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Commentary: Doing away with the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) (Replacing With The Fair Tax)
helium.com ^ | Ken Hoagland

Posted on 02/01/2008 12:06:25 PM PST by Man50D

There has been much misunderstanding-deliberately promoted by income tax system defenders recently-about the effects of the FairTax on different income segments of the taxpaying public. Let's clear the air a bit.

The greatest benefits of tax reductions under the FairTax, according to respected economists, accrue to low income taxpayers (an average 14% reduction) then to the middle class taxpayers(an average 7% reduction) and then even to the wealthy (an average 5% reduction).

How can this be and still raise enough revenues to replace all taxes now collected under the income tax system? It's because the taxpayers base is dramatically broadened under a consumption tax by bringing in illegal immigrants, as consumers, and the $1.5 trillion annual underground economy. In addition, the very wealthy pay the full 23% rate on spending, which is an increase over the typical 15% capital gains tax now paid on dividends and stock gains when redeemed (Warren Buffet's recent complaint). In a nutshell, the more you spend under the FairTax, the more taxes you pay. Remember, too, that all the gimmicks that those with tax lobbyists and tax lawyers are able to exploit in the current 67,500 pages of income tax regulations also disappear (along with the role of tax lobbyists as there are no exemptions, loopholes or deductions).

The President's Advisory Panel on Tax Reform declared that taxes would go up on the middle class under a consumption tax when they ignored the definitions in the actual pending FairTax legislation and created their own flawed consumption tax. They quietly loaded it with exemptions they felt more "realistic", ignored the distributional effects of eliminating highly regressive FICA taxes (you know, the ones that represent the highest tax payments by low and moderate income taxpayers) and refused to examine the $22 million of FairTax research. They then declared a consumption tax (which many writers have wrongly assumed was the FairTax) as requiring a higher rate and punitive to the middle class.

The FairTax monthly prebate actually wipes out all federal taxes on the poor and a diminishing amount of taxes are reimbursed the further one is from the poverty line.

There is great resistance to the FairTax within the circles of those who profit from the complexities of the income tax code. Last year 53% of all lobby expenditures in Washington, DC were paid to tax lobbyists. It's big business that includes not only lobbyists and tax related think tanks and tax reforms groups (entirely devoted to tweaking the income tax code) but academicians who have built careers on understanding the arcane details of the code.

Add to that the center of resistance to a simple, transparent system without gimmicks-the Congressional tax writing committees themselves. In truth, Congressional Members from both parties are addicted to using the tax code to reward friends and contributors, punish opponents and inept attempts to manipulate citizen behavior through the code. In other words, our tax writing process is driven by all the wrong reasons.

This is the single biggest reason that our tax code is so complex that it costs taxpayers $265 billion a year just to complete tax returns. It is so complex that the IRS can't answer taxpayer questions right more than six of ten times. It is so complex, the IRS comes up $350 billion short of owed taxes every year (raising the average taxpayer bill by about $2,000 annually).

On the merits, the FairTax takes politics out of the tax code and the tax code out of business decisions. It is the politics that are tough because passage requires overcoming powerful institutional players. To this end, Mike Huckabee and a host of other candidates have joined 72 Congressional co-sponsors and a growing army of citizens who believe that the public can still drive public policy ( a novel idea first suggested by the Founding Fathers). Otherwise, we are stuck with a system that makes debt more favorable than wealth, puts the "Made in America" label at a severe competitive disadvantage and punishes labor and investment. It's a system driven by politics, power and profit instead of economics or fairness. It's a lucrative gig for those in Washington and a destructive torture for everyone else.

Instead of borrowing money from the Chinese to pay out rebates to American taxpayers (as welcome as they will be) maybe we should think about what happens to the American economy when we make the USA the most desirable "tax haven" in the world. We have lost at least $12 trillion in American capital to offshore locations in recent years. Economists who have studied the FairTax agree that this wealth and a lot more in foreign investment will rush to our shores once the FairTax is enacted.

As FairTaxers say, "Dare to Be Fair". The FairTax won't be perfect and the transition will require adjustments but compared to the badly broken income tax system that so bedevils taxpayers and damages our economy, it's well worth it.

The FairTax research-as well as a recent article on how the FairTax helps the middle class by brilliant Boston University economics chair, Larry Kotlikoff, can be found at FairTax.org


TOPICS: Government
KEYWORDS: fairtax
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To: cowboyway; Bigun

The nattering nabobs of negativism that show up on these tax threads certainly don’t display much enthusiasm for this brave attempt to redefine the relationship our government has with the citizens, does it?

One suspects that they are somehow bought and paid for by the tax lobbyists in WDC, doesn’t one?

Fer shure, their agenda is pro-big government and anti-FReedom!


21 posted on 02/01/2008 12:39:13 PM PST by Taxman (So that the beautiful pressure does not diminish!)
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To: aimhigh
How is the tax collected?

Retail businesses collect the tax from the consumer, just as state sales tax systems already do in 45 states; the FairTax is simply an additional line on the current sales tax reporting form. Retailers simply collect the tax and send it to the state taxing authority. All businesses serving as collection agents receive a fee for collection, and the states also receive a collection fee. The tax revenues from the states are then sent to the U.S. Treasury. ............................................................

Frequesntly asked Questions about the Fair Tax

http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=about_faq

22 posted on 02/01/2008 12:39:29 PM PST by Turret Gunner A20
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To: Dr. Sivana
Lots of people who have made major financial decisions based on the current system could be ruined over night through no fault of their own.

People are be ruined now by the income tax. They have been making financial decisions with a system consisting of multiple taxation. The price of all goods and services includes embedded taxes at each stage of production due to businesses passing on the cost of their corporate income taxes and associated compliance costs onto the consumer. It only gets worse since investments are taxed. The Fair Tax eliminates all these taxes by abolishing corporate income taxes and taxes on investments.
23 posted on 02/01/2008 12:43:04 PM PST by Man50D (Fair Tax, you earn it, you keep it!)
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To: Taxman
Right out of the Alinsky playbook... Don’t defend your position, personally attack your opponent...

Most likely the number one reason the FT will never pass, because it attracts raging tax protesters like a bug-light out on the porch..

24 posted on 02/01/2008 12:50:07 PM PST by xcamel (Two-hand-voting now in play - One on lever, other holding nose.)
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To: ops33

Repeal of the 16th Amendment is part of HR25 the Fair Tax Bill


25 posted on 02/01/2008 12:54:58 PM PST by NCBraveheart
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To: xcamel; Your Nightmare; Always Right; lewislynn; lucysmom; robertpaulsen; Filo; longtermmemmory
Same old, same old. At least you trolls could try to get the facts straight. But, it's obviously so much easier to stay stipid and lie about things you know nothing about (and are too lazy to study up on).

How p[athetic.

You might at least coming up with a new lie once in a while -- you've gotten boring as hell.

26 posted on 02/01/2008 1:00:18 PM PST by Turret Gunner A20
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Comment #27 Removed by Moderator

To: NCBraveheart
Repeal of the 16th Amendment is part of HR25 the Fair Tax Bill

No, dissolution of the IRS regulations are part of the bill. The repeal of the 16th is a separate issue.

The implementation of the FT needs to be tied directly to the repeal or it will never fly.

Of course, the various other gaping flaws in the FT concept (re-taxing pre-taxed income, overburdening retirees and the like) will keep it from passage regardless.
28 posted on 02/01/2008 1:12:26 PM PST by Filo (Darwin was right!)
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To: Man50D

http://libertyunbound.com/archive/2003_04/welber-tax.html


29 posted on 02/01/2008 1:15:06 PM PST by Daveinyork
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To: longtermmemmory; wastedyears
From The Fair Tax Bill, HR 25:

"SEC. 301. PHASE-OUT OF ADMINISTRATION OF REPEALED FEDERAL TAXES.

(a) Appropriations- Appropriations for any expenses of the Internal Revenue Service including processing tax returns for years prior to the repeal of the taxes repealed by title I of this Act, revenue accounting, management, transfer of payroll and wage data to the Social Security Administration for years after fiscal year 2011 shall not be authorized.

(b) Records- Federal records related to the administration of taxes repealed by title I of this Act shall be destroyed by the end of fiscal year 2011, except that any records necessary to calculate Social Security benefits shall be retained by the Social Security Administration and any records necessary to support ongoing litigation with respect to taxes owed or refunds due shall be retained until final disposition of such litigation."

So, the IRS is defunded and the records are destroyed. How will an income tax spring back to life without considerable effort from the Congress? What do you think will happen to any Congress critter who suggests such a thing? Are we impotent? Did we not stop the shamnesty bill? Why do you think the American public will tolerate an income tax after they've tasted the freedom of the Fair Tax?

30 posted on 02/01/2008 1:16:11 PM PST by DivaDelMar (CRAm member-- (Conservative Republicans Against mcCain) Think you're entitled to my vote? CRAm It!!!)
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To: NCBraveheart

The FT legislation cannot repeal the 16th Amendment. It does defund collection activity.

The 16th merely authorizes an income tax. It doesn’t require one.

Repeal will require the same action as any other amendment.


31 posted on 02/01/2008 1:16:39 PM PST by PubliusMM (RKBA; a matter of fact, not opinion...)
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To: DivaDelMar

IOW the 16th amendment stays.

sorry no cigar+30% tax.


32 posted on 02/01/2008 1:24:12 PM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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Comment #33 Removed by Moderator

To: longtermmemmory

It makes sense to repeal the 16th, if for no other reason than telling future generations of its sinister implementation, and its abuses by elected slimeballs.

However, repeal will require a separate legislative effort. It can’t be done by simply enacting the FT legislation. Repeal will require another Amendment, adopted in the process of amending the Constitution.

However, by defunding collection efforts, and abolishing the IRS, the mechanism to re-enable an income tax could not happen overnight. And, just as we did with the shamnesty proposals last year, we can shut down any attempt to add another income tax.

Sorry, but this one rings hollow. We are ultimately responsible for our own political landscape...

Lock and Load.


34 posted on 02/01/2008 1:46:10 PM PST by PubliusMM (RKBA; a matter of fact, not opinion...)
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To: xcamel
They really shouldn’t let people with screws lose to post on FR

I agree! When are you leaving?

35 posted on 02/01/2008 1:49:03 PM PST by Bigun (IRS sucks @getridof it.com)
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Comment #36 Removed by Moderator

To: Taxman
Someone once said "It is difficult to free fools from chains that they revere."

He was right as rain!

37 posted on 02/01/2008 2:01:29 PM PST by Bigun (IRS sucks @getridof it.com)
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To: Bigun; Taxman

The chains of irrational rage seem to be the hardest to break..


38 posted on 02/01/2008 2:08:46 PM PST by xcamel (Two-hand-voting now in play - One on lever, other holding nose.)
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To: xcamel

Tell us what is irrational about hating slavery?


39 posted on 02/01/2008 2:14:38 PM PST by Bigun (IRS sucks @getridof it.com)
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Comment #40 Removed by Moderator


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