Court: Texas had no right to take polygamists' kids 3 minutes ago

AP via Yahoo ^ | 5/22/08

[ElkGroveDan]

SAN ANGELO, Texas - A state appellate court has ruled that child welfare officials had no right to seize more than 400 children living at a polygamist sect's ranch.

The Third Court of Appeals in Austin ruled that the grounds for removing the children were "legally and factually insufficient" under Texas law. They did not immediately order the return of the children.

Child welfare officials removed the children on the grounds that the sect pushed underage girls into marriage and sex and trained boys to become future perpetrators.

The appellate court ruled the chaotic hearing held last month did not demonstrate the children were in any immediate danger, the only measure of taking children from their homes without court proceedings.

[JLS]

One of them 27, wow.

[commonguymd]

What was it exactly that the Texas Rangers reported again?

[mad_as_he$$]

While I am not wildly enthused about the FLDS the “CPS” part of most State governments need a serious slap down and reality check. I hope the Texas CPS ultimately gets theirs.

[Between the Lines]

Their vile replies to anyone who questioned ANYTHING CPS did was among the worst displays I've ever seen here. It quickly became easier to just ignore the FLDS threads than to put up with their abuse.

What amazes me about these FReeper thugs is how very successful they were in squelching any opposing opinion. They literally bullied everyone not in agreement with themselves. And sadly most of us found it easier to let them have the FLDS threads rather than to fight them.

[dsutah]

Ok, I guess they’ll just have to send them all back in there, only to get ‘married’ off to those old men, impregnated, and kept like cattle! How’s that sound? But hey, they’ll be free from gov. influence!

They may never get out again, but hey, what do you care?

[LeGrande]

Ummmm..a 14-year old just gave birth to a child and is scared to name the father.

Repeating a lie doesn't make it the truth. It just makes you a liar.

[Purrcival]

The appellate judge ruled on information it didn’t even have in front of it because of the ongoing investigation.

Ah, OK. I think I understand now. I sort of wonder why the judge isn't allowed to see what they have compiled so far, but then...it's always possible that new evidence could push the investigation in a different direction. Maybe that's why?

[El Gato]

What if this wasn't a 'religious' compound, what if it was just some creep who lives down the street? Would we be so concerned about his right(sic) to marry a 14 year old then?

Religious compound has nothing to with the requirements of the law. If the creep down the street was involved, then it would an an individual action, the state would still need to provide evidence that that particular 14 y/o was in imminent danger. But the state could not lawfully take the children of the creep's sister or mother who happened to live next door, unless they had evidence that those children were also in imminent danger.

[Oztrich Boy]

I never saw this coming

[commonguymd]

They got it today and it only gets worse from there. The sad part is, remove the antimormon zealots, the government can do no wrong crowd, and the rabid emotional dingdongs and you find out that CPS was so wrong in actually trying to tackle these folks that a great opportunity was missed. There was opportunity to find wrongdoers and bring them to justice, but now the wrongdoers have opportunity for richness.

[commonguymd]

Amen there. I got sick of being called this that and the other thing because I saw some serious problems with this wholesale operation.

[commonguymd]

They just keep digging to find something and so far they look rather inept.

[El Gato]

If you don’t do it right, you stand to jeopardize the whole case. And here we are.

Exactly, but the state probably can still make a case against any actual criminal activity, and after the proper legal proceedings, take away those young girls actually in danger, *if* they can be separately identified.

But it's not going to easy, especially if the evidence seized in the initial raid, and subsequent raids justified on the basis of evidence from the first, is ruled "fruit of the poisoned vine", which seems highly likely.

[TCats]

I was attacked by a number of ‘Thugs’ as you call them for simply questioning the State's right to take the actions they did. See my post #553.

It looked to me like it was a serious display of closed minds by a lot of FReepers, a real surprise to me.

[patton]

“Now, think the CPS will apologize for harming the reputation of a 14-year-old-girl by falsely claiming that she had sex and was pregnant?”

I rather doubt it.

The problem with TRUE BELIEVERS is that they can justify any wrong act, in that it furthered some perceived common goal.

My tagline is from an essay by CS Lewis on exactly that - “The experts are to be believed.” He was being sarcastic, of course. And he pretty much nailed this situation.

[Oztrich Boy]

A court read the Texas Ranger's affidavit and, based on that evidence, acted

The judge signed the warrant 3 minutes after the TR signed the affidavit.

Speed reader, or just approves of fishing expeditions?

[El Gato]

Do we or do we not have laws against underage marriage to multiple husbands in Texas?

We do, but they must be applied within the limits imposed by the Constitutions of the United States and Texas.

If we do, the state had every right to remove those kids from their stepford moms forever.

Only by acting within the law, not outside of it, and after due process is applied.

[commonguymd]

Rather frightening that people on a conservative website would throw full support and guns to a social government bureaucracy that needs to perpetuate its existence, and an agency not held to the same standards of proof that the criminal courts are held to. Hitler used the civil courts to start his project by using them to forbid Jews from using the swimming and bathing facilities. From there it was all down hill. Luckily this court beat back a rogue judge.

[RightWhale]

Michael Savage is on the job. Maybe the only one on this issue.

[commonguymd]

Sad part is that many of them seem to actually want the allegations and falsehoods to be true for some sick, twisted, demented reason. They keep repeating lies to force others to believe them and forgo any sense of due process in the meantime.