Posted on 10/17/2008 9:39:59 AM PDT by truthandlife
I watched it last weekend, and my 13 year old son sat and watched it. It had his attention more than the X Box downstairs.
mostly due to inaccuracies with testing
My daughter and her husband refused to abort a child that was supposed to have mosaic something trigeminy- caused some flack with the ethicist but they held their ground and Matthew was fine. No problems. Same thing happened to a young woman I worked with at that time. She and her husband refused to abort. Their son was fine when born also.
We live with the decisions we make. Doesn’t hurt to trust the Lord will help whatever the medical outcome when one does not abort.
I don't know, maybe like:
"You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and he stood not in the truth; because truth is not in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof."
or
"Repent therefore of this your wickedness, and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you. For I see that you are poisoned by bitterness and bound by iniquity."
or
"Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers' guilt. Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell?"
Unless, of course, the patient has the same feelings that you believe happened in this case, which is that they really didn't want the child in the first place. Doc certainly wouldn't be much at risk if he's given someone justification for ridding themselves of an unwanted child, would he?
In this country, nobody needs “justification” if they want to have an abortion. If you’re pregnant and don’t want to carry to term, you go have an abortion. If a woman is flaky enough to wait for some half-baked undefinitive “justification” like a doctor saying her fetus “might” have Downs, before proceeding with an abortion she wanted anyway, she’s also flaky enough to change her mind after the fact. Especially when she realizes she’s already rid of the baby she didn’t want anyway, and now has guaranteed route to collecting a few million dollars by suing the doctor. And you can be sure that ob/gyns and their malpractice insurers know this.
As I drove into the clinic parking lot to have an abortion done for my young Mexican girlfriend, I suddenly felt terrible, and said I didn’t want to go thru with it. she said we have come this far, ( a long trip up to the states) so take me to the doctor. she said it was the worst day of her life. for me, I had to face the fact that I killed my unborn child. that was 4 yrs ago,,,I still cannot forgive myself.
/hugs
Now you know we're not talking about "legal" justification, but "moral" justification, since the morality of this man's decision is the gist of this thread.
Maybe I'm a little sheltered, but I have not yet heard of a case where a woman, after aborting on the information from her doctor that her child had Down's Syndrome, turned around and sued the doctor because it was determined afterward that the baby was normal. Do you know of such a case? Is it a matter of law that a post-abortion determination of Down's Syndrome, or whatever malady, be done? Because if not, I would be willing to bet that most women wouldn't want to know the truth. Because, after all, the final decision to abort lies with the mother alone, and most wouldn't be able to handle the added guilt. No doctor can force a woman to have an abortion, can he/she? Since insurance carriers deal in statistical probabilities, I doubt this type of situation is their #1 concern.
A more likely scenario is a woman giving birth to a Down's Syndrome baby and suing the doctor for not giving her previous information that would have allowed her to abort. Or a woman suing her doctor because he scared her into having risky amnio to confirm a preliminary blood test, and consequently losing a wanted child, especially if it turns out the baby was normal.
Bottom line, I don't believe it's credible for you to dismiss all of the posters' independent experiences as false, fantasy, or whatever adjective you choose. There are bad actors in every profession, and the fact that many doctors have no qualms about aborting in the first place, in complete defiance of their Hippocratic Oath, tells me that a lot of them don't take their pledge to "first do no harm" seriously.
You don't seem to have any trouble believing that - in your own words - "a woman is flaky enough to wait for some half-baked undefinitive “justification” like a doctor saying her fetus “might” have Downs, before proceeding with an abortion she wanted anyway, she’s also flaky enough to change her mind after the fact. Especially when she realizes she’s already rid of the baby she didn’t want anyway, and now has guaranteed route to collecting a few million dollars by suing the doctor." - yet you cannot fathom a doctor trying to take the easy way out?
HEY BUB....I DON”T LIKE BEING CALLED A LIAR...IT HAPPENED EXACTLY like I siad it did!!! The Doc heard a heartbeat LONG AFTER he HADN”T....that’s why he said she was going to have a MONSTER....NOW I EXPECT AN APOLOGY....if you have it in you.
ping to #70.
A lot of people who went this route feel this way, because it helps them to rationalize their decision and make it "OK" when they know deep inside that it is not. They will be inwardly tormented until they repent.
The really horrible thing is that the baby didn't have Downs and didn't have to die. The doctors and those who interpreted the tests have his innocent blood on their hands as well.
Therapy won’t help this man in this life or the afterlife.
He and his wife need to see a priest and repent. Only then can healing begin.
Unfortunately, there ARE doctors like this. I personally had no less than THREE of them pressuring me to have an abortion because they were convinced my baby was dead or dying (with no ultrasound or any other diagnostic method taken) and I was "miscarrying".
I took it up to the head obstetrician and he sent me home. The bleeding stopped, and four days later we heard the heartbeat on the doppler.
One of the doctors approached my husband a few months later to ask how I was. Husband said I was ready to deliver. "That wasn't supposed to happen!" was the doctor's incredulous response.
If he had his way, my precious daughter (normal in every way) would not be here, and my granddaughter wouldn't be either.
All I know is that, as a pro life woman, if I found I was carrying multiples, I would not be able to sentence some of them to death in the hopes that the others might live. I am not God and I could not bear the guilt of willingly killing my own child.
Maybe I’m not as good a Christian as some on this thread but when I think about my own brother with Down Syndrome, I can’t find it in me to have sympathy for this man who killed his less-than-perfect child. I hope his daughter never suffers an accident that renders her less than perfect, or dear old Daddy might pull the plug on her too.
And, about to start my second trimester of my own very first pregnancy, I don’t understand any woman who could agree to have doctors induce premature labor in order to kill her child... I think even less of such women than I did before. Maybe it’s the maternal hormones that make me judgemental. I think I would be a bad pro-life witness right now.
That’s not what you said in your original post. But it’s not a whole lot different really. Once a heartbeat is audible, it stays audible until it stops. If it’s unusually fast or slow for a significant length of time, before going back to being normal, then that could be evidence of some serious abnormality. But if a doctor said he couldn’t hear it at all, and then later in the pregnancy started hearing it again, then the problem was with the doctor’s hearing or stethoscope or other device that was being used. If a fetus’ heartbeat stops, the fetus is dead, and they don’t come back from the dead. And that’s something any doctor (and any nurse, even) would know. Either the doctor was flat-out insane or your friend missed a lot of what he actually said.
That doesn’t sound like the same thing at all, i.e. not the same as being eager to terminate Downs pregnancies that are otherwise proceeding normally. If you were bleeding heavily, and they thought you were clearly miscarrying, they probably were quite reasonably concerned for YOUR life. Hemorrhaging to death as a result of natural miscarriage is not all that uncommon, if medical treatment, i.e. surgically completing the miscarriage and stopping the bleeding, isn’t undertaken promptly. Can doctors make the wrong call in a situation like this? Sure (though it’s telling that the HEAD obstetrician wasn’t so sure). But a doctor’s goal in a case like that is to avoid death or permanent physical harm to the mother (and, of course, resulting career-ending malpractice suits), in a situation where it appears very unlikely to them that the baby will survive either way.
The head obstetrician told me "he'd seen worse" and women still carried to term. He sent me home with a checklist and instructions to stay in bed until the crisis passed. It did, they took a blood test and an ultrasound and the fetus was 'viable'.
What boiled my husband's blood was the doctor who was so convinced that he was right that there was no other alternative.
This was a military hospital, so they didn't have to worry about being sued either.
Ive heard of this type of thing happening. Modern "medicine".
I'd rather had a world full of Elaines than this selfish couple who would rather kill their child than perhaps live with some inconveniences. I am filled with rage at the slightest hint these children are anything less in the sight of God.
I also have a wonderful grandson who was diagnosed as autistic as a youngster. There are bastards who believe they should be aborted.
Well, for anyone who thinks my grandson is not as worthy as anyone else, I have news for you. My grandson is MORE worthy of life than anyone who thought he should be aborted.
Sorry for the rant but I do not see two side of this issue.
I hope this man can get some peace but he's going to have to repent first and I don't see him being truly sorry. He'd have to get out there and try to get others in the same situation to see that it is wrong to kill.
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