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Vanity: Oh, No! Obama Pastor Says Something Which Makes Sense!!
March 17, 2008 | John Lofton, Recovering Republican

Posted on 03/17/2008 7:54:33 PM PDT by NotChosenName

It was a horrible, shocking, unnerving experience. Reading some of the things Barack Obama's pastor has said, I suddenly saw something with which I completely agree!! He said five days after 9/11: "We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye...." His point: Chickens were coming home to roost. I agree. We certainly committed terrorism and murder when we dropped two atomic bombs on open cities in Japan. And, as Ron Paul has said, correctly, re: 9/11: The terrorists were over here because, first, we were over there in their part of the world sticking our nose into fights none of our business. Finally, none other than God Himself tells us in Galatians 6:7: "Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap."

JLof@aol.com


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: adiosmofo; barackobama; jeremiahwright; johnlofton; kittenchow; nobama; obama; obamanation; obamarama; obomber; paulistinians; ronpaulisanut; vikingkittens; zottusmaximus
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To: Mygirlsmom

From my reading, only a very few agonized over it. One who did was Robert Wilson, founder of Fermilab and member of the Manhattan Project. Another one was some Lieutenant I read of who was on the Hiroshima assessment team. He was rocked by what he saw and wrote that no one who had seen what he had seen would consider doing it again. There were other military intellectual types who frankly admitted it was morally unjustifiable, but did not shrink from it nevertheless. The War transcended morality.

My impression is that Truman himself was actually a rather bloodthirsty sort of fellow when it came to this sort of thing. He made a strange statement in his announcement speech of the bombing, “The world will note that the first atomic bomb was dropped on Hiroshima, a military base.” This was obviously intended as moral justification, but it fulfills that function only in the most formal sense. The real moral adjustment was the acceptance of “Total War”. I think most accepted it as a fact, but there were still all these treaties and what not.

I think the American population in general did not concern themselves at all over Japanese losses, and felt elation and excitement that the war was ended by such a triumphant and stupendous technological achievement.

I also think that criticism of “the decision” decades later is absurd and unrealistic, even childish. The War had its own logic and necessities, and no one was master over it. It was all a question of duty at every level.

The idea that Arab terrorists are inspired or justified by our use of the atomic bomb is pure rhetoric. I mentioned in another thread that Seymour Hersh made this assertion on 9/12, saying as I recall, “Well, they saw us using the atomic bomb ...” like we were supposed to think, “Oh gosh, yeah, well lets just call it even then.” What occurred to me was, “You just equated 9/11 to a nuclear attack. Why then, shouldn’t we respond in kind?”


41 posted on 03/17/2008 9:44:17 PM PDT by dr_lew
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To: NotChosenName

I'm Irish, so I guess I get the privilege to say this today. Hey, John, kiss my royal Irish ass.

42 posted on 03/17/2008 9:49:43 PM PDT by doug from upland (Stopping Hillary should be a FreeRepublic Manhattan Project)
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To: NotChosenName

Tens of millions of Americans and JAPANESE are alive today because we dropped those bombs. They are the sons and daughters, grandsons and grandaughters, and great-grandchildren of the millions of Americans and Japanese (especially Japanese civilians who were to be armed with bamboo staves and drafted into suicide attacks) that would have been killed in an invasion of Japan that would have happened otherwise. I’m possibly one, although my dad was serving as a meteorologist for the USAAF in Italy at the time. A lot of non-infantry would have been converted to footsoldiers to meet the demand that an invasion would have required. Indeed, my dad’s unit was awaiting orders for transfer to the Pacific Theater when they heard about the bombs.

In any case, no such benefit to humanity can be pointed to as a result of the random murder of 3,000 civilians on 9/11.


43 posted on 03/17/2008 9:50:19 PM PDT by Hugin (Mecca delenda est!)
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To: NotChosenName

IBTZ


44 posted on 03/17/2008 9:50:30 PM PDT by TheRealDBear
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To: the invisib1e hand

I don’t know if he know how to read or he would know we killed more Japanese before the nukes with the fire bombing.
We won the war and Japan is still an ally.


45 posted on 03/17/2008 9:51:19 PM PDT by Big Horn (Life is a sexually transmitted disease that is 100% fatal . Author unknown)
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To: Mygirlsmom

Of course it did. Truman knew that many civilians would die. No decision like that is ever easy for those on our side who value life. For the Nazis, Fascists, imperial Japenese, and now the Islamofascists, I submit that the decision would be easy. We beat people in wars, help rebuild their country, and hope we can ultimately develop trading partners and friends. That is what my country does, and I am proud to be an American.


46 posted on 03/17/2008 9:53:11 PM PDT by doug from upland (Stopping Hillary should be a FreeRepublic Manhattan Project)
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To: NotChosenName

Lofton, you’re a buffoon.


47 posted on 03/17/2008 10:04:01 PM PDT by macamadamia ("The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity." Yeats)
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To: RoadGumby

Actually the atomic bomb saved japan. If the war continued uncle hjoe would have partitioned japan and we would have even more of a mess. That is one reason truman dropped the bomb.


48 posted on 03/17/2008 10:08:57 PM PDT by genghis
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To: A_perfect_lady

Did you hear about the guy who was half black and half Japanese?
Every December 7th he would attack Pearl Bailey.


49 posted on 03/17/2008 10:14:33 PM PDT by gigster
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To: NotChosenName
We certainly committed terrorism and murder when we dropped two atomic bombs on open cities in Japan.

Get your facts straight. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were not "open cities". Japan never ceded any city to invasion on the main islands.

Japan did not recognize the open city idea, as can be seen with Manila and several Chinese cities that the Japs destroyed even though they were declared open.

50 posted on 03/17/2008 10:14:35 PM PDT by Between the Lines (I am very cognizant of my fallibility, sinfulness, and other limitations.)
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To: NotChosenName

Japan attacked us without warning.
We went to war and warned them to cease or we would drop that bomb.
We rather than lose a hundred thousand American troops dropped bomb number one.
We then said that they should surrender or we drop bomb number two.
They did NOT surrender and we had to drop number two.

They surrendered, we spent 50 years in Japan turning them around and now they are our friends.


51 posted on 03/17/2008 10:19:46 PM PDT by A CA Guy ( God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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To: NotChosenName

What is this ignorant rot doing here?


52 posted on 03/17/2008 10:21:02 PM PDT by maine-iac7 (",,,but you can't fool all of the people all the time" LINCOLN)
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To: NotChosenName

Just a small tangential clue. When two countries are at war, their battles and attacks on each other are not called terrorism. In fact it is the classic example of when it’s not.


53 posted on 03/17/2008 10:23:12 PM PDT by purpleraine
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To: NotChosenName

We certainly committed terrorism and murder when we dropped two atomic bombs on open cities in Japan


Excuse me but didn’t they attack first? I guess they are the ones who reaped what they sowed. You can call it terrorism and murder if you like but it certainly saved thousands of american lives, besides we’re talking about spilt milk here.


54 posted on 03/17/2008 10:34:08 PM PDT by garylmoore (Faith is the assurance of things unseen.)
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To: NotChosenName

“John Lofton, Recovering Republican”

Barack - is that you playing tricks again?


55 posted on 03/17/2008 10:39:16 PM PDT by Iron Munro (Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself.)
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To: rmlew

>>Has it occurred to him just how many Japanese would have died in an invasion of Japan? Extrapolating from the invasion of Okinawa we are looking at 400,000 American Dead and 5 to 10 million dead Japanese, depending on the number of civilaisn involved in suicidal attacks and suicide to flee the Americans. The 210,000 Japanese killed in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, though sad saved millions of people and the destruction of Japan.<<

Quite right. The bombings, tragic as they were, saved Japanese lives, and indeed, probably the Japanese culture. The Russians were more than ready to invade Japan. It would be likely that not only would Truman be tempted to OK Russian “help” to save US lives, but also the Russians might not ask his permission. A Russian occupation would kill millions more Japanese.


56 posted on 03/17/2008 10:45:53 PM PDT by ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas (I want to "Buy American" but the only things for sale made in the USA are politicians)
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To: genghis

>>Actually the atomic bomb saved japan. If the war continued uncle hjoe would have partitioned japan and we would have even more of a mess. That is one reason truman dropped the bomb.<<

See #56.


57 posted on 03/17/2008 10:48:45 PM PDT by ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas (I want to "Buy American" but the only things for sale made in the USA are politicians)
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To: doug from upland

What was that about between Zappa and Lofton?


58 posted on 03/17/2008 10:50:07 PM PDT by RussP
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To: RussP

They were on Crossfire in 1986 debating dirty lyrics. The video is somewhere. I thought it was on YouTube, but that one was pulled. Someone probably has it handy.


59 posted on 03/17/2008 10:58:08 PM PDT by doug from upland (Stopping Hillary should be a FreeRepublic Manhattan Project)
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To: NotChosenName
Who is John Lofton, and why does he appear on your about page?

Oh, I found this: "My name is John Lofton. I am a recovering Republican. And I would ask you to be gentle with me because I have a lot from which to recover -- "

Are you recovered yet? Is that why you haven't responded to anyone?

IBTZ.

60 posted on 03/17/2008 10:58:55 PM PDT by Theresawithanh (McCain in 2008. Because our liberal is still better than both of theirs.)
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