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Pat's stuck in the 1950's.
1 posted on 12/16/2008 9:41:56 AM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I don’t want GM, Ford, and Chrysler to drop dead. I want the UAW to drop dead. Until the UAW is broken, the big three will constantly operate on the very edge of disaster.


2 posted on 12/16/2008 9:43:47 AM PST by JamesP81 (Let the Great RINO Hunt of 2009 begin)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Pat Buchanan can go.... well, I can’t SAY what he can go do or I’ll get Banned from FR!


3 posted on 12/16/2008 9:43:53 AM PST by WayneS (Respect the 2nd Amendment; Repeal the 16th)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

The 1950’s weren’t so bad, my friend.


4 posted on 12/16/2008 9:44:06 AM PST by Former Proud Canadian (I would continue my rant but I have to make sure my tires are inflated.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

When will he just go away...


5 posted on 12/16/2008 9:44:26 AM PST by realdifferent1 (We've tried the soap box, jury box and ballot box. Only one box left and it's time to use it.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

When will Pat just go away?


6 posted on 12/16/2008 9:45:20 AM PST by Codeflier (We just had 8 more years of a democrat president in office, we already know what happens!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
...why refuse a reprieve to an industry upon which millions of the best blue-collar jobs in America depend?

Because at some point it just becomes throwing good money at bad. 14 billion here, 14 billion there, pretty soon it adds up to real money Pat.

7 posted on 12/16/2008 9:45:42 AM PST by MovementConservative (Not a Bush Republican, a Limbaugh/Levin conservative.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I actually agree with him. I mostly just feel that the UAW needs to be broken.


11 posted on 12/16/2008 9:47:01 AM PST by Smogger (It's the WOT Stupid)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I would reluctantly tolerate a big three bailout in the interests of national security, so that we have companies that have the capability of manufacturing weapons should we get involved in a conventional conflict. However, the UAW has hamstrung the auto makers to the point that they can’t fulfill this function anyway. With that in mind, I see no reason to bailout the people who got this crap started to begin with.


12 posted on 12/16/2008 9:50:41 AM PST by JamesP81 (Let the Great RINO Hunt of 2009 begin)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
And, unlike Mitsubishi, General Motors didn't bomb Pearl Harbor.

With this statement, Pat proves he is still stuck in the 1940's. Idiotic, but his observation about Reagan's pro-American stance is spot on. Reagan understood the difference between free trade as an ideology and Kool-Aid drinking free trade as carried to the extreme we have today-- a class of privileged plutocrats like the politicians, the U.A.W. and their servant-enablers who suckle from the government teat, and the rest of us who are expected to pay the freight.

And the funny thing about Reagan's philosophy, is that he is still loved and respected by the Japanese-- they understand a leader who will look out for the interests of our own (American) middle class is also looking out for the interest of Japan's middle class. The reason is simple: If America is transformed from a society of rulers and the ruled, Japan may not be that far behind. How badly we need another Reagan! And maybe he or she is out there, possibly running a state like Alaska or Louisiana.

16 posted on 12/16/2008 9:53:33 AM PST by Vigilanteman (Are there any men left in Washington? Or, are there only cowards? Ahmad Shah Massoud)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Pat doesn’t get the basic premise.

We don’t want GM out of business.

We want the union out of GM.

And that isn’t going to happen with $50 billion in taxpayer money funneled straight into UAW pockets.


17 posted on 12/16/2008 9:54:14 AM PST by SJSAMPLE
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I hear ya, Pat. And I agree with you regarding the damage Washington has wrought on American manufacturing over the years.

But nostalgia doesn’t get the job done, my friend. Two wrongs don’t make a right, and these bailouts are wrongs.

Enough of bigwig con-men and union extortionists holding our country hostage. Enough of paying the ransoms they demand. Enough of the extortion.

They wanna drive this country off the cliff with Washington at the wheel? Fine, let’s go. Right now, instead of waiting until they’re dead and buried, having lived a life of luxury paid for by my sweat.

Enough.


18 posted on 12/16/2008 9:54:37 AM PST by LearsFool ("Thou shouldst not have been old, till thou hadst been wise.")
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Is the Republican Party so fanatic in its ideology that, rather than sin against a commandment of Milton Friedman, it is willing to see America written forever out of this fantastic market, let millions of jobs vanish and write off the industrial Midwest?

The party is dead, anyway. Rebuilding has got to start somewhere - and smashing the UAW/Democrat money machine is a good beginning.

Pat's problem is that he thinks Republicans can actually get back into the game with a little populist tweaking...not this time. If they want to play again they are going to have to step back for a few years, let Obama fail in Carter-like fashion, then attempt a return as vigorous advocates of small government. It may not work, but the current corrupt and bloated Republican Party heirarchy is not sustainable.

19 posted on 12/16/2008 9:54:53 AM PST by Mr. Jeeves ("One man's 'magic' is another man's engineering. 'Supernatural' is a null word." -- Robert Heinlein)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Pat is an idiot!
I watched the Senate ‘debate’.
The Republicans ‘fell’ into the Dem cesspool of ‘debate’ again. They’re like Charlie Brown to the Dems Lucy. They fall for it and look bad every time. (Of course it doesn’t help for the MSM and folks like Pat to denegrade their points every time.)

I just want to know where will the jobs come from when businesses refuse to hire workers? And I do mean REFUSE!


20 posted on 12/16/2008 9:55:35 AM PST by griswold3
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
The Republican Party gave their jobs away!
How? By telling U.S. manufacturers they could shut plants here, get rid of their U.S. workers, build factories in Mexico, Asia or China, and ship their products back, free of charge. “

Republicans “told” US manufacturers to to build factories in China did we?
Riiiiight!
Is that why Europeans firms, Japanese firms, and firms from practically every advanced country on the planet, have built huge factories in China and have been making goods there for decades?
Has Pat Buchanan ever heard of the low wages in China , backed by very hard working Chinese workers who are very good at making consumer electronics products like cell phones, TV sets, laptops etc?

23 posted on 12/16/2008 9:56:08 AM PST by SmokingJoe
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Having the current bailout to fix GMs problems is like starting an intervention for an alcoholic relative with a cocktail hour.
26 posted on 12/16/2008 9:58:55 AM PST by KarlInOhio (11/4: The revolutionary socialists beat the Fabian ones. Where can we find a capitalist party?)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Pat Buchanan, Peter Schiff and Ron Paul were right. They warned us this was coming but so many at FR would not listen. You cannot survive being a consumer nation that only has service jobs and produces nothing that can be sold outside of our country.

Our manufacturing base was debased by the globalists in the pocket of the international bankers both in the Republican and Democratic parties.

Yep we were sold down the river by them. But lets keep voting for the moderate globalists in our party and ruin the country.

27 posted on 12/16/2008 10:00:18 AM PST by ColdSteelTalon (America land soon to be of the enslaved...)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Pat is absolutely on target, partcilarly in the final two paragraphs, which bear repeating:

>>>>>>>>>>>In today’s world, America faces nationalistic trade rivals who manipulate currencies, employ nontariff barriers, subsidize their manufacturers, rebate value-added taxes on exports to us and impose value-added taxes on imports from us, all to capture our markets and kill our great companies. And we have a Republican Party blissfully ignorant that we live in a world of us or them. It doesn’t even know who “us” is.

>>>>>>>>>We need a new team on the field and a new coach who believes with Vince Lombardi that “winning isn’t everything. It’s the only thing.”

And Pat can still turn a phrase. “Toyota Republicans”—what a great line.


28 posted on 12/16/2008 10:00:36 AM PST by Thorin ("I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.")
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“What are Republicans thinking of, pulling the plug, at Christmas, on GM, risking swift death for the greatest manufacturing company in American history, a strategic asset and pillar of the U.S. economy.”

They’re thinking, “Hey, why don’t I try sticking to my principles for once?”


31 posted on 12/16/2008 10:01:29 AM PST by Tublecane
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
The Republican Party gave their jobs away!

"They took arrr jerbs!"

33 posted on 12/16/2008 10:02:03 AM PST by dfwgator (I hate Illinois Marxists)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Hey Pat,

It is not the Republican Parties responsibility to prop up a failed business. It is not the demoratic parties responsibility to prop up failed businesses.

OK, my understanding is that GM is nearly 60 billion in debt. They owe the Union 29 billion. If they were to sell the company, they would only get around 3 to 4 billion. Now, we are supposed to borrow our children’s money to give to a failed business that didn't give a red rats keyster what the consumers wanted over the years? We wanted carburetors and fuel injection that could get us 100 miles to the gallon. We had this technology in the 70s, but the car manufacturers allowed OPEC to by those pattens. Did they have my interest in mind?

Look Pat, we could take the 25 billion down to a Southern State and build new plants. The good people of the South will be happy to go to work for a lot less money then the Union workers in the North.

Another thing, Wall Street investors wanted a quick return on their money. A lot of businesses, not just the car companies started thinking in the short term. From quarter to quarter. Nobody wanted to look at the long term, because investors were not looking long term. Well, if these companies would have adhered to a 5, 10, 20, and 50 year plan, they wouldn't be in this position. Where are all your investors now? Oh, I know! They are the taxpayers. Again, I must ask, why are we going to invest our children's money into a failed, short sited business?

34 posted on 12/16/2008 10:02:10 AM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. - One of General Abram's men)
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