Posted on 11/25/2008 5:48:29 AM PST by jmaroneps37
All valid points.
Your last option is to close. If the feds want to offer care let them.
I do not think it is easy nor is it desirable for the catholic hospitals to close. But neither is it easy or desirable to allow themselves to be forced to commit murder.
If dancing with the devil is the only choice left, you sit it out. And you make damn sure people know why you are doing so.
To do otherwise is to give up any claim to moral authority.
People say that all the time....but I don't think it's remotely accurate.
I could give you hundreds of examples....but I'm sure you can think of some yourself.
FRegards-
I was referring to more of a political backlash.
Rubbish. Most of the “Catholics” who voted for Obama could not care less about abortion. If they didn’t heed the bishops before the election, why will they care now?
Now that the Church has gone public so forefully Could you Please explain this story to me?
Catholic Campaign for Human Development Has Given ACORN $7 Million
by Phyllis Schlafly
11/11/2008 Print This
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Do you wonder why 2008 election data shows that the majority of Catholics voted for Barack Obama even though his record as Illinois state senator proves him the most pro-abortion candidate who ever ran for president?
Perhaps one answer is that on the Sunday before Thanksgiving, millions of Catholics will again be putting in their church’s collection plate their annual donation to what the pre-printed envelope calls “Campaign for Human Development: The Catholic Church working to end poverty and injustice in America; We’ll turn your dollars into hope for the poor of our nation.”
The generous Catholics who respond to that well-phrased appeal probably think they are making a Good Samaritan gift to provide necessaries to the down-and-out. Most would probably be shocked to learn that the money donated to the Campaign for Human Development (CHD) does not go for charity but for radical Obama-style community organizing.
Over the last 10 years, CHD has given $7.3 million of Catholic-donated dollars to the Saul Alinsky-style group called ACORN (Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now). When in 1998 some Catholics complained that CHD grants were not used for Catholic charity but were actually funding groups opposed to church teachings, CHD changed its name to Catholic Campaign for Human Development (CCHD).
The name change did not redirect the flow of money. In 2007 alone, CCHD increased its support of ACORN, giving it 37 grants totaling $1,037,000.
Continued>>>> http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=29441
The federal funding for the indigent is nigh impossible to turn their backs on. 40-50 years ago, Catholic hospitals were staffed with nursing sisters who did their work for God and not mammon, and the hospital did not need government money. The liberalization of the Church resulted in fewer vocations. You can hardly find a nun in a Catholic hospital any more. The Church is reaping what her radicals have sown.
Maybe Congress isn't sending police to places of worship to prevent people from assembling there, but if they pass this they are telling any doctor, nurse, or hospital employee to choose between their religious beliefs and unemployment, in some cases destitution.
And for what? They can't actually force a pro-life doctor to perform an abortion...all they can do is prevent him from practicing medicine. No one benefits, but it pleases the fanatics on the pro-abortion side to take this extreme stand.
I think we need to start a thread on which to collect examples of Newspeak as perpetrated by Obama and his minions:
‘Freedom of Choice Act’ as a name for a bill which denies healthcare providers the choice of not performing abortions is an outstanding example.
‘Employee Free Choice Act’ for a bill that would deny secret ballots in unionization votes is another.
The election of Obama certainly validated “Ignorance is strength!”
Law with names like that seem to be a bit start on “Freedom is slavery!”
If the pattern keeps up, a lot of Obama’s stary-eyed peacnik supporters will be really dissapointes when “War is peace!” kicks in.
Pro-Life PING
Please FreepMail me if you want on or off my Pro-Life Ping List.
ONE NATION UNDER GOD
I’m not so sure that the FOCA showdown will have any impact on CINO’s who voted for Obama. I am of the belief that the majority of them have pretty much sold out to Satan and could give a flying frog whether they are complicit in the murder of babies. I hope I’m wrong, but the CINO’s I know who voted for Obama already believe in abortion, they are that far gone.
None or almost-none of the hospitals are owned by dioceses which would put them under the direct control of the head of the diocese (the "Ordinary.") Almost all of them are controlled by Boards of Directors or Boards of Trustees, and the days are long gong when these boards were staffed or controlled by the religious orders of the founders (e.g. Franciscans, Sisters of Mercy, etc.)
So you've got pretty-much-independent boards running Catholic Hospitals, and their compliance with the Ethical and Religious Directives for Catholic Health Care Services relies on their voluntary coopertion. There is no enforcement mechanism that I am aware of, except for purely ecclesiastical ones (e.g. institutionally, the hospital could be required to remove the word "Catholic"; individually, a person who defied the bishop's direct orders could be excommunicated. Which is only meaningful if the person in question is Catholic: not a sure thing anymore.)
So the bishop says "resist"; and the Board says "cut a deal"; and the bishop responds: "Well then, er, you can no longer all yourselves a Catholic hospital." And the Chairman of the Board shrugs and says, "Sounds OK to me."
I can see this happening. I am truly afraid.
I hope the bishops realize they won't have a chance unless they can mobilize the "Christifideles," the faithful laity. I mean protests, sit-ins, fax attacks and publicity campaigns --- a whole Alinsky-style campaign --- to save our hospitals and keep them pro-life.
See quote from Bishop Hermann of St. Louis in my tagline.
The closing of even one hospital based on FOCA would be a victory of sorts. If the hospital boards refuse to yield to their bishop’s authority and go secular at least the red line in the sand will have been drawn and some will be saved. Those CINOs who voted for Obama and abortion Joe won’t come back, but even if a few do that will be a good thing. The cleansing of the Church of another ugly stain would be a good thing and a show of hands - “Who’s with us and who’s against us?” would be a great first step to rebuilding the Church. We have 67 million paper Catholics and about 25 million real Catholics now. That number would change and we will pick up another 2 or 3 million. The new number would be easier to work with and so on....
As you can see the glass is always half full for me :-)!
Calif. priest tells Obama supporters to confess
The Freedom of Choice Act showdown is coming; it will change everything
Doug Kmiec’s Departure from the Pro-life Movement
FOCA's effects seen as dire, but chance of it passing considered slim
Why Kmiec Will Not Become The New Vatican Ambassador
Abortion Advocates Downplay Potential for Passing Radical FOCA Bill
Lose-Lose on Abortion; Obama's threat to Catholic hospitals and their very serious counterthreat.
Administrator of the Catholic Diocese of Charleston stepped in it (Re: Fr. Newman)
Obama Picks Staffer of Pro-Abortion Group as Comm Director
Catholic Leader: Excommunication Possible for Backing Pro-Abortion Bill
The Death of Catholic Culture and the Election of Barack Obama (Catholic Caucus)
Pew study finds election coverage of religion was shallow (don't we know it!)
Biden experiencing troubled conscience over abortion, says Bishop Aquila
Guest Opinion: Fr. Jay Scott Newman in the Lion's Den
Interview with Bishop Hermann on the Courage to Die for Life
U.S. Bishops Cut All Funding to ACORN, Activities Funded Hard to Determine
Pew Study Finds Less Than One Percent of Election Coverage Included Abortion
Douglas Kmiec: Barack Obama More Catholic Than Previous Pro-Life Presidents
Newman in the Lion's Den (For taking care of business.)
How Tom Daschle Might Kill Conservatism [Obamacare: make us dependent, then how to shrink gov't?]
Obama Selecting Most Anti-Life&Family Rads He Can Find-plans to dismantle protection for marriage
Cardinal Stafford Stands by Criticism of Obama
Catholic Church Warns Obama of War between administration and Church
Kmiec: Barack Obama More Catholic Than Previous Pro-Life Presidents (Total Moron Alert)
Bishop discusses reasons behind cutoff of ACORN funding
Planned Parenthood Prez Falsely Says Election Means Catholics Pro-Abortion
A Pro-Life Nughtmare: Daschle Appointed as the new Secretary of Health And Human Services
Planned Parenthood CEO Claims Cardinal O'Malley Out of Step With Catholics
S.C. POLITICIAN RIPS CATHOLICISM
Election Results Don't Mean Pro-Life Movement to Stop, Limit Abortions is Dead
Pro-life movement: Both ends against the middle
Abortion: Obama’s nightmare.
A Pro-Life Nightmare: Daschle Appointed as the new Secretary of Health and Human Services
(Not Embryonic)Stem Cell Method Seen as Success (New York Times Buries the Story)
(Anti-)Catholic slur draws ire from council colleagues (South Carolina)
Catholics Who Vote for Freedom of Choice Act Could Face Automatic Excommunication ( 'bout time! )
She'd Be Perfect for the Job -- (Not!) [When did you stop beating your captured Islamo-Nazi?]
The abortion president
Catholic Bishops finally step up against abortion Democrats
The Coming "War" Between the Obama Administration and the Catholic Church
Catholic Caucus: How to Fight FOCA with all resources of the Church
Fr. Newman Responds to Diocesan Concerns about Pro-Abortion Voting Letter
What Catholics Can Expect
Election Part I: “We Have No King But Caesar [Obama?]” (Reality Alert)
Pope says Catholics in politics must follow faith
Vatican cardinal: Obama is 'Aggressive, Disruptive and Apocalyptic'
AmP Poll: Was SC priest right to suggest confession for Obama voters? [Catholic Caucus]
OKAY OF EMBRYONIC CELL RESEARCH WILL INTRODUCE HIDDEN DANGER..PROPHESIED AS 'COMPARABLE' TO ABORTION
Finally, a Religious Leader with Guts
Bishop Blasts Pro-Choice Politicians (Bishop from Biden's "hometown")
SC priest: No communion for Obama supporters
Our Pastor is in the news because of this article
SC priest: No communion for Obama supporters
Voting bishops [Catholic Caucus]
On the end of Catholic Hospitals
Catholic professor'Kmiec] draws protesters Conservative voted for Obama
Catholic Church drops ACORN funding
Obama has first telephone conversation with the Pope
Catholic bishops will fight Obama on abortion
Catholics gird for fight with Obama on abortion, Paterson, NJ bishop takes a leading role
Jill Stanek: Moving On After Barack Obama, How a Disabled Boy Restored My Pro-Life Fire
Catholic Bishops Urge Huge Anti-FOCA Campaign to Stop Abortion Expansion (Might Close Hospitals)
Abortion and Euthanasia Bringing about the Demise of Catholic Health Care: Catholic Obstetrician
To accept abortion is to challenge God, Lord of all things...
USCCB: Church should oppose FOCA 'early and often,' Niederauer (Pelosi's Archbishop) says
Cardinal [George]: Obama's Presidency Heals Racism, Now Time to End Abortion
CNN’s Rick Sanchez: Does the GOP ‘Have to Be Anti-Abortion’?
Catholic bishops plan to forcefully confront Obama
Niece of Martin Luther King Jr.: "The Dream" Is Not Yet Fulfilled
Barone: Media wanted Palin abortion
New York Subway Riders Respond to Ad and Share Post-Abortion Grief, Agony
Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr's Niece{Dr. Alveda King]: Abortion Means Obama Doesn't Fulfill Dream
Bishops to present concerns on abortion, other issues to politicians
Kneeling Before the World [Catholic Caucus]
Fr. Frank Pavone of Priests for Life Receives Post-Election Death Threat
Barone: 'Liberal media' wanted Palin to abort
BISHOPS APPROVE BLESSING FOR CHILD IN THE WOMB
FIRST THINGS: Obama and the Bishops
Head of U.S. bishops says no compromise on abortion
Washington Post Admits Bias for Obama, Calls Pro-Life Policies "Offensive"
Washington Post Admits Bias for Obama, Calls Pro-Life Policies "Offensive"
Novena for the Protection of the Unborn
Carving Out a Better Respect Life Position
Prez Herod (post election reflection)
Wash Post: Pro-Life Views "Ideologically Offensive"
Vatican fires off warning to Barack Obama over stem cell research
Election of Obama a Disaster for Pro-Life Fight in EU and Africa: Prominent Kenyan Physician
Bishops will not skip debate on abortion and politics
Obama's Startling Reaction to Funeral Service for Baby Killed After Failed Abortion
MCCL [MN's largest pro-life organization] achieves nearly all pro-life goals in 2008 election
No "Presidential sleight of hand" on stem cells
Voting for Reproductive Freedom (NYT pro-abort alert)
Abortion Groups Confident Obama Will Push His Pro-Abortion Agenda
Obama reviews Bush orders on stem cells, drilling
Obama reviews Bush orders on stem cells, drilling (Be prepared for the gas prices to go up)
Let us Celebrate Barrack Obama, Let us Celebrate Life
Obama Positioned to Quickly Reverse Bush Actions Stem Cell, Climate Rules
Pro-Life Dem Breakthroughs (Bad News for FOCA?)
Stopping FOCA: EWTN TV w/ Gianna Jessen, Sister Nirmala, Archbishop Burke, among others(?)
Dr. Alveda King to Pro-Lifers: Forward, March
What America Has Done (Was the election about racial equality or the right to life?)
The Freedom of Choice Act: Radical Attempt to Prematurely End Debate over Abortion
Becket Fund to Award Canterbury Medal to Archbishop Charles J. Chaput, OFM Cap.
Doug Kmiec to give election ‘post-mortem’ at Calif. seminary [Catholic Caucus]
Fighting FOCA (the time to act is now!)
Billy Graham Won't Advise Obama Because of Strong Pro-Abortion Position
Bishop Carlson: Our witness must grow stronger (Statement on election results)
Back to the Drawing Board (several bishops calling for Faithful Citizenship to be overhauled)
On Eucharistic Consistency (Florida bishop urges Biden to examine conscience before Communion)
Future Obama abortion legislation will violate conscience rights, PRI president says
THERE IS STILL A GOD IN HEAVEN!
Bill Berkowitz: Religious Right Down but Not Out
Freedom of Choice Act - Election Implications
A Post – Election Reflection: Pray, Plan and Participate
Payback Time: What Planned Parenthood Expects from Barack Obama
Life will not go on
Catholic Leaders React to Obama Victory, Offer Advice
Archbishop Chaput Eager to See Kmiec Deliver a Pro-Life Obama
History, Hyperbole and Horror (Eye opening)
[Electing Obama] A Grave Mistake and an Abiding Hope
Fight FOCA (Unlimited Abortion) Sign the Fight FOCA Petition ASAP Get Involved!!
Douglas W. Kmiec on 'Obama's Miracle'
"The Killing Must End”: Christian Defense Coalition to Launch Major Post-Inaugural Pro-Life Campaign
Pro-Life Advocates Urged to Renew Efforts Against Abortion After Election Loss
Obama Pushes Abortion on Day One With Emanuel Pick
Warriors with Our Eyes Fixed on Heaven (Bishop Finn's Excellent Column) [Ecumenical]
FYI:
From my email from Father Pavone of Priests for Life:
“Also, I’m happy to announce a new website:
www.AskFatherFrank.com. This is an easy way to ask me a question on any pro-life topic. With the help of my staff, I’ll get you an answer as soon as possible. Also, the website will feature some of the more frequently asked questions, with standard answers. Please spread the word.”
We might want to ask Father Pavone on his suggestions on trying to fight FOCA.
>>Why do these draconian laws always have such deceptive names? Howe stupid can sheeple be and for how long?
Orwell was a prophet.
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