Posted on 04/15/2008 10:27:22 AM PDT by Snickering Hound
ELDORADO — Mothers separated from their children as part of a wide-ranging abuse investigation within a polygamist retreat accuse state officials of misleading them before taking their offspring into custody.
Authorities raided the sect's ranch more than a week ago in response to allegations that underage girls were forced to marry older men. Women and children from the secretive community were taken to a West Texas fort-turned-museum and a rodeo pavilion, but on Monday officials began separating women and some of their offspring without warning, members of the sect said.
While some women and children were taken from the shelters to the nearby San Angelo Coliseum, other women were allowed to return to the ranch — but only those who were childless or had children under the age of 5.
About three dozen of the women who returned to the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints ranch spoke out Monday, after 11 days in temporary shelters. They said in interviews that police surrounded them Monday and gave them a choice between returning home, or relocating to a women's shelter.
"It just feels like someone is trying to hurt us," said Paula, 38, who like other members of the sect declined to give her full name. "I do not understand how they can do this when they don't have a for sure knowledge that anyone has abused these children."
Marissa Gonzales, a spokeswoman for the Department of Family and Protective Services, said the move was a typical procedure taken by the agency.
"It is not the normal practice to allow parents to accompany the child when an abuse allegation is made," Gonzales said.
Brenda, a 37-year-old mother of two teenage boys, said the women were threatened with arrest if they resisted the court order. Previously, the women had been told they would stay with the children at least until Thursday, when a custody hearing is scheduled, she said.
A call to CPS for comment late Monday on the women's claims was not immediately returned.
CPS's closing of the shelters came a day after three mothers from the ranch petitioned Gov. Rick Perry to inspect the shelters to see firsthand how families were being treated. The women said the living conditions were cramped and that some of the children had become sick.
About 20 children were recovering from a mild case of chicken pox, said Dr. Sandra Guerra-Cantu with the state Health Department.
Perry spokesman Robert Black said the governor did not believe the children were being housed in poor conditions at the West Texas fort.
"Let's be honest here, this is not the Ritz," Black said. But he called the accommodations "clean and neat."
CPS said officials have been planning the move for a week but that the coliseum was unavailable earlier. About two dozen teenage boys were moved to a facility outside San Angelo with the judge's permission, CPS said. The location was not released.
The state is accusing the sect of physically and sexually abusing the youngsters and wants to strip their parents of custody and place the children in foster care or put them up for adoption. The sheer size of the case was an obstacle.
"Quite frankly, I'm not sure what we're going to do," state District Judge Barbara Walther said after a conference that included three to four dozen attorneys either representing or hoping to represent youngsters.
Brenda and others were critical of CPS, saying the agency misled them as to what was to happen Monday, weren't told why the children were removed from the compound and given inaccurate messages about opportunities to meet attorneys.
"We got to where we said, 'We cannot believe a word you say. We cannot trust you,'" she said.
Officials said the investigation began with a call from a young girl who has yet to be located by CPS. The women in the sect said they suspect she may be a bitter ex-member of the church.
The FLDS practice polygamy in arranged marriages, sometimes between underage girls and older men. The group has thousands of followers in two side-by-side towns in Arizona and Utah.
The church has repeatedly fought because of its lifestyle before. Men, women and children have been swept up in raids that took place in 1935, 1944 and 1953.
"It's been all through history, " said Brenda, the mother of two. "We were just here trying to live a peaceful, happy, sweet life. We don't understand why we can't do this freely."
It’s only hard to understand if you want it to be, which you clearly do.
We don’t agree with what the FLDS are doing. But that doesn’t mean that it was right to grab hundreds of kids and tear apart these families, based on a phony warrant.
AHHH!!! So not EVERYONE is commanded to commit polygamy??
Just some? So who gets to decide?
Wonder who chose the FLDS?? Which state turns a blind eye to polygamy? Wonder why that is? hmmmmm? lol!
Even if the mothers aren’t really their mothers (as in the children were taken from another mother and assigned to them) which is SOP in this sect.
Yeah, that gets me, too! LOL
“Well, yeah, they did lots of stuff in biblical times (like live offerings on the altar) that we don’t do now.”
The Hell we don’t!! Want to see the dem’s I have buried under my house?
So much of the crap on this thread is just that — crap. It’s impossible to respond to it all.
Utah does not turn a blind eye to polygamy. They have prosecuted members of one clan for various abuse charges. One of the reasons the FLDS went to Texas is because Utah was cracking down in various ways. But Utah won’t do mass raids, tearing up families like Texas is doing.
What Utah has done is prosecute the leader of the FLDS as an accomplice to rape, for sanctioning and performing a plural marriage of an underage girl to a 19 year old boy.
In addition, the state of Utah has placed a lot of their real property in a trusteeship, taking ownership away from the FLDS church.
Again, you have no idea what you are talking about, you just say whatever anti-Mormon garbage pops into your mind.
“the children were taken from another mother and assigned to them) which is SOP in this sect.”
How do you know this?? Were you a member once? Perhaps you’re a private investigator and have studied this cult extensively??
Just because you can't SEE the contradictions between the indoctrination fog in your brain doesn't mean it isn't there. It is clearly there whether you're able to see it or not!
No one is commanded to practice polygamy - you are commanded to practice monogamy. What isn't logical or scriptural is your refusal to recognize this clear command in Deut. 17:17 "Neither shall he multiply wives to himself..." That is a direct command the same as Thou shalt NOT.....
The bigger q you need to address is if you believe in it so much why aren't YOU practicing it and sharing your husband with other women???? And don't give me its not legal BS....it has never been legal and it didn't stop Smith, or Young or anyone else in the late 19th century or today in the FLDS for that matter.
Yep. Backed into that darn corner again!
And, hey, I watch BIG LOVE so I know ALL about “The Principle”! heh heh! :)
That you Jeff? ;)
You're hearing crickets because this is not about the Branch Dividians. It's about the FLDS children.
I guess they figure they'll confuse us and we won't notice!
I think it's shameful when people start assuming the worst about people based on rumours.
The biggest issue with polygamy is it goes against natural biology. Where the birth rate of both genders is equal. Even gay marriage evens out between the gays and lesbains (I’m not supporting it, just saying that at the end of the day, it appears that no one is left out in the rain without a date)
But polygamy is based on well,
in this particular group you had about 25 men averaging about 5 or so ‘wives’ each to = 139 wives.
That means, that 114 men/boys had to be removed from the group to give these men their excess spouses.
No one mentions that aspect. That it goes against balance AND it means for every 1 man having a marriage, about 5 won’t.
Now THAT goes against everything from the beginning of time.
Case histories likely show that young children are intimidated and afraid to tell the truth if either parent is present. These kids have been brainwashed from birth. They at least deserve the chance to be able to talk freely if they have been abused.
Do you think they’re just OK folks and everything they were doing (including massive welfare fraud) was just hunky dory-— and let me guess, you think polygamy is just fine and a 14 year old can be a real wife.
Do you?
Yes,
it’s called the “Revenge for Waco” scenario.
Oy.
You’re in no position to accuse anyone else of being in a fog. The passage from Deuteronomy is not a commandment to monogamy. Read it in context. It also commands the king not to “multiply horses.” Does that mean that he could only own one horse, or does it mean that he shouldn’t go overboard, having hundreds of horses, or hundreds of wives.
Go back and read my first post on this thread. (page 1)
oh
no
;)
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