"Dude’s got my hairdo! But man, what a powerful face!"
Reminds me a little of Steve.
,p>
Posted on 05/13/2008 6:41:24 PM PDT by NormsRevenge
PARIS - Divers trained in archaeology discovered a marble bust of an aging Caesar in the Rhone River that France's Culture Ministry said Tuesday could be the oldest known.
The life-sized bust showing the Roman ruler with wrinkles and hollows in his face is tentatively dated to 46 B.C. Divers uncovered the Caesar bust and a collection of other finds in the Rhone near the town of Arles — founded by Caesar.
Among other items in the treasure trove of ancient objects is a 5.9 foot marble statue of Neptune, dated to the first decade of the third century after Christ.
Two smaller statues, both in bronze and measuring 27.5 inches each also were found, one of them, a satyr with his hands tied behind his back, "doubtless" originated in Hellenic Greece, the ministry said.
"Some (of the discoveries) are unique in Europe," Culture Minister Christine Albanel said. The bust of Caesar is in a class by itself.
"This marble bust of the founder of the Roman city of Arles constitutes the most ancient representation known today of Caesar," the ministry statement said, adding that it "undoubtedly" dates to the creation of Arles in 46 B.C.
Among other things, researchers are trying to uncover "in what context these statues were thrown into the river," said Michel L'Hour, who heads the Department of Subaquatic Archaeological Research, whose divers made the discovery between September and October 2007.
The site "has barely been skimmed," L'Hour told The Associated Press, adding that a new search operation will begin this summer.
He said the Arles region, in the Provence region of southern France, with its Roman beginnings, and the Rhone are "propitious" for discoveries.
Albanel called the find "exceptional" and said that the Caesar bust is "the oldest representation known today" of the emperor.
Divers also found a huge marble statue of Neptune, dated from the third century.
On the Vanity of Earthly Greatness
The tusks which clashed in mighty brawls
Of mastodons, are billiard balls.
The sword of Charlemagne the Just
Is Ferric Oxide, known as rust.
The grizzly bear, whose potent hug,
Was feared by all, is now a rug.
Great Caesar’s bust is on the shelf,
And I don’t feel so well myself.
— Arthur Guiterman
Damn! That’s what I get for not reading the whole thread first....
Wouldn’t it be more likely for a break on a larger work to occur higher up, where the neck is thinnest?
Recently I’ve been reading Colleen McCullough’s series of novels on ancient Rome. From them I have learned that what we would consider a Roman’s last name, his cognomen, usually described some physical or family aspect of the man. For instance, Caeser’s full name was Gaius Julius Ceasar. Gaius was his first name, Julius was his family name. The cognomen Caeser means “a fine head of hair.”
Other cognomens would refer to whether the individual had red hair (Rufius), was crossed eyed (Strabo), etc.
I've read her Rome series also and enjoyed them very much. Books like that make me want to dig into non-fiction after I've finished to see how much was, or could have been, accurate.
What a striking likeness. No one did it better than my Romans.
I was surprised to read about the “claw” in the hair. I see it in this bust of Augustus, but not in Caesar’s (who had male pattern baldness, as we can see).
A lot of scholars see similarities between Alexandrine iconography and contemporaneous depictions of the Buddha (the top knot in the hair being a prominent feature). It’s easy to argue the existence of cross-fertilisation between the Hellenistic world and the Indus valley.
Thanks for the ping, old friend. Best wishes.
Usually my sympathy is with those who seek to maintain a Republic than with those who wish to overthrow it with absolute one man rule.
Thanks for the ping. Very interesting!
-PJ
"Dude’s got my hairdo! But man, what a powerful face!"
Reminds me a little of Steve.
,p>
The Senators were not elected — therefore there was no Roman Republic to overthrow. The “Roman Republic” was just a fascist oligarchy. Caesar was viewed as a threat to the corrupt senators’ financial interests, and that’s all that was going on.
Caesar was a threat to the Senates financial interests, just as the Senate was a threat to Caesar’s financial interests. Calling either of them corrupt would be accurate, referring to only one party as corrupt would be revisionist.
My sympathy is for a Representative form of government. The Senate was far more Representative than Caesar. The precedent that Caesar set led to Czars, Kaisers and Kings claiming absolute one man rule for the next thousand years. Good thing our founders were more inspired by the ideals of a Republic than those of a Tyrant.
So to be a Senator one had to win at least one elected office (Questor at least), and be appointed by another elected official (a Consul).
Much like the Original U.S. Senate the Roman Senate was not directly elected. They were a body of 600 magistrates or ex-magistrates elected minimally to the office of Questor and appointed by the Consul to the Senate for life when there was a vacancy. So to be a Senator one had to win at least one elected office (Questor at least), and be appointed by another elected official (a Consul).The Roman Senate was made up of appointees and volunteers from old families, all of whom nonetheless were subject to the Senate's own pecking order, along with former higher officials such as ex-Consuls. Senators mostly remained there for the rest of their lives, with no fixed term, and no standing for reelection, not even accountable to those responsible for their senatorial status.
Our framers realized that there was a need for separation of powers; they took their cues from the Roman imperial period, during which time Rome was just as much a republic as before, if not moreso.
Like when Nero’s horse was appointed a Senator?
It was Caligula, and it was just a little joke he made before his mind went kablooey. :’)
I don’t think it particularly look like Julius Caesar. Why do they think it’s him? It could be any of 1000 others.
Yes, under the emperors the Senate was a joke (as witnessed by Caligula's horse being made a Senator). And even the office of the Emperor was for sale to the Praetorian guard. There was no “balance of powers”, there was only the absolute power of the Emperor, and the power of the Praetorian Guard to determine who would be Emperor.
And under an imperial system you also get effeminate “artists” like Nero, and vain madmen like Caligula. Neither of these two would ever have been elected Consul, and would most certainly not have been reelected.
The funniest thing I find about Roman history is how much the term “Dictator” has become a pejorative. The original concept was quite benign, and far better than any King. The Dictator was elected, and had absolute power only for a year or until the crisis was past. Cincinnatus was the ideal dictator, and the inspiration for the American city that bears his name and an association of the founders that gathered under the banner of his name.
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