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Surburban Flight: Commuting to Work Less Attractive as Gas Prices Soar
Madistan.com ^ | July 16, 2008 | Mike Ivey

Posted on 07/16/2008 5:43:59 AM PDT by Diana in Wisconsin

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To: MinnesotaLibertarian
I don't know how you think people can just move around willy-nilly without regard to spouse's jobs, children, schools, extended family, friends, cost of moving, cost of selling, cost of buying. There are a WHOLE lot of considerations when moving. You're being a little too pollyannish.

Living in the city works for you, fine...it does NOT work for everyone. Don't be so myopic.

81 posted on 07/16/2008 7:27:00 AM PDT by tsmith130
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To: IYAS9YAS

That was a typo - meant to say NOT inherently liberal.


82 posted on 07/16/2008 7:27:10 AM PDT by MinnesotaLibertarian
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To: Diana in Wisconsin

This will be the situation as long as oil is a monopoly.


83 posted on 07/16/2008 7:30:07 AM PDT by mysterio
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To: tsmith130
Not at all. Suburbs are merely part of a metropolitan area with a bigger city at its core. I'm talking about actual cities, with a downtown. Cities with populations between 200,000 and 600,000 is what I mean by smaller cities.
84 posted on 07/16/2008 7:30:44 AM PDT by MinnesotaLibertarian
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Comment #85 Removed by Moderator

To: olivia3boys

I agree that’s a motivating factor, and I don’t fault people for living in the suburbs. I’m faulting people who now can’t afford their current lifestyle and somehow think they’re entitled to it and that they’re better than people who have never gotten to live the lifestyle they wanted.

As for public schools, when I have kids I don’t plan on letting them anywhere near them, whether in the city or the suburbs.


86 posted on 07/16/2008 7:33:56 AM PDT by MinnesotaLibertarian
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Comment #87 Removed by Moderator

To: ClearCase_guy

Not really. If the government is going to raise taxes to pay for more crap they shouldn’t be doing, they’re going to do it anyway. More people in the city should actually slow the bleeding, because they’ll have more revenue. Also, if more conservative-minded people move in, we could replace some of the bums that are in city government.


88 posted on 07/16/2008 7:36:24 AM PDT by MinnesotaLibertarian
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To: Diana in Wisconsin
Remind me which party was running on lowering fuel prices for the 2006 election cycle....

Take a look at the prices since pig-losi and dingy hairy took over congress in Jan 2007. Click on the "Regular Gasoline Average Prices" about 1/3 way down on the left side of the page and calculate for the past 18 months. $2.13 - $4.12 today.

Gas Buddy

89 posted on 07/16/2008 7:37:11 AM PDT by Arrowhead1952 (A vote for any Democrat from BO on down the ticket is a vote for $10 a gallon gas.)
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To: Darnright

Then that’s fine. I’m not criticizing suburbs, I’m criticizing people who think they’re entitled to cheap gas.


90 posted on 07/16/2008 7:37:34 AM PDT by MinnesotaLibertarian
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To: sandyeggo
for non-rent-controlled apts, rent can hypothetically go up any amount i believe. but usually if you are a good tenant and pay rent on time, they only push it up slightly.

let's say you pay $1375.00/month in rent on a 1 year lease. when the lease is up they would offer you another year lease at $1400.00/month or a 2 year lease for $1425.00/month.

if they tried to raise rent by hundreds of dollars, i'd just find another place. apartments are plentiful, but it makes the most sense to stay put.

91 posted on 07/16/2008 7:38:46 AM PDT by thefactor (the innocent shall not suffer nor the guilty go free...)
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To: tsmith130

If the costs and inconvenience of moving outweigh the benefits, then stay put, but don’t try to blame somebody else for putting you in that situation. A lot of people seem to think I’m criticizing living in suburbs, but I’m not. I’m criticizing people who think they have the RIGHT to live in the suburbs even if they can’t afford it anymore.


92 posted on 07/16/2008 7:40:03 AM PDT by MinnesotaLibertarian
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To: MinnesotaLibertarian
So, the recommendation is that:

People who can't afford their lifestyles in the suburbs should move to the cities.
People in the suburbs who feel entitled to things they have not earned, should move to the cities.

And the hope is:

Also, if more conservative-minded people move in, we could replace some of the bums that are in city government.

Don't hold your breath, brother!

93 posted on 07/16/2008 7:41:26 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy (Et si omnes ego non)
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To: Diana in Wisconsin

Why the hell would people move to the liberal city to drive to their jobs in the suburbs and exurbia?

These eco-fascists and smarxist growth fanatics are out of their minds. Businesses have been locating to suburbia and exurbia for decades. Why? Because that’s where they find productive citizens and a stable, sane work force. Families with children move away from cities because they find safety and community adhesion in towns outside liberal cities. Children are not welcome in liberal cities, and the exodus of families with children from liberal cities proves that. Seattle has more dogs than children, for Pete’s sake.

What business in its right mind wants to move to a liberal hellhole city with high taxes, high crime, crooked politicians, thieving bureaucrats, an oppressive regulatory labyrinth and crumbling infrastructure?

If that was the recipe for successful, thriving liberal cities, Detroit would be utopia.

Who would businesses hire in big cities? Some welfare bum with an IQ of a cockroach? Perhaps hire a drunk snoring in a doorway for VP of operations? Maybe hire a head-banger with three-inch diameter steel washers hanging from his tongue as community liaison?

Big, liberal cities are infested with unctuous Marxist cults that worship big brother government. And these hellholes are run by totalitarians who make it their business to steal money and wealth for themselves and rob people of their individualism and their God-given rights.

Only the insane, the destructive and simpering slaves find today’s liberal cities attractive. I’ll make an exception for the morbidly curious adventurers who locate to liberal cities to make big bucks for a few years and observe the liberal savages.

And that putrid Marxist punk Kunstler has been out in front of the fascist parade condemning individualism, self-reliance, liberty and wealth generation. He’s a one-man beer hall hate rally.


94 posted on 07/16/2008 7:42:18 AM PDT by sergeantdave (We are entering the Age of the Idiot)
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To: MinnesotaLibertarian

wimp....move to detroit..


95 posted on 07/16/2008 7:42:24 AM PDT by joe fonebone (The Second Amendment is the Constitutions reset button)
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To: CharlesWayneCT
I doubt she can save enough gas to be "worth it" to ride her bike part way. I don't know how far she is riding, but the last few minutes of a drive are when the car gets the best gas mileage, as it is warmed up. The first 10 minutes are generally worse for gas mileage.

Correct. She should bike the first leg and the drive the rest of the way.

96 posted on 07/16/2008 7:43:49 AM PDT by BlueMondaySkipper (Involuntarily subsidizing the parasite class since 1981)
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To: PurpleMan

I’m retired Army. A “house” was ALWAYS provided for me. Granted, for many years it was a tent, but still. At one point, I had a three bedroom condo on the Government dime for about $200 a month (that I DIDN’T get in my paycheck.) That rocked. :)

These folks either get a Housing Allowance, or there is on-post housing available...they just CHOOSE not to take it. I’ve also bunked with other military-types when we wanted to live off-post. There are ways around this stuff. I’m surprised military folk aren’t more creative.

Taking advantage of EVERY perk I earned while serving allowed me to buy my farm later in life and tell the Enviros and the Hippies to p*ss off. :)


97 posted on 07/16/2008 7:44:43 AM PDT by Diana in Wisconsin (Save The Earth. It's The Only Planet With Chocolate.)
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To: MinnesotaLibertarian

[Any big government program to gain “energy independence” is a joke.]

How is the Gov’t getting out of the way and allowing American business to develop our natural resources a big Gov’t program?


98 posted on 07/16/2008 7:46:56 AM PDT by KansasGirl (It is absolutely ridiculous that we have to fight congress for our own survival.)
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To: MinnesotaLibertarian

“I’m no liberal...”

Oh, BS. Every post you have made on this thread is straight-up liberal, Marxist crap.

You have every right to live anywhere you want in this country. I will not be herded like cattle into your dirty city. I will not cram myself into a crowded bus or subway car to get to work everyday.

“Wasteful”? Typical liberal. What I pay for is mine, jerk and I’ll use it how I damn well please. My wife drives an hour to and from work. That’s where the money is but we do not want to live there. She does it to increase our quality of life.

These stories are largely made up by opponents of “sprawl” and Marxist environmentalists who want us all bunched up in cities, relying on government to get us where we need to go and limiting our travel.

You don’t have a damn clue what libertarianism is. You are just another bossy liberal, seemingly hell bent on taking all the pleasure out of life.


99 posted on 07/16/2008 7:51:40 AM PDT by L98Fiero (A fool who'll waste his life, God rest his guts.)
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To: MinnesotaLibertarian
If people moved back in to cities where they could walk or bike to work, or drive a short distance on local roads maintained by a more accountable local government, we’d be less dependent on government.

Have you looked at property tax rates in cities lately? Here in the Chattanooga area, it is common knowledge that if you move from the county into the city, your property tax will double. And even the county tacks on some additional sales tax above the state portion.

When I was living in Ohio, cities were allowed to, and did charge income tax. The last I heard, the income tax for the privelige of living in Parma, Ohio (home of the red traffic light) was 2.5% of ones' wages.

You would think that the economies of scales would make government services cheaper in the city, but that is more than exceeded by the greed of politicians. Just look at per-pupil spending in the schools compared to the actual graduation rate. Cleveland spends upwards of 12,000 per pupil per school year and yet has a much worse graduation rate (and much lower test scores) than many of the rural school districts that spend $7000-8000 per student per year.

I would say that the governments in large, dense cities are far less accountable than those of smaller cities, towns, and counties.

100 posted on 07/16/2008 7:52:20 AM PDT by meyer (Government is the problem, not the solution.)
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