Soviet MiG-21 approaches its twilight years

Associated Press ^ | 2008-12-14 | SLOBODAN LEKIC

[sukhoi-30mki]

Soviet MiG-21 approaches its twilight years

By SLOBODAN LEKIC Associated Press

An icon of the Cold War, the MiG-21 came to symbolize the military might of the Soviet Union as it squared off against the West in conflicts from Vietnam to Africa and the Middle East.

Now, exactly 50 years after it entered service, the jet fighter is approaching the twilight of its career in frontline service _ with NATO, the former Soviet Union's main rival.

[snip]

[sukhoi-30mki]

[Rokke]

That’s like saying Elizabeth Taylor is approaching her twilight years.

[OL Hickory]

[valkyry1]

A great fighter it was

[valkyry1]

I read that the F16 did adopt some of the Mig21 design elements, is this true you know of?

[djf]

Yes.
The Soviets were failures in many of the things they tried.

But they were, and still are, very, very accomplished when it comes to aerospace technology.

Partly out of necessity. The Soviet Union covers 11 time zones!

[buccaneer81]

Still, more than 10,000 MiG-21s were built, making it the most widely produced jet fighter ever built.

More than the F-16? Or F-4? I've gotta look that up.

[rmlew]

The Mig-21 is not stealthy. American pilots did fire Sparrow missiles at long range, because the rules of engagement precluded it in most cases. Instead, they were forced to first positively ID the Vietnamese fighters. This is where the small visual cross section helped.
The Delta-winged Mig-21, despite having a tail was not a dogfighter like the earlier Mig-15. Instead, the Vietnamese used them to swoop in at high speeds, launch their 4 Aphid infra red missiles, and then flee at high speed.

[valkyry1]

Not much more than 5000 F4’s were built IIRC

[buccaneer81]

Not much more than 5000 F4’s were built IIRC

Yeah, you're right. I also saw that over 3000 F-16s are still in service. Can't be more than a few hundred that have been destroyed.

[ZirconEncrustedTweezers]

I don’t know what specific features of the MiG-21 made it into the F16, but it did prove the value of a small, lightweight fighter to the US military.

[Rokke]

Single seat, single engine, single tail, delta wing. Four elements of any great fighter. Of course you can actually see out of an F-16. And an F-16 has never been shot down by a Mig. And the Mig-21 was a terrible bomber.

[valkyry1]

I think for one thing, the incorporation of the delta wing planform with a horizontal stab behind it.

Although on the F16, they clipped the end of the wing to give the wing a deeper chord.

[valkyry1]

Of course you can actually see out of an F-16. And an F-16 has never been shot down by a Mig. And the Mig-21 was a terrible bomber.

So other than those details, it was really effective ;)

[valkyry1]

The Mig would/could not maintain airspeed in high gain turns like the F16, correct?

[BIGLOOK]

the Vietnamese used them to swoop in at high speeds, launch their 4 Aphid infra red missiles, and then flee at high speed.

That's on the mark. The 21s would take off from Kep and Phuc Yen for a mugging at mach 2+ and split before engaging CAP A/C. Problem was there were friendlies in the air, Thuds, A-4s and A-6s which complicated the AOB rules. CAP was at a disadvantage due to the minimal visual and had to rely on acquisition radar (and others) to shoot without making positive visual id.

But on the bright side, at the end of the air war, the MiG 21s were stashed in caves along the Red River valley after the NVNAF lost so many assets, they couldn't afford any more. A logistical victory.

[DemforBush]

“In the 1970s, the U.S. introduced two jets which outperformed the MiG-21 _ the new F-15 Eagles and F-16 Fighting Falcons. The Soviets countered with MiG-29s and Sukhoi-27s.”

Interesting how the article skips right over the Flogger (Mig-23/27).

[Loud Mime]

Need a nice photo on this thread

[Rokke]

“The Mig would/could not maintain airspeed in high gain turns like the F16, correct?”

Correct. Although there are later variations of Mig-21’s with larger motors that can turn a little better. But an F-16 can easily turn inside a Mig and stay there until it runs out of gas, which would be long after the Mig. More importantly, the F-16 has a radar and long range missiles that make actually turning with a Mig-21 irrelevent.

[Thunder90]

I believe that North Korea still has some in its inventories...