Posted on 06/13/2008 12:09:36 PM PDT by DCRoush
John McCain said Friday that the Supreme Court ruling on Guantanamo Bay detainees is “one of the worst decisions in the history of this country.” The presumptive GOP nominee said the decision, a 5-4 ruling Thursday that determined Guantanamo detainees have the right to seek release in civilian courts, would lead to a wave of frivolous challenges. “We are now going to have the courts flooded with so-called … habeas corpus suits against the government, whether it be about the diet, whether it be about the reading material. And we are going to be bollixed up in a way that is terribly unfortunate because we need to go ahead and adjudicate these cases,” he said at a town hall meeting in New Jersey. McCain said he has worked hard to ensure the U.S. military does not torture prisoners but that the detainees at Guantanamo are still “enemy combatants.” “These are people who are not citizens. They do not and never have been given the rights that citizens in this country have,” he said. “Now, my friends, there are some bad people down there. There are some bad people.” Barack Obama released a statement Thursday saying the Supreme Court decision “ensures that we can protect our nation and bring terrorists to justice while also protecting our core values.” “The Court’s decision is a rejection of the Bush administration’s attempt to create a legal black hole at Guantanamo - yet another failed policy supported by John McCain,” he said. “This is an important step toward re-establishing our credibility as a nation committed to the rule of law and rejecting a false choice between fighting terrorism and respecting habeas corpus.”
(Excerpt) Read more at elections.foxnews.com ...
“Have you verified this statement with ‘a former justice guy’?”
http://www.bakerlaw.com/FindLawyers.aspx?Abs_Ppl_ID=A4F45B59-815B-4A91-9E21-1AE8768A834E
http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110010949
http://www.heritage.org/Research/NationalSecurity/wm1556.cfm
But I find it quite astounding that anybody in the United States does not KNOW that if a person is detained in the United States they have the CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to a Writ of Habeas Corpus. This is absolutely a fundamental right and one of the main reasons for the Revolution. This right is not just to citizens but to anyone on US Territory. A stupid Senate bill can not remove that right. You do not have to be a citizen to get this right.
The Senate bill does set procedures for how to proceed against the terrorists but it does not remove the right to file a Writ if they are in the United States.
“Wonder how this decision will relate to illegal aliens.”
Illegal aliens detained inside the US are entitled to Habeas Corpus now. What this ruling says is that GITMO is de facto US Territory.
“Wonder how this decision will relate to illegal aliens.”
Illegal aliens detained inside the US are entitled to Habeas Corpus now. What this ruling says is that GITMO is de facto US Territory.
“Wonder how this decision will relate to illegal aliens.”
Illegal aliens detained inside the US are entitled to Habeas Corpus now. What this ruling says is that GITMO is de facto US Territory.
Non-sequitur questions are the hobgoblin of small minds.
“Sure S.3903 does attempt give jurisdiction to Military commissions but that does not mean you cannot file for a Writ if you are detained within United States territory. It takes a Constitutional amendment to change the Constitution.”
Now it does, with the recent ruling of SCOTUS. S.3930 classified the terrorists as unlawful combatants, and prohibited them access to the courts. It made no exemptions to those being held within the U.S.
You must have misread this. Rivkin didn’t say I was a fool, he said I was cool.
” It made no exemptions to those being held within the U.S.”
I am beginning to think you are an idiot. S.3930 cannot over turn the US Constitution which gives the right of Habeas Corpus to anyone detained in the United States. You asked for citations and I provided them. But any American should know that any person detained in the United States gets to file the Writ.
I’m going to ask you again: what was the purpose of GITMO? Why hold detainees there instead of Fort Leavenworth before the ruling?
Think about it.
Are you being dense on purpose?
“Non-sequitur questions”
No, Iraq has great importance to our national security. Since the two candidates have completely different plans regarding Iraq, who do you believe has a better plan? McCain, who want to continue the successful Petreaus strategy, or Obama, who want to retreat, leaving Iraq to Iran and al-Qaeda?
The large majority of Guantanamo Bay detainees today are in the same shoes as the German prisoners were 50 years ago. They are being held outside of the United States[18] for acts committed in Afghanistan, the location of most combatants’ capture. As such, the detainees have no right to the extraordinary writ.
“S.3930 cannot over turn the US Constitution which gives the right of Habeas Corpus to anyone detained in the United States.”
Your arguing from a false pretense. This is merely your interpretation of the U.S. Constitution. If true, those German POWs that resided within the U.S. would not have been able to be tried by a military court and hanged. They would have had access to the federal court system.
First of all McCain is entirely untrustworthy on anything and everything. Secondly, neither of them, nor anyone else who occupies the WH, is going to pull out of Iraq. That won’t happen. Thirdly, by the time the next President is sworn in Iraq will largely be a victorious situation, both on the ground and in the press.
“Your arguing from a false pretense. This is merely your interpretation of the U.S. Constitution. If true, those German POWs that resided within the U.S. would not have been able to be tried by a military court and hanged. They would have had access to the federal court system.”
What make you think they did not. Read the Johnson decision. Today it is well established that even illegal immigrants have access to a Writ.
Again why did we have GITMO in the first place.
You McCain fools will be eating sh*t sandwiches soon enough.
One, Obama will clean your man’s clock. Your man will beaten like a rug by a commie. Or if McCain does get elected you will be totally embarrassed by what an inept idiot you elected.
“First of all McCain is entirely untrustworthy on anything and everything.”
Here you’re simply stating your opinion, but you have no facts. This opinion could be said by a thousand Obama supporters a thousand times each, but still would not have any validity.
“Secondly, neither of them, nor anyone else who occupies the WH, is going to pull out of Iraq.”
Your attempt to paint Obama as someone who will suddenly do a 180 degree turn and support of our efforts in Iraq is not backed up by any facts. He has repeatedly voted against funding the troops, sponsored legislation that would have had them withdrawn months ago, and he could easliy veto any funding for the troops if he becomes POTUS. He has repeatedly blamed the violence in Iraq on U.S. troop presense, and has said he will meet with Amanidijad without preconditions. And now you expect conservatives to believe he will suddenly support our strategy in Iraq, if he becomes President?
Not true, as I'm sure you know.
Should I post it in full? And there more from someone else's 2000 collection.
FR links on McCain's record from Feb. 2000. MrChips collection.
I made no such attempt to do that. You are dishonestly mischaracterizing what I did say. But the fact is that he has already begun to make that turn in his rhetoric and I expect he will go further still before Nov. But it doesn't matter what he says his policies are any more than it matters what McCain says. We will not be leaving Iraq. That is what I said. I made no comment as to Obama's ideology or policy statements.
“What make you think they did not.”
Because they did not. They were tried by a military commision and hanged, all within the U.S. (Fort Leavenworth).
“Again why did we have GITMO in the first place.”
Logistics. This base was created in 1898 and used to house Cuban refugees intercepted in international waters. You’ll note that the decision to have the camp declared unconstitutional was vacated in ‘93. Now, I notice you are unwilling to answer my question from post 244. Who do you want to win the general election, Obama or McCain?
“One, Obama will clean your man’s clock. Your man will beaten like a rug by a commie.”
Before you get your hopes up too high, you should realize that Obama is too radical for many even in the Democratic Party. If you noticed the primaries, Hillary was still winning states like Ohio even when the race was declared over. If you look at the exit polls, like in SD, you will see polls showing that a majority of voters believe Obama shares the views of Rev. Wright.
Obsolete polls and out of contexts clips don’t mean anything to me. You go to all that trouble, compiling all of those links, spending all of those hours, criticizing McCain on all of these threads, while simultaneously declare that you don’t care who wins the general election. Do you expect to be taken seriously?
“I made no such attempt to do that.”
Yes you did. You claimed that Obama, despite his record of just the opposite, will ensure that we remain in Iraq. This is a 180 degree turn from his consistant stance of retreat and defeat. He has repeatedly voted against funding the troops, sponsored legislation that would have had them withdrawn months ago, and he could easliy veto any funding for the troops if he becomes POTUS. He has repeatedly blamed the violence in Iraq on U.S. troop presense, and has said he will meet with Amanidijad without preconditions. And now you expect conservatives to believe he will suddenly support our strategy in Iraq, if he becomes President?
“Because they did not. They were tried by a military commision and hanged, all within the U.S. (Fort Leavenworth).”
Not true. All German POWs were not hanged and they had access to federal courts. Any person detained in the United States has right to file a writ of Habeas Corpus. Now it does not have to be granted. But the right to file exists.
“This base was created in 1898 and used to house Cuban refugees intercepted in international waters.”
?? Not it wasn’t. it was a traditional Navy base. I was there in 1967-68.
Re: your other question, I do not have a dog in the hunt.
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