Posted on 06/23/2008 11:44:02 AM PDT by LibWhacker
Tran Trong Duyet - a sprightly retiree and amateur ballroom dancer - must rank as one of John McCain's more unlikely supporters.
Four decades ago, during the Vietnam war, Mr Duyet was in charge of the notorious Hoa Lo prison - the place where Mr McCain says he was brutally beaten and tortured during five-and-a-half years as an American prisoner of war.
"McCain is my friend," said 75-year-old Mr Duyet as he feeds the caged birds he now keeps in his garden in this coastal city.
"If I was American, I would vote for him."
Informal chats
Navy pilot John McCain was shot down during a bombing raid over the North Vietnamese capital, Hanoi, in 1967.
He ejected from his aircraft and parachuted into a city lake - only to be dragged out by an angry crowd, barely conscious, and with two broken arms and a broken leg.
From there he was taken to Hoa Lo prison, known to its American military inmates as the "Hanoi Hilton."
McCain has since described enduring months of solitary confinement and systematic torture which drove him to try to kill himself.
"I don't know how he'd react if he met me again," said Mr Duyet, flicking through old black and white photographs of himself and his American prisoners at Hua Lo.
"But I can confirm to you that we never tortured him. We never tortured any prisoners."
Mr Duyet reminisces instead about how he often summoned the future US presidential candidate to his private office for informal chats.
"We used to argue about the war - about whether it was right or wrong," he says.
"He is a very frank man - very conservative, and very loyal to his country and the American ideal.
"He had a very interesting accent and sometimes he taught me words in English and corrected my accent. I have followed his career since he left prison."
Rapprochement
So is Mr Duyet implying that that Senator McCain lied about his treatment at the Hanoi Hilton?
"He did not tell the truth," he says.
"But I can somehow sympathise with him. He lies to American voters in order to get their support for his presidential election."
But Mr Duyet's propaganda-perfect version of events is impossible to verify - and should be treated with caution in a country where the Communist authorities still keep a tight control over the media.
Relations between Vietnam and the United States have improved dramatically in recent years, following the normalisation of ties between the former enemies in 1995.
Mr McCain played a crucial role in bringing about that initial rapprochement - a fact which helps explain Mr Duyet's enthusiastic support for the McCain presidential campaign.
"I wish him success in the presidential election," he says.
"Of course the Americans started the war in Vietnam and killed so many people - but now we want to leave the past behind.
"So now I consider John McCain my friend because he did much to mend relations between our two countries. And if he becomes president he will do more to improve those ties."
“We never tortured any prisoners.”
I have heard too many vets talk about the torture they received to believe this crap.
I am not a McCain supporter but crap is crap and this is complete crap!
There is something deeply bizarre about a former communist jailkeeper who now engages in ballroom dancing.
Very hard picture to conjure up.
Mr. BOMAR. Good morning. My name is Jack Bomar, retired Air Force Colonel. I am a graduate of the “Fidel” Program, Class of 1968. I wish to thank the Members of this panel for their interest in uncovering the truth about a subject that has been buried for 31 years-especially you, Ileana Ros-Lehtinen from Florida. When I was shot down in 1967, we were flying an ECM aircraft out of Takhli, Thailand. It is kind of amazing that a SAM suppression aircraft can get knocked down by a SAM. But that is what happened. There were six of us on the aircraft; three of us survived. One was captured by the Chinese and turned over to the North Vietnamese. I went through the initial torture of peasants on the ground trying to spear me with spears as I came toward the ground. I kicked one of them aside and in doing that, I think I ruptured a disc in my back, and broke an ankle. I got a big chunk of shrapnel through my left leg before bailing out. So when I arrived in North Vietnam, I was not in the mood for games. I was tired, I just wanted a drink of water and to be allowed to lay down. The peasants tortured me all day.
Finally I got into Hanoi that night, and went into some real torture by the North Vietnamese.
They didn¹t need our “Fidel” to teach them how to torture people. The Vietnamese were experts at this. I went through what we call the “Rope Trick.” Your arms are tied behind your back, wrists in manacles and the pressure is slowly applied to the upper arms with straps. Eventually I was hung from a hook because I would not reveal the names of my crew.
Finally after three days with no food or water, constant interrogation, the camp commander was suddenly there, then gone. The torture guy-we call him “Straps and Bars”-applied the pressure again. Finally, they showed me a list of my crew members, so they had been working on one of the other three of us pretty harshly. I was sent to “The Zoo” and put in a camp where I met a delegation from the United States. There were three men in this delegation. One was a doctor, I think from France, one was a lawyer from Denmark or someplace, and the other was an anti war type from Berkeley, California, named Neilands, a professor from Berkeley. He and I immediately hit it off by him sticking out his hand-I was on crutches, had bandages from here to here to cover up all the wounds on my hands. I asked him, “What the hell are you doing in North Vietnam?” He said, “Dean Rusk, the son of a bitch, will not tell me where I can go and when I can be there.” So my purpose, primarily, was to get a letter to my family, which got my name out in public. We felt that if you were known to be a POW, your survival chances were much greater than those that were not known.
After that interrogation, I was tortured several more times by the Vietnamese and thrown into solitary. I was in solitary confinement in June. After the delegation visit, there was no more treatment for the hole in my leg. I dug the shrapnel out with my fingers. I was on crutches when I saw the delegation; but now the crutches were long gone. Because of my attitude at the delegation, I was stashed in solitary.
Suddenly they came in and wanted me to meet “several of my countrymen”. I think they said, “When you go to Quiz at night, it is a pretty scary thing; you are not sure what is coming.” I wasn’t sure when I walked in the room with Dum Dum and there were two Caucasians sitting at this table, and the one in the center was quite tall, spoke good English, had a Latin accent, offered me a cigarette, ,which I refused; and then I took it after a few words of encouragement from him. On his side was another gentleman-smaller, lighter hair, I believe-and they said, “Where do you think we are from?” I said “I think you are from Romania.” It was obvious that they were Latin Americans. He said he was there to help me with my defense. I was to be tried by the war crimes tribunal, the Bertrand Russell Tribunal for War Crimes against the Vietnamese people, and he would work on my defense for me. Then he sent me back to the room.
I didn’t know what to make of these two guys, but they weren’t the normal delegation like the one I had just seen. They were a little scarier; they were a little more intense. They were sitting with the camp commander to his right, which is a position of authority. I was called back a couple of days later after he told me now we must fill out a sheet of paper and you will describe your aircraft, 20 pages written there. I left it lying on my bunk. Being in solitary, I had a bunk there, a platform of boards, and I left it blank. Finally, at the last minute, I scratched in a crude sketch of the aircraft. This is a wing, this is a window, this is a door-this is the top, this is the bottom, pure nonsense. The next day I gathered up my stuff, and I met with two other POW’s. Ray Vohden was one of them, on crutches. He was badly hurt; he had also met “Fidel.” The other one was a gentleman named Dave Duart; I think he was an Air Force captain flying a 105. There we sat in this room looking at each other, wondering, what is going on here. Ray Vohden made the-I will not repeat the statement he made, but it was, I think, that we are in deep you-know-what. and we were.
We were in that position maybe three or four weeks. We would go to Quiz, he would threaten us; “Fidel” would threaten us. His entire program to me, I felt was, you will surrender. He didn’t say surrender to what, he didn’t say what he wanted you to do, he said surrender. I think he was running a surrender program up there and could get maybe 10 or 15 POW’s to surrender to anything that came up. That’s a bad position to be in.
I was badly tortured by him when I refused to surrender, or as he said, choose the match box or choose the cigarette case. The match box I chose and went through the straps again. It was just as bad the second time with the manacles that tore up my hands. I was just off crutches, I didn¹t walk that well right then. So he got my attention after a guard came running toward me and grabbed me by the throat and tried to crush my windpipe. That got my attention.
So I nodded, “I surrender.” There was some histrionics of knocking me around the room, and I was sent back to solitary confinement with some leg irons. We were finally joined in a large group, either nine or ten POW’s, and some of them are right here. Jim Kasler was not in our group, as such. I felt that we were being held in limbo there. He would threaten us. He would send us to Quiz. We would go back there, back and forth. He sounded like a Cuban revolutionary to me-Che Guevara. I made a big mistake one day; when Che Guevara died, I said something like “Good riddance”-really a bright statement at the time-and that got me in real big trouble, as if I could get in any more.
We were joined eventually by a fellow prisoner, Earl Cobeil. Cobeil was a complete physical disaster when we saw him. He had been tortured for days and days and days. I went down to clean him up. When “Fidel” dragged us down there, he said, Clean him up; and if anything happens to this man you, Bomar, are responsible.Then he hit him right in the face, knocked him down again. His hands were almost severed from the manacles. He had bamboo in his shins. All kinds of welts up and down all over; his face was bloody. He was a complete mess. They brought him into the room and as far as we could tell, Captain Cobeil was totally mentally out of it. He did not know where he was. I don¹t think he knew where he had been or where he was going. He was just there. ,”Fidel” began to beat him with a fan belt. I call it a fan belt but it wasn¹t really a fan belt. I think it was the side of a Russian truck tire, a very, very painful experience to be hit by this length of fan belt. I saw Cobeil hit as many as 12 or 13 times directly in the face. He never blinked his eyes. He never opened his mouth. He just stood there.
We had him in our cell for I would say 8 months or so. He refused to eat. He refused to bow to the guards. You must understand when the door opened, the guards demanded you will bow, all criminals will bow. We were always a criminal in North Vietnam. We were never a POW. We were governed by the camp regu-lations, not the U.S. code of conduct for military personnel. We took care of Cobeil for about a year. We force-fed him by holding him down, putting a stick in his mouth, and pushing the food down his throat. In all that time he never recognized anything that was going on. Finally he was removed from the room for electrical shock treatments, and then finally was gone. I understand he died a couple of years later there at the Hanoi Hilton. I don’t believe “Fidel” was in Hanoi just to torture American POW’s. I think that events controlled him that he had no control over. I think the Tet Offensive of 1968 was involved. I think when Johnson halted the bombing in 1968, that involved what “Fidel” was doing up there. I believe a conference that was taking place in Hanoi-Havana in 1968 had something to do with “Fidel” being up there. I think we were being prepared for some selective release that would enhance the Vietnam image of lenient and humane treatment worldwide. We were almost waiting for something to trigger this release.
“Fidel” used torture not for direct propaganda or anti war statement as the Vietnamese did. He used torture to break us initially, and to control us and keep us right under his thumb so we would do what he wanted done. His brutal torture of Cobeil and Kasler was due mostly to his frustration and his inability to force his will on others.
When he lost his temper, he was a complete madman. He would get red in the face; he just exploded with rage. So if you refused to bow to him like Cobeil refused to do or if I refused to take the cigarette case instead of the deal, his temper just went out of control. The North Vietnamese knew exactly what “Fidel” was doing up there. They may tell you that he was there to teach English to the guards. I don¹t think that had any part in it whatsoever. He was allowed to do to Cobeil, Kasler and others what was unjustifiable in any society, even a Communist society. Perhaps one day we will positively identify and locate this man. Thank you.
This lying little SOB should be tied down and whipped about the soles of his feet with a bamboo stick for this.
That is exactly what they did to my cousin who was in one of those places.
Or how about being put into a bamboo bird cage which was dug into the ground in a hollow? Put him in there during the rainy season and let the water SLOWLY rise to where all you could do is either drown or hold your head “face up” to not drown.
Lying POS!
“But I can confirm to you that we never tortured him. We never tortured any prisoners.”
Oh sure, they treated him like royalty. Any evidence of injury was due to his initial wreck, or he must have slipped on the runway when he returned to the U.S.
The Demokooks will believe this guy over any lying American soldier. He's a patriot in their eyes - he battled the evil invading Americans.
STATEMENT OF CAPTAIN RAYMOND VOHDEN, UNITED STATES NAVY, RETIRED
Mr. VOHDEN. Mr. Chairman, Members of the Committee, my testimony is a summary of a lengthier, more detailed statement. I ask that it be included in its entirety in the record.
Chairman GILMAN. Without objection. Mr. VOHDEN. In August 1964, I was assigned to Attack Squadron 216 as the operations officer flying in the A4C Skyhawk off the USS Hancock. Our carrier was in the South China Sea in early 1965 when the war against North Vietnam began to escalate.
On my fifth mission, I was shot down bombing a bridge in North Vietnam. I broke both bones above the ankle when I landed. I was then taken to the camp known as the Hanoi Hilton, where I was in complete solitary and was never moved off a wooden board for four months except to go to the hospital for two hours one night. For the next 2 1/2 years I was moved from camp to camp, until being sent to “The Zoo” in November 1965. In the early part of 1967, September 1967, I was looking forward to the end of the war and my homecoming, when one night I was taken to an interrogation. To my astonishment, the man sitting across from me was a Caucasian. One of the Vietnamese camp officers sat next to him. We talked about the war for the next half hour. He had an excellent command of English and appeared to be very knowledgeable about the U.S. and the war.
Several days later, I was moved to another room with Jack Bomar and another Air Force officer. They both had recently been shot down and had also talked to the Caucasian. One of us named him “Fidel” because we guessed he might be Cuban. Individually, we met with him daily. The war was essentially the main topic. One day I was taken to Quiz. “The Elf,” one of the other Vietnamese officers, was there. The Elf asked me four or five times, what orders did I give. I said, none. He left and came back with six or seven guards who forced me onto floor, put manacles on my wrists behind me and strapped my elbows together behind me. After some time he finally gave me a clue what the order was, it was about throwing food away. I had ordered-I was an SRO in a building one time before, and I told the guys to throw away some food because some of the younger people didn¹t get enough, so they thought it would be better if we didn’t turn back food. Five minutes later, as they were taking the manacles and straps off, the door burst open. In comes “Fidel,” ranting and raving like a madman, pointing his finger at me and telling me that I better have a good attitude now and do everything he says. He slapped me 10 or 15 times. I then had to write on a piece of notebook paper that I surrendered to the Vietnamese people and would do everything they wanted me to do. He told me other things to write and then told me to sign it and then eat it to prove I would do everything he told me to do. Eating paper is interesting.
I went back to the room with Bomar, but Bomar and Duart were gone. For the next two weeks, I was beaten 3 or 4 times a day until I became demoralized and depressed and started to lose my appetite. I finally gave up eating anything. After failing to eat several meals, “Fidel” came in yelling and screaming at me that I was trying to cheat him again and that he would kill me if I didn’t eat. I had reached bottom. I didn’t care if I lived or died. “Fidel” just stood there and watched. Without a word, he left. A week later, the tactic shifted; the treatment improved. “Fidel” responded if we didn’t use what he gave us we would be very sorry. One by one, more POW’s joined us; all had been forced to surrender. At Quiz, “Fidel” tried every argument in the book to convince us that the U.S. was wrong in its war of aggression. Every day he reminded us not to become reactionary or we would suffer. One morning in early 1968, one of the camp officers came to the outside of our room and disconnected the wires to our speaker.
Later that day we heard from guys in another building who had heard the radio program that the first three U.S. prisoners had been released by the Vietnamese. I felt very relieved and proud of myself and the others who served with me in the “Fidel” program because, although I can¹t say for sure what the original purpose of Fidel’s presence was, I believe, the way the program was run, that its purpose was to find someone who could be of value to the North Vietnamese if released. Some found it hard to believe that “Fidel” expected us to adopt the enemy views on the war and talk about good treatment after we were tortured and forced to surrender; but after getting to know “Fidel,” I could see how this was his goal and how he believed it was possible.
After “Fidel” failed in having any of his group released, the “Cuba Program” continued without any real purpose or meaning. Two weeks later I moved to another room with Paul Schultz. I rarely saw “Fidel” again, except on one or two occasions. “Fidel” had been working with some other men and it appeared that one of them, Earl Cobeil, was resisting “Fidel” to the maximum. Of course, “Fidel” was retaliating. Several days after I was moved, Earl Cobeil was moved in with Don Waltman into the room next to mine. Waltman said Earl was all mixed up in his mind. On one occasion, one of the guards, Grimsey, came to the shower area and took us back to our room. “Fidel” was standing at the door. All three of us lined up. I had moved into this room with Waltman and Cobeil. We went to the shower, then we came back. So Waltman and I bowed, but Cobeil just stood there again. I said, “Hey, Cobeil, bow.” Nothing happened. Suddenly Grimsey raised his leg and pushed his foot against Cobeil¹s body, who went tumbling over toward the back of the room. “Fidel” yelled loudly at Cobeil to stop cheating him or he would teach him a lesson he would never forget. The door closed.
After having seen “Fidel” for almost every day for six months, I knew that “Fidel” was going to get his way. He was not going to let the Vietnamese see him fail in any endeavor. I was convinced that he would take a man to any length to get what he wanted. In addition, the difference between the Vietnamese and “Fidel” was that more or less once the Vietnamese got what they wanted they let up at least for awhile. Not so with “Fidel.” There wasn’t a day that went by that there weren’t threats or warnings to all of us. I was in this room with Cobeil and Waltman now; and for the rest of the quiet hour, Waltman and I tried everything imaginable to get Cobeil to come down to earth, but we were unsuccessful. Shortly after the gong sounded ending the quiet hour, “Fidel” came to the door and told me to come outside. “Fidel” asked me if Cobeil was squared away. I told him that in my honest opinion, Cobeil was not at all rational; if he continued working Cobeil over, Cobeil would never make it. I was hopeful that he would believe me about Cobeil.
He accused me of trying to help Cobeil cheat him. The door was closed, locked, and bolted. I started to talk to Cobeil again for a few minutes, when all of a sudden, “Fidel” jumped up in the window, holding the bars, screaming in his loud voice, “I caught you, I caught you cheating me.” Seconds later the door slammed open. “Fidel” screamed to me, get out, get out. A few minutes later “Fidel” returned with what looked like a fan belt of a car, but cut so it was like a whip. As “Fidel” passed by he looked at me with a glaze in his eyes of an enraged madman. “Fidel” went in after Cobeil with Grimsey and Cedric. I could hear the thud of the belt against Cobeil’s body again and again as “Fidel” screamed. I guess Cobeil was hit around 20 or 30 times. It was hard to listen, as I did, to “Fidel” beating Cobeil, a frail, diminutive man, his wrists swollen three times the normal size, a vacant stare in his eyes already pushed by torture beyond the limit for which he might have a chance to regain his sanity. It had been far easier for me to endure the straps than to have to go through this.
The guards all stood around talking loudly, laughing and yelling in Vietnamese. When I saw “Fidel” with the fan belt, I was sur-prised, because up to that time I had never heard of anyone getting hit like that. As I stood there with my crutches, my heart and mind overflowed with emotion. It was the most sickening feeling to hear what was going on and know there was nothing I could do about it.
That was the last day I saw Cobeil. “Fidel” unmercifully beat a mentally defenseless, sick man to death. He, as well as the North Vietnamese Communists, must bear full responsibility for that and other acts.
There have been considerable efforts to locate “Fidel” in Cuba, but without success. I have often wondered what we would do if we found him. Try him as a war criminal? No mention was ever made to try the North Vietnamese leaders as criminals. Thus, I question whether trying to locate “Fidel” would be a wasted effort. Maybe this hearing and the interest shown by Congressman Gilman and Congresswoman Ros-Lehtinen to investigate will mean some justice will be served. [The prepared statement of Captain Vohden appears in the appendix.]
The Hanoi Hilton featured turn-down service, a 24 hour spa, an indoor Olympic size swimming pool, and complimentary wireless internet. Didn’t you know that? The Vietnamese Government should send the US a bill for the unpaid portion covering John McCain’s stay...
bump for later
That’s right, was it over when the Vietnamese bombed Pearl Harbor?
If McCain were 20 years younger I’m sure he’d love to spend 5 minutes alone with Mr Duyet to reminisce of the old days and repay him in kind for his hospitality.
Heck, I’m sure he might just like to do so even now.
I’m not a big fan of McCain the politician. I do however have absolute respect for the service and sacrifice he’s given the Country.
Thanks for posting that. I hope President McCain starts a program to track down and exterminate Fidel and the other torturers of American POWs.
oAfter “Fidel” failed in having any of his group released, the “Cuba Program” continued without any real purpose or meaning. Two weeks later I moved to another room with Paul Schultz. I rarely saw “Fidel” again, except on one or two occasions. “Fidel” had been working with some other men and it appeared that one of them, Earl Cobeil, was resisting “Fidel” to the maximum. Of course, “Fidel” was retaliating. Several days after I was moved, Earl Cobeil was moved in with Don Waltman into the room next to mine. Waltman said Earl was all mixed up in his mind. On one occasion, one of the guards, Grimsey, came to the shower area and took us back to our room. “Fidel” was standing at the door. All three of us lined up. I had moved into this room with Waltman and Cobeil. We went to the shower, then we came back. So Waltman and I bowed, but Cobeil just stood there again. I said, “Hey, Cobeil, bow.” Nothing happened. Suddenly Grimsey raised his leg and pushed his foot against Cobeil¹s body, who went tumbling over toward the back of the room. “Fidel” yelled loudly at Cobeil to stop cheating him or he would teach him a lesson he would never forget. The door closed.
After having seen “Fidel” for almost every day for six months, I knew that “Fidel” was going to get his way. He was not going to let the Vietnamese see him fail in any endeavor. I was convinced that he would take a man to any length to get what he wanted. In addition, the difference between the Vietnamese and “Fidel” was that more or less once the Vietnamese got what they wanted they let up at least for awhile. Not so with “Fidel.” There wasn’t a day that went by that there weren’t threats or warnings to all of us. I was in this room with Cobeil and Waltman now; and for the rest of the quiet hour, Waltman and I tried everything imaginable to get Cobeil to come down to earth, but we were unsuccessful. Shortly after the gong sounded ending the quiet hour, “Fidel” came to the door and told me to come outside. “Fidel” asked me if Cobeil was squared away. I told him that in my honest opinion, Cobeil was not at all rational; if he continued working Cobeil over, Cobeil would never make it. I was hopeful that he would believe me about Cobeil.
He accused me of trying to help Cobeil cheat him. The door was closed, locked, and bolted. I started to talk to Cobeil again for a few minutes, when all of a sudden, “Fidel” jumped up in the window, holding the bars, screaming in his loud voice, “I caught you, I caught you cheating me.” Seconds later the door slammed open. “Fidel” screamed to me, get out, get out. A few minutes later “Fidel” returned with what looked like a fan belt of a car, but cut so it was like a whip. As “Fidel” passed by he looked at me with a glaze in his eyes of an enraged madman. “Fidel” went in after Cobeil with Grimsey and Cedric. I could hear the thud of the belt against Cobeil’s body again and again as “Fidel” screamed. I guess Cobeil was hit around 20 or 30 times. It was hard to listen, as I did, to “Fidel” beating Cobeil, a frail, diminutive man, his wrists swollen three times the normal size, a vacant stare in his eyes already pushed by torture beyond the limit for which he might have a chance to regain his sanity. It had been far easier for me to endure the straps than to have to go through this. The guards all stood around talking loudly, laughing and yelling in Vietnamese. When I saw “Fidel” with the fan belt, I was sur-prised, because up to that time I had never heard of anyone getting hit like that. As I stood there with my crutches, my heart and mind overflowed with emotion. It was the most sickening feeling to hear what was going on and know there was nothing I could do about it.
That was the last day I saw Cobeil. “Fidel” unmercifully beat a mentally defenseless, sick man to death. He, as well as the North Vietnamese Communists, must bear full responsibility for that and other acts
The old fool has probably convinced himself that he didn’t allow torture. But then, what we might consider torture, they might consider normal treatment.
"SAYS"? This reporter is a typical European scum-sucker. Let Europe become Eurabia. No tears will be shed on this side of the Atlantic.
Disregard my previous post. I was too kind to this POS UK rag. What a saggy, vomitous set of lies.
Wow, first the MSM go all the way to Vietnam to help John Kerry 4 years ago. Now the BBC talks to someone who should be tried as a war criminal and publish what he says. This just shows that the worldwide MSM will go to ANY length to support Obama.
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