle, police officials say. All they knew was that the gunman who had shot motorcycle officers Sgt. Mark Dunakin and Officer John Hege about two hours earlier used a handgun.
"Nobody knew he had an AK-47," said City Councilman Ignacio De La Fuente, who was among four council members to join Mayor Ron Dellums and acting Police Chief Howard Jordan for a late-night press conference Saturday.
The bulletproof vests that Romans and Sakai wore were no help - when Mixon fired his automatic rifle through a closet door in the apartment, he hit the two sergeants in the head.
The killings of four officers would devastate any police department. But it was especially traumatic for an Oakland force that has been beefed up in recent years with a lot of young, inexperienced cops.
"We've got a really young force out there, and this is really hitting them hard," officer Bob Valladon, former head of the Oakland Police Officers Association, said Sunday as he drove from one slain officer's home to another to meet with their families. "We've hired maybe 25o new cops in the past five years, so about a quarter of the force has never seen anything like this. No one has.
"These cops (who were killed) were veterans," Valladon said. "The best of the best."
(Excerpt) Read more at sfgate.com ...
Yep, that's always a factor to be considered.
I understand what you’re saying, I just don’t see it though. If this were the case, then every time I shot my .45 ACP I would get bowled over by the force “-X”, because the force from the projectile will certainly knock the recipient over regardless of penetration (even if shot in a BPV that could stop the bullet).
The heat dissipated can’t amount to that much negative energy, because I would experience numerous FTFs and FTEs because the gun would get so hot it wouldn’t function.
Like I said, I’m just not buying that it works how you’re explaining it.
It would be interesting to see something like this explored on mythbusters, or at least explained by a gun manufacturer.
Perhaps howstuffworks.com drills this down in some detail.
Don't know if these inserts were used, or not. But in this case, it don't look like they would have helped anyway.
Family’s account of Oakland parolee who killed the four police
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/03/22/BAAU16L4OI.DTL&tsp=1
“According to police, the first incident happened about 1:15 p.m. when two traffic officers, Dunakin and Hege, were shot after what police described as a “routine” stop of a 1995 Buick in the 7400 block of MacArthur Boulevard in East Oakland, not far from the Eastmont Town Center.
Mixon’s relatives said at the time he was stopped by the police motorcycles, he was apparently looking for a parking space. He had bought the car a week earlier from someone in San Francisco.
Gordon Hinkle, a spokesman for the state Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation, said the family’s assertion that the parole agent had missed a meeting was “highly unlikely,” but added that he is researching the matter.
About two hours after the first shooting, after some 200 officers from Oakland Police, Alameda County Sheriff’s Office, BART Police and the California Highway Patrol combed the area for Mixon, three SWAT officers were shot when their team found him hidden in an apartment on 74th Avenue near Hillside Street, police officials said.
Mixon’s sister, Enjoli Mixon, lived in the two-bedroom apartment with her 4-year-old daughter, but said she was not home at the time. However, another sibling, 16-year-old Reynete Mixon, was at the apartment, where she had been sleeping.
Reynete said today that she did not see or hear her brother come in. She said she was in the bathroom when police officers bashed in the front door down, causing her to drop to the floor. The officers ran toward her, she said, shouting and throwing small bombs that shredded her pajama bottoms and caused her legs to bleed”.
Heh. Show off ;)
Thanks for that link .....when ya swims with sharks etc etc .....
Stay safe !
If it was an SKS that’s one mean rifle.
What I am almost certain is happening here is that all of this recoil stuff is actually absorbing the energy of the blast which took place in the firing chamber, and that, as a result, the round is leaving the muzzle with LESS energy [i.e. at a lower velocity] than would would be the case in an old-fashioned gun without the recoil stuff.
Remember, conservation of energy is a zero sum game - if you are feeling less recoil, then that [almost certainly] means that the round must be departing the muzzle with less "oomph" than would be the case otherwise.
Very true. And there's a lot of discussions as to if it was an AK, whether or not it was full or semi-auto. As someone who's fired both, I think it matters very little. A Kalashnikov with a 30-round magazine is a very formidable weapon, even in semi-auto only. You can put a lot of lead downrange real quick and destroy targets in close quarters.
True. Ragheads may opt for full auto on an AK but in the hands of a capable infantryman I doubt they would feel the need to use full auto. Precise semi-auto firing will usually suffice.
I believe you are correct. My Uncle had one of the variants with detachable magazines here in California. Maybe that’s why he gave it to his son out of state. All the ones I see now have internal magazines.
Both are already BANNED in Collyfornia
Kevlar helmets don’t stop AK rounds.
Thanks for the link. Now we’re getting some info. That article is very sympathetic to the killer, as predicted by earlier posters on this thread. It’s the old “he was trying to be good” line from the family. He was having a bad time, so he had to kill 4 good men. The family seems to be unconcerned with those who lost their lives, other than Lovelle’s worthless hide that is.
Sorry, still not buying it. The energy will leave the muzzle where it has an escape, whereas the rear end of the firing chamber is a dead end. If you heat a round sufficiently to cause it to discharge and there is nothing holding the round, then the case (shell) will have greater velocity than the bullet itself will (I’ve seen this on mythbusters). Whatever has greater mass will feel less of the inertia and will cause the exciting force to exert itself on the smaller mass - this is just how a gun works.
The average muzzle velocity of a .45 ACP is ~800-950fps (dependent on barrel length and load)- that doesn’t change regardless of the fact that it is an auto colt pistol. A standard colt revolver with similar load will only provide a maximum of another 100fps muzzle velocity given the same load and barrel length, and at that, there may be no definable difference at that point. 410 ft. lbs. would knock anyone over if that were truly felt at the grip end of the pistol. Either that, or it would send the gun flying out of the holder’s hands, cause severe wrist injury, or both.
No, the majority of the energy leaves the business end of the barrel, I just simply don’t see it any other way. You cannot convince me otherwise without any hard data and evidence to back it up.
I call major-league BS on this. I highly doubt the guy got hold of an automatic AK. Maybe a semi, but not a full-auto.
Imagine serving a warrant to confiscate at the residence of Mike Dillon (The king of reloading machines).... Nobody knew he had a mingun mounted on a helicopter, Nobody knew he had electrically fired quad M2HB's chambering APIT ammo.
Geeeeeze why didn't WE know?
I've already seen one news report that said is was an SKS, not an AK-47.
Then they need to read This quick reference guide to "assault weapon" identificatin.
Good reference guide. I would only correct one thing. When the AR is out of ammo it can be used for a horizontal butt stroke to the mush exactly once.... : )
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