Colt M4 Carbine's Future Uncertain: Dark Clouds Forming

Defense Review ^ | 24 June 08 | David Crane

[Yo-Yo]

I believe the idea of having more smaller/lighter rounds started with Kalishnikov, and was defining characteristic of the “assault rifle”.

WWII Germany and the Sturmgewehr 44 was the first Assault Rifle.

The defining characteristic was a new medium cartridge that fell between a rifle cartridge and a pistol cartridge.

[NTHockey]

>>The theory is that a wounded soldier is more of a liability on the battlefield than a dead one. He can’t fight effectively, and he’ll slow everyone else down. A dead soldier just gets left behind. FWIW.

Like most theories, they fail when put to the most stringent tests. Ask any WWII vet what he thinks the effectiveness is of a wounded vs. dead enemy soldier.

Kill them all, let God sort them out.

[Yo-Yo]

Sorry - the 16 will never be available from the CMP for the same reason you can't get a 14 - the BATF says that "once a machine gun always a machine gun" and they cannot be "downgraded" to to a semi-auto.

Not true. Replace the automatic sear with a semi-automatic sear and the M4/M16 is legal again.

Unless Obama brings back the "Five Deadly Sins" of an eeeeeevil assault rifle: 1) detachable magazine 2) pistol grip 3) bayonet lug 4) flash supressor 5) folding stock.

[ctdonath2]

what ever happened to the development of caseless ammo?

Doesn't work. For cased rounds, the case removes most of the heat very quickly by ejecting the hot case. For caseless rounds, tremendous heat stays in the chamber, which cannot dissapate that heat fast enough for reliable long-burst full-auto use.

[Atlas Sneezed]

Fired an XM8 in 6.5 Grendel at SHOT. Incredible! 6.5 Grendel is a small round that fits the 5.56 form factor and has better downrange accuracy and ENERGY than 7.62 NATO!

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While it may have more energy than a 308 at the muzzle, I suspect that it lags behind the 308 once it covers much distance.

[ctdonath2]

Not true. Replace the automatic sear with a semi-automatic sear and the M4/M16 is legal again.

Not true. The BATFE will not allow that platform to be sold without several parts being changed to "semi-auto" versions, plus part of the receiver must be shaped to block function of said auto-sear. You can get in a lot of trouble for having an AR15 without the auto sear but with the other full-auto parts and milled-out receiver block.

[Atlas Sneezed]

I would love some 5.56 surplus for my mini 14. It is getting to the point where it is over $1.00 per round.

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Make midwayusa.com your starting point for good retail prices, and research from there for lower surplus prices.

[B4Ranch]

The 6.5 Grendel is too effective. It will result in an immediate increase in corpses with an equal reduction in wounded enemy fighters.

[B4Ranch]

No soldier on foot patrol in the jungle is going to spray and pray unless he’s receiving return fire. Ammo in the field is a highly prized commodity and delivery of replacement can be hours away.

[Yo-Yo]

http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/nfa/nfa_handbook/appendix_b.pdf

Basically the fire control group. Nothing said about milled receivers.

[taxcontrol]

M1A and M14 types can be reconfigured to a bullpup configuration making them IDEAL for tight quarters.

http://www.shortrifles.com/

[ctdonath2]

The link refers more to aftermarket "drop-in" auto sears. The standard M16/M4 auto sear requires the receiver be milled differently. And as the link says: "In order to avoid violations of the NFA, M16, hammers, triggers, disconnectors, selectors and bolt carriers must not be used in assembly of AR-15 type semiautomatic rifles, unless the M16 parts have been modified to AR-15 Model SP1 configuration", to wit you can't just swap sears and turn an M16/M4 into a legit semi-auto.

[Yo-Yo]

to wit you can't just swap sears and turn an M16/M4 into a legit semi-auto.

I am agreeing with you that I was wrong.

[NY.SS-Bar9]

I would suggest consulting an attorney before attempting such a conversion.

[MindBender26]

re: Energy.

No, that's the beauty of it. It's such a wind cheater that at 600 meters, it is better, stronger and flatter than 7.62NATO/308WIN!

Check up on it, it's most excellent. Surprisingly, this is very much like the round they originally wanted for M1 Garand, but we had too much 30.06 in stock, so they had a situation then like we have now with 5.56!

[MindBender26]

CALL A LAWYER! There is a very good 2d Ammendment guy in Jacksonville. Forgot his name. NRA would have it.

[Blood of Tyrants]

No soldier on foot patrol in the jungle is going to spray and pray unless he’s receiving return fire.

You are making my point. Ambushes of foot patrols by hidden Vietcong occurred quite often in Vietnam.

[CapnJack]

Not if I’m president. I’ll have 3/4 of the BATF behind bars doing hard time and M14s/M16s out to law abiding civilians with 2, 1000 rounds of Lake City to each CMP owning M14/M16 citizen.

[Joe 6-pack]

"WWII Germany and the Sturmgewehr 44 was the first Assault Rifle....The defining characteristic was a new medium cartridge that fell between a rifle cartridge and a pistol cartridge."

There are some amongst us that would argue the concept was a genuinely American one...granted the Germans coined the term Sturmgeweher and the weapons were designed for two very different roles, but when it came to actual battlefield usage, there really wasn't much difference...

[Future Snake Eater]

If you don't believe me, ask members of the U.S. Army Asymmetric Warfare Group (AWG).

HA! No thanks.

Honestly, I never had a problem with my M4, neither did any of my Soldiers. Through thick and thin that thing performed very well. Is there anything better out there? I have no doubt. Is it worth the outrageous sums of cash that we'd have to spend to replace not only the M4 but all the repair kits, spare parts, gauging equipment, etc etc (and possibly even the ammo it fires)? I kinda doubt it.