Posted on 04/15/2008 10:27:22 AM PDT by Snickering Hound
ELDORADO — Mothers separated from their children as part of a wide-ranging abuse investigation within a polygamist retreat accuse state officials of misleading them before taking their offspring into custody.
Authorities raided the sect's ranch more than a week ago in response to allegations that underage girls were forced to marry older men. Women and children from the secretive community were taken to a West Texas fort-turned-museum and a rodeo pavilion, but on Monday officials began separating women and some of their offspring without warning, members of the sect said.
While some women and children were taken from the shelters to the nearby San Angelo Coliseum, other women were allowed to return to the ranch — but only those who were childless or had children under the age of 5.
About three dozen of the women who returned to the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints ranch spoke out Monday, after 11 days in temporary shelters. They said in interviews that police surrounded them Monday and gave them a choice between returning home, or relocating to a women's shelter.
"It just feels like someone is trying to hurt us," said Paula, 38, who like other members of the sect declined to give her full name. "I do not understand how they can do this when they don't have a for sure knowledge that anyone has abused these children."
Marissa Gonzales, a spokeswoman for the Department of Family and Protective Services, said the move was a typical procedure taken by the agency.
"It is not the normal practice to allow parents to accompany the child when an abuse allegation is made," Gonzales said.
Brenda, a 37-year-old mother of two teenage boys, said the women were threatened with arrest if they resisted the court order. Previously, the women had been told they would stay with the children at least until Thursday, when a custody hearing is scheduled, she said.
A call to CPS for comment late Monday on the women's claims was not immediately returned.
CPS's closing of the shelters came a day after three mothers from the ranch petitioned Gov. Rick Perry to inspect the shelters to see firsthand how families were being treated. The women said the living conditions were cramped and that some of the children had become sick.
About 20 children were recovering from a mild case of chicken pox, said Dr. Sandra Guerra-Cantu with the state Health Department.
Perry spokesman Robert Black said the governor did not believe the children were being housed in poor conditions at the West Texas fort.
"Let's be honest here, this is not the Ritz," Black said. But he called the accommodations "clean and neat."
CPS said officials have been planning the move for a week but that the coliseum was unavailable earlier. About two dozen teenage boys were moved to a facility outside San Angelo with the judge's permission, CPS said. The location was not released.
The state is accusing the sect of physically and sexually abusing the youngsters and wants to strip their parents of custody and place the children in foster care or put them up for adoption. The sheer size of the case was an obstacle.
"Quite frankly, I'm not sure what we're going to do," state District Judge Barbara Walther said after a conference that included three to four dozen attorneys either representing or hoping to represent youngsters.
Brenda and others were critical of CPS, saying the agency misled them as to what was to happen Monday, weren't told why the children were removed from the compound and given inaccurate messages about opportunities to meet attorneys.
"We got to where we said, 'We cannot believe a word you say. We cannot trust you,'" she said.
Officials said the investigation began with a call from a young girl who has yet to be located by CPS. The women in the sect said they suspect she may be a bitter ex-member of the church.
The FLDS practice polygamy in arranged marriages, sometimes between underage girls and older men. The group has thousands of followers in two side-by-side towns in Arizona and Utah.
The church has repeatedly fought because of its lifestyle before. Men, women and children have been swept up in raids that took place in 1935, 1944 and 1953.
"It's been all through history, " said Brenda, the mother of two. "We were just here trying to live a peaceful, happy, sweet life. We don't understand why we can't do this freely."
There are supposed to be legal procedures, yes.
But be prepared to be called a child raping enabler if you dare to bring it up.
You can’t be serious.
My family (every one of them) has been LDS Mormon since its inception.
My dad delivered heating oil to one of the polygamists compounds in Garfield County, in Southern Utah. The leader was Newell Steed. Newell was my dad’s friend and the brother-in-law of my Mother’s husband. I went with him often. He warned me that the group might want me as a wife....and I knew enough to stay away from them.
I’ve been inside polygamist compounds. I’ve attended LDS Church with polygamists. Their sons have been members of my LDS Branch and have blessed and passed the sacrament.
My husband employeed two sons of Newell Steed during his Govenment Contracting job in Bryce Canyon National Park. They were LDS members and had married their (first) wives in the St. George LDS Temple. They planned on subsequent wives when the time was right, but know they wouldn’t be allowed to be sealed in the LDS Temple. They believed their “Prophet” held the keys that enabled the eternal sealing ceremony.
Perhaps it is you who should contact the fLDS Church and find out if they consider themselves Mormon or not.
No we don’t condemn Joseph. It is in the nature of a prophet that relevation is ongoing. That is why we no longer keep kosher or practice animal sacrifice. In 1891, the then-prophet put an end to the practice.
I don’t think that polygamy is inherently sinful. If it is practiced when God says not to, it is sinful. But, it was obviously practiced by prophets in the Old Testament.
Bing,
This Freeper 3niner, thinks she is teaching us a thing or two about polygamy. How much more obnoxious can you get?
The only difference between this and Branch D is the government changed the motive for entry from guns and weapons to the safety of the children. Now all they need is the evidence.
polygamy is illegal. HOWEVER............
lol
Amen
Re the phony search warrant. It was based on a phone call by a girl they have yet to identify. She identified a man as her abuser/husband in Texas who, after investigation and corroboration by numerous people including a probation officer, hasn’t left the state of Arizona in at least five years. That man’s lawyer was on Fox last night. He says the Texas authorities knew that the man for whom the warrant was issued was the wrong man before they ever executed the warrant.
Furthermore, they have taken all the girls into custody, but they can’t find any to match the girl who supposedly made the call. And that shouldn’t be hard to do, because the caller gave details that would be verifiable if they were real.
I also heard on local radio yesterday that Arizona authorities got an almost identical call and complaint at about the same time, but didn’t act on it because none of it could be corroborated to the slightest degree.
As of this moment, there appears to be no evidence that the caller was real. It seems to me that if the Texas authorities had found any evidence to back up the lurid, hearsay accusations they have released in their probable cause statement, they would have released such evidence by now, just to cover their fannies.
He didn’t put an end to it. He didn’t ABOLISH polygamy. He gave some “ADVICE”:
Wilford Woodruff, initially supported the continued practice of polygamy; however, as pressure increased, he began to change the church’s policy. On 26 September 1890 he issued a press release, the Manifesto, which read, “I publicly declare that my advice to the Latter-day Saints is to refrain from contracting any marriages forbidden by the law of the land.”
Sanctioned by the church eh? You need to re-read the BOM. Jacob 2:23-24 - "But the word of God burdens me because of your grosser crimes. For behold, thus saith the Lord: This people begin to wax in iniquity; they understand not the scriptures, for they seek to excuse themselves in committing whoredoms, because of the things which were written concerning David, and Solomon his son. Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord."
The first edition of the Doctrine and Covenants, printed in 1835, also denounced the practice: "Inasmuch as this church of Christ has been reproached with the crime of fornication, and polygamy: we declare that we believe, that one man should have one wife, and one woman, but one husband, except in the case of death, when either is at liberty to marry again." (Doctrine and Covenants, section 101, verse 4) This denial of polygamy, was printed in every edition of the Doctrine and Covenants until the year 1876. At that time the Mormon leaders inserted section 132, which permits a plurality of wives. When a 'prophet' is caught in an adulterous affair how convenient, he suddenly gets a new 'revelation' allowing polygamy. Nice.
Now you want to provide ONE Scriptural passage from the Bible where God Himself COMMANDED polygamy?????? Specific Chapter and verse. Then when you've done that please provide SPECIFIC Chapter and verse where God ever told Abraham, or Jacob, or Moses, or whomever that polygamy was REQUIRED for salvation as Brigham Young preached in 1866: "The only men who become Gods, even the Sons of God, are those who enter into polygamy" (Journal of Discourses, vol. 11, p. 269).
In the meantime, we Texas taxpayers are paying $25,000./day to care for these children!!!
The Pope today is admitting shame for the Priest abuse of children. Since they have tons of evidence I have have not heard of a raid. —crickets—
I’ve also said that Texas knew that the warrant was suspect and probably phony before they executed it. The supposed abuser had not ever been in Texas.
Arizona did the right thing. They investigated the allegations, could find no corroboration, so didn’t act.
It would have been one thing if Texas had received the allegations and acted negligently, without investigating. That would have been bad enough.
But, Texas did investigate and found — not just a lack of corroboration of any of the allegations — but facts completely contradicting the allegations and showing that they were not true and executed anyway. That’s terrible.
So!!! Who cares about the money. If the children are being abused they have the right and the voters backing to stop it no matter what the cost.
Right on! Well, you are seeing a whole lot of choices for you to put on your home page, if that's any consolation.
Jacob also said that when polygamy was commanded by the Lord, to raise up children, it was okay. Jacob 2:30. I’m sure that whoever taught your anti-Mormon seminary left out that part of the scripture.
Again, it is not me, but the “Bible only” people who are hollering that polygamy is sinful. I’ve asked them to provide me one Biblical scripture that says so. There is none. It is all interpretation. Nor is there a place in the Bible where polygamy is commanded. So what? I never said there was.
Something has clearly changed in America. Since when do the police, acting on a virtually anonymous tip (that has yet to be verified), raid and dismantle an entire community, steal their children, steal their computers, steal their books, papers and diaries and virtually imprison them in ‘state care?’
Just like another “prophet” I'm aware of. That's the main reason the koran is so chaotic; allah keeps changing his mind about things based on what mohammed wanted!
Which Catholic priests currently have legal custody of children?
Are you aware of any Catholic facilities where hundreds of children are kept cut off from the outside world?
Please describe and/or post links to these raidable sites.
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