Posted on 11/29/2008 11:17:52 AM PST by Leisler
It is the photograph that has dominated the world's front pages, casting an astonishing light on the fresh-faced killers who brought terror to the heart of India's most vibrant city. Now it can be revealed how the astonishing picture came to be taken by a newspaper photographer who hid inside a train carriage as gunfire erupted all around him.
Sebastian D'Souza, a picture editor at the Mumbai Mirror, whose offices are just opposite the city's Chhatrapati Shivaji station, heard the gunfire erupt and ran towards the terminus. "I ran into the first carriage of one of the trains on the platform to try and get a shot but couldn't get a good angle, so I moved to the second carriage and waited for the gunmen to walk by," he said. "They were shooting from waist height and fired at anything that moved. I briefly had time to take a couple of frames using a telephoto lens. I think they saw me taking photographs but theydidn't seem to care."
The gunmen were terrifyingly professional, making sure at least one of them was able to fire their rifle while the other reloaded. By the time he managed to capture the killer on camera, Mr D'Souza had already seen two gunmen calmly stroll across the station concourse shooting both civilians and policemen, many of whom, he said, were armed but did not fire back. "I first saw the gunmen outside the station," Mr D'Souza said. "With their rucksacks and Western clothes they looked like backpackers, not terrorists, but they were very heavily armed and clearly knew how to use their rifles.
"Towards the station entrance, there are a number of bookshops and one of the bookstore owners was trying to close his shop," he recalled. "The gunmen opened fire and the shopkeeper fell down."
But what angered Mr D'Souza almost as much were the masses of armed police hiding in the area who simply refused to shoot back. "There were armed policemen hiding all around the station but none of them did anything," he said. "At one point, I ran up to them and told them to use their weapons. I said, 'Shoot them, they're sitting ducks!' but they just didn't shoot back."
As the gunmen fired at policemen taking cover across the street, Mr D'Souza realised a train was pulling into the station unaware of the horror within. "I couldn't believe it. We rushed to the platform and told everyone to head towards the back of the station. Those who were older and couldn't run, we told them to stay put."
The militants returned inside the station and headed towards a rear exit towards Chowpatty Beach. Mr D'Souza added: "I told some policemen the gunmen had moved towards the rear of the station but they refused to follow them. What is the point if having policemen with guns if they refuse to use them? I only wish I had a gun rather than a camera."
What do you mean, “Conditioned to kill.”?
A huge number of Japanese and Germans died in WWII by stray bullets from unfired weapons if the study you refer to is illustrative of American combat units in general.
I have a problem with studies undertaken by liberals, psychologists, and and the anti-firearms camp.
You are not well educated.
The default, biological instinct is to move away from danger. It requires training, by and large to get the vast majority of men to move towards danger.
By the way, character and courage (defined as acting against ones baser instinct) is a learned trait, and as militaries, and elite moral institutions know, can be taught.
“She was an ex cop.”
Yep, not your average security guard.
“And I know a few Security Guards that have had the integrity to immediately confront an armed individual-—sometimes without a weapon.”
Some are and some I wouldn’t trust with a taser.
Excuse me, but that has got to be the stupidest thing I've ever seen posted on FreeRepublic.
‘Probably more like sheep. They are told not to use their guns and they obey their commands.”
Most people are sheep, regardless of what country they are in.
There is crushing poverty in India and these guys are probably lucky to have their job as a cop. They’ve been trained to obey orders. If they don’t then they can move back into their shack.
They aren’t heroes but neither are they cowards. There are clearly some heroes in the mix though. Lots of stories of people doing some darn brave things.
Since the get go, Armies have have had trouble and have to this day used all methods to get one human to kill another.
Even citizens coming out of mind controlled states like Imperial Japan, Hitler's Germany, or Stalin's Russia have had to use execution as a motivation.
“You are not well educated.”
You are not educated in the essences which make a man a manor, or,for that matter, a human a human..
It requires no training for two men to rush into a burning school bus and rescue the trapped children.
It requires no training to grab a weapon and go to the aid of the teenage girl babysitting next door when yo see a gang of hoods breaking down her door.
It takes basic humanity my friend-—and our newspoopers recount examples of it every day.
You don’t have to have military training to do what needs to be done in an emergency. You simply need heart.
In this case, even the photographer observed, “They ware sitting Ducks.”
Yep and some cops cannot be trusted with a taser.
“I have seen servants riding, and princes walking as servants upon the earth.” -Proverbs
Bingo!
I was not in any way, shape, manner or form comparing the security guard to a police officer.
This thread and earlier posts to this thread remarks were made about why the police in Bombay did not return fire.
None of us know in advance how we would react to "coming under fire" be it civilian self defense, military or law enforcement.
The "security officer" at the New Life Church was armed. Fortunately his actions or lack of action did not cost innocent lives or injures.
A civilian with a CCP bailed his butt out.
That’s why a man who knew war—as well as academia-—remarked that the M-1 Garand was the best weapon ever invented.
You’re talking about Appalachian School of Law. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appalachian_School_of_Law_shooting and especially: Students subdued the shooter.
Weapons are inert, inanimate objects with no will or volition.
Not at all. I was reading about the men who came through a scorched area and happened across a bird. Incinerated, but underneath it's wings were live unharmed chicks.
It's called "fight or flight".Many different variables determine outcomes.
Clint Eastwood captured some good righteous anger that is in our instinct.
And Alvin York struggled with this in real life.
“Weapons don’t make the man.
Weapons are inert, inanimate objects with no will or volition.”
Glad you understand that. Military and Police training don’t make the man either.
Heart makes the man.
Now we ask what should a normal man born in India. Has the influences of a couple hundred years of British culture do when he sees multitudes being machine gunned in the street?
He should adopt a prone position steady his weapon and squeeze off a round at the nearest terrorist.
No?
He has had some training-even you will admit. He also has worked through some scenarios in his mind-—law enforcement types do that-—even in India.
These men had everything they needed (as the photographer rightly recognised) to limit the number of casualties.
Admit it my friend. Your pusillanimous excuses for these reluctant cops carry no water.
I hope you would do your duty in a situation like this.
If not, you need some heart surgery.
Perhaps they were like the people in New Orleans; waiting to be told what to do rather than to do the obvious.
India's marital values are very good-—better than most of western Europe I'll bet.
The defenders of the Alamo had no “Later education,” by which I believe you are referring to a four-year degree or, perhaps, graduate school. They had little military training. And they sure as Gehenna never had any psychology (The fraudulence had not been forced upon American education yet). They did their jobs. Every man took his targets to the tune of over 2500 casualties—few if any of which resulted from artillery, bombings, and indirect fire.
Now, Leisler, you just admit that you have taken the wrong side of this argument in seeking to justify criminal non-action on the part of these police officers.
From Wikipedia:
On January 16, 2002, ASL Dean Anthony Sutin, Professor Thomas Blackwell, and 1L student Angela Dales were shot and killed by disgruntled student Peter Odighizuwa, 43, of Nigeria.
When Odighizuwa exited the building, he was subdued by two students armed with personal firearms.
At trial, Odighizuwa was found mentally competent, plead guilty to the murders to avoid the death penalty, and was sentenced to multiple life terms in prison.[6]
FreeRepublic member comes up with the information again.
Many Thanks
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