Biden jokes about Obama's birth certificate at dinner

WND ^ | MARCH 22, 2009 | WorldNetDaily

[RobinMasters]

WASHINGTON – While the subject of Barack Obama's birth certificate is still a topic most press outlets refuse to cover, it became a matter of sport in Vice President Joe Biden's Gridiron Dinner address this weekend.

After mentioning one of the Republican speakers for the evening, Arnold Schwarzenegger, was born in Austria and that one of the Democratic speakers, Michigan Gov. Jennifer Granholm, was born in Canada, Biden chortled: "Folks, this is going to be Lou Dobbs' worst nightmare.

From there, Biden transitioned to the birth certificate controversy.

[deannadurbin]

As it is created in the laboratory or nature it IS a byproduct of chemical breakdown.

God have mercy on YOUR soul by being in defiance of the scriptures and calling Jesus Christ a wine drinker, thereby a sinner. That’s blaspheming against the Holy Spirit and is the one unforgiveable sin.

[Pan_Yans Wife]

Deana, again. I don’t think you understand what the term legalism means. You’ve been given many opportunities to research on this thread, many people are offering to show you the difference between following God’s law, and using our imperfect human eyes to read His Word and read into it what our own prejudices and thought processes might be.

You keep saying that Jesus did not drink fermented wine in the Last Supper, because it doesn’t SAY that he drank it in Matthew 26.

By that logic, it doesn’t say that Jesus prayed with the disciples either. And because it doesn’t say it, it couldn’t have happened.

[verga]

How would you know? You can’t even spell travesty properly.

Don't mistake inability to type with inability to spell, BTW questions rhetorical or otherwise with a question mark, not a period.

And the way that I would know is two semesters of New testament Koine Greek at the Graduate level in a seminary.

Care to swap resumes?(Notice the proper punctuation?)

Fruit of the vine is NOT wine. It is grape juice.

Only for about a day then it becomes "Mustum" and then it becomes either vinegar or wine. Like I said ask any secular chemist. Of course that will require you to deal in facts.

Fermentation is a picture of SIN.

The word you are looking for is "Metaphor" and only on one occasion referring to the leaven in bread A preponderance of verses in both Old Testament and New Testament speak against drinking wine. Jesus was more than a Savior, He was a RABBI.

So a Rabbi is superior to a savior? Do you really want to try and make that case?

Why would a RABBI under the Old Testament law, especially one who knew He was the Son of God, engage in something that the Old Testament repeatedly speaks negatively about?

It has been pointed out to you by several others that the verses you refer to speak of "Drunkenness." Nice try.

YOU HAVE NO LEGS TO STAND ON. The Bible is crystal clear on the matter.

Then why won't you admit your error?

[brewcrew]

As it is created in the laboratory or nature it IS a byproduct of chemical breakdown.

There's no chemical breakdown that creates yeast. Yeast is yeast. It's a fungus, and it exists in nature. Time to get your facts straight.

God have mercy on YOUR soul by being in defiance of the scriptures and calling Jesus Christ a wine drinker, thereby a sinner. That’s blaspheming against the Holy Spirit and is the one unforgiveable sin.

I challenge you to show where I did that. Again, this is all about serving your twisted view of alcohol consumption. Get thee to a professional - or is it too late?

Now please, I'm waiting for you to show specifically where I called Jesus Christ a wine drinker, and thereby a sinner.

[deannadurbin]

But it does say Jesus prayed with His disciples. Your point is moot.

Of COURSE I know what legalism is. And being in defiance of the preponderance of verses calling wine drinking a sin and something to be avoided and then claiming Jesus engaged in this sin — is ITSELF a sin! That’s not legalism, that is the truth.

[deannadurbin]

I thought you were done with me? Going back on your word already?

FERMENTATION IS A BREAKING DOWN CHEMICAL PROCESS. It is NOT a pure process. Jesus Christ’s blood was PURE. He would not have mixed it with alcholic beverages. Period.

[Sloth]

I've seen all sorts of tortured logic trying to deal with this, including Jack van Impe claiming that unfermented, freshly pressed grape juice was called "wine" and that this is what Jesus turned the water into. It's pretty pathetic when people adopt a position and then have to ignore reality in order to keep defending it.

I don't believe drinking alcohol is a sin, and I don't claim to know the exact contents of what Jesus created, but it is simply a fact that the Greek word translated 'wine' can mean either fermented or unfermented grape juice.

[deannadurbin]

At the last supper it was fruit of the vine, not wine. That’s pretty clear.

[brewcrew]

I thought you were done with me? Going back on your word already?

Yes.

FERMENTATION IS A BREAKING DOWN CHEMICAL PROCESS.

Again, I beg you to get your facts straight. Fermentation is the process by which yeast cells (a naturally occurring fungus) consume sugar. They cast off two substances as waste - carbon dioxide and ethanol. It's as natural a process as you or I taking a dump.

Now, were you going to show me where I called Jesus Christ a wine drinker? I will not stand accused of something I did not do. That's why we're not done yet - I have been falsely accused. Either find it and I will apologize or admit you were wrong and apoligize to me.

[deannadurbin]

Fine, Going Back On Your Word, tell me in clear words that Jesus Christ never drank wine.

Admit it and I will apologize for hurting your wee little feelings, BREWcrew. (With a name like that I wonder how much you guzzle down of alcoholic spirits every week?)

[brewcrew]

Fine, Going Back On Your Word, tell me in clear words that Jesus Christ never drank wine.

Oh, no. The issue is crystal clear: You accused me of doing something I did not do, and unless you want being a false accuser on your conscience, you need to come clean and apologize. Let's stay focused here.

BREWcrew. (With a name like that I wonder how much you guzzle down of alcoholic spirits every week?)

I contemplated for a minute just letting this one go, but if you must know, the answer is none.

Now do you have something you want to say to me?

P.S. - I didn't really go back on my word. You left me with the parting shot of the false accusation, so this ball's in your court, sunshine.

[deannadurbin]

Oh no the issue is crystal clear to God, my dear. You either believe Jesus Christ drank wine or He didn’t. Which is it?

Come on, fess up time! :)

[nanetteclaret]

I think you’d better rethink your theory of “the words aren’t there, but the teaching is.” Otherwise, you won’t be able to argue with me when I say things like “Peter was the first Vicar of Christ,” “the wine and bread become the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Christ at Holy Communion,” “Baptism is the washing away of our sins, making us new,” “souls might need to go to Purgatory when they die,” “Jesus does not want us to be divided (many denominations),” etc. - even though everything I’ve mentioned can be found in Holy Scripture! See Matthew 16:17-19; John 6; 1 Corinthians 10:16; 1 Corinthians 11:27-29; 1 Peter 3:21; 1 Corinthians 3:13-15; John 17.

If you believe that Holy Scripture is the Inspired Word of God, that it is inerrant, and that it is non-self-contradicting, how do you rationalize the following verses from Holy Scripture? “He causeth the grass to grow for the cattle, and herb for the service of man: that he may bring forth food out of the earth; And wine that maketh glad the heart of man, and oil to make his face to shine, and bread which strengtheneth man’s heart.” Psalm 104:14-15 If you say that the word for wine here means grape juice, then all the verses you just quoted give us admonitions not to get drunk on grape juice. I don’t think that can happen. Either it’s fermented or not - you can’t have it both ways. The wine that Jesus used at the Last Supper is the same type of wine that is mentioned in this Psalm: given to us by God as a wonderful gift to be enjoyed but not over-indulged in. Reference: gluttony (one of the seven deadly sins).

[brewcrew]

You can't do it, can you? You can't admit that you have falsely accused me of something I did not do.

In case you haven't figured it out, this isn't about my drinking habits or my faith, it's about your hypocrisy. As far I can tell, Christians are not supposed to go around accusing people of having done things they did not do.

[evets]

I was born in one country, raised in another. My father was born in
another country. I was not his only child. He fathered several
children with numerous women.

I became very close to my mother, as my father showed no interest in
me.. My mother died at an early age from cancer.

Later in life, questions arose over my real name.

My birth records were sketchy and no one was able to produce a
legitimate, reliable birth certificate.

I grew up practicing one faith but converted to Christianity, as it was
widely accepted in my country, but

I practiced non-traditional beliefs & didn’t follow Christianity, except
in the public eye under scrutiny.

I worked and lived among lower-class people as a young adult, disguising
myself as someone who really cared about them.

That was before I decided it was time to get serious about my life and I
embarked on a new career.

I wrote a book about my struggles growing up. It was clear to those who
read my memoirs that I had difficulties accepting that my father
abandoned me as a child.

I became active in local politics in my 30’s then with help behind the
scenes, I literally burst onto the scene as a candidate for national
office in my 40’s. They said I had a golden tongue and could talk
anyone into anything. That reinforced my conceit.

I had a virtually non-existent resume, little work history, and no
experience in leading a single organization. Yet I was a powerful
speaker and citizens were drawn to me as though I were a magnet and they
were small roofing tacks..

I drew incredibly large crowds during my public appearances.. This
bolstered my ego.

At first, my political campaign focused on my country’s foreign policy.
I was very critical of my country in the last war and seized every
opportunity to bash my country.

But what launched my rise to national prominence were my views on the
country’s economy. I pretended to have a really good plan on how we
could do better and every po or person would be fed & housed for free.

I knew which group was responsible for getting us into this mess. It
was the free market, banks & corporations. I decided to start making
citizens hate them and if they were envious of others who did well, the
plan was clinched tight.

I called mine “A People’s Campaign” and that sounded good to all people.

I was the surprise candidate because I emerged from outside the
traditional path of politics & was able to gain widespread popular
support.

I knew that, if I merely offered the people ‘hope’ , together we could
change our country and the world.

So, I started to make my speeches sound like they were on behalf of the
downtrodden, poor, ignorant to include “persecuted minorities” like the
Jews. My true views were not widely known & I needed to keep them
unknown, until after I became my nation’s leader.

I had to carefully guard reality, as anybody could have easily found out
what I really believed, if they had simply read my writings and examined
those people I associated with.

I’m glad they didn’t. Then I became the most powerful man in the world.
And the world learned the truth.

[deannadurbin]

If you are so interested in proving I was falsely accusing you then you should be eager to set the record straight so you can obtain that apology.

Did Jesus Christ drink wine or didn’t He?

[brewcrew]

Sorry, you keep avoiding the subject, so now I'm done with you. You may feel as though this is a victory of sorts for you. Please, be my guest. Savor your victory over yet another of the heathen who will not bend to your will or your insistence on changing the subject. Tell yourself whatever you have to in order to rationalize your behavior in your mind. But I will leave you with this: Your hypocrisy has haunted you for a long time, and it will continue to haunt you.

Now we're done.

[deannadurbin]

The Christian in the age of grace is supposed to be filled with the Holy Spirit, NOT alcoholic beverages. The New Testament commands you to avoid people who drink. It says drunks will not inherit the Kingdom of God. You come on here and defend the practice. It’s obvious who is in defiance of the Lord Jesus Christ on this subject and it is not me. :)

You learn about scripture by comparing scripture with other scripture on a topic. For instance if you are studying the antichrist you study ALL the passages having to do with the antichrist or the man of sin and you compare scripture with scripture to learn what the Holy Spirit is trying to teach you.

Scripture is of no private interpretation. You compare scripture with scripture and it is SELF-INTERPRETING. Then you “rightly divide the word of truth.” That means you don’t take passages for Jews under the law and apply them to Christians in the age of grace. Then you are not rightly dividing the word of truth, you are privately interpreting to suit your own agenda. When Jesus Christ walked the earth He was under the Old Testament law. He came to fulfill that. If Jesus as a rabbi had imbibed alcholic beverages He would have sinned.

Jesus Christ’s blood was PURE. He would not have mixed it with a fermented product. Any Christian who claims that He did is blaspheming against the Holy Spirit and as the Scripture says that is the one unforgiveable sin.

So tread carefully all ye who wish to defend drinking wine when you are supposed to be filled with the Holy Spirit instead.

[deannadurbin]

Yawn. I knew you were too much of a coward to state clearly where you stood.

Of course I won the argument but I would have rejoiced if you had grown a pair and honestly answered my question.

Toodles.

[Pan_Yans Wife]

In Matthew 26, it does NOT say that He prayed with the disciples. It says that the disciples prepared the Passover.

Your legalistic comment at #58 says, " Yet AGAIN: SHOW ME THE VERSE THAT SAYS HE DRANK WINE. At the Last Supper it was “fruit of the vine” (grape juice) that He served to the apostles. IT DOES NOT SAY HE DRANK IT. He served it to THEM." is an example of legalism.

You say Jesus didn't even drink the fruit of the vine, because it doesn't say that he did!

So I say to you in Matthew 26, where the entirety of the Passover is discussed and no mention is made of Jesus praying, your logic then must follow that He didn't pray, not that he did pray.

But this hasn't been the case. You have become confused.

According to you if the scripture doesn't mention that He drank, He didn't drink.

Therefore, if the scripture doesn't mention that He didn't pray, He didn't pray.

You cannot have it both ways.

Your logic is faulty, and you are having difficulty keeping track of the arguments.

As such, discussing the point further holds no purpose, because your hardened heart and inability to follow the discussion because you have confused you and damaged your argument.