Evangelicals Against Mitt

The American Spectator ^ | 1/3/2008 | Carrie Sheffield

[tantiboh]

Mitt Romney is facing an unexpected challenge in Iowa from rival Mike Huckabee, who has enjoyed a groundswell of support from religious voters, particularly evangelical Christians wary of the clean-cut former Massachusetts governor because of his Mormon religion.

The common worry among evangelicals is that if Romney were to capture the White House, his presidency would give legitimacy to a religion they believe is a cult. Since the LDS church places heavy emphasis on proselytizing -- there are 53,000 LDS missionaries worldwide -- many mainstream Christians are afraid that Mormon recruiting efforts would increase and that LDS membership rolls would swell.

...

THE ONLY PROBLEM with those fears is that they don't add up. Evangelicals may be surprised to learn that the growth of church membership in Massachusetts slowed substantially during Romney's tenure as governor. In fact, one could make the absurdly simplistic argument that Romney was bad for Mormonism.

...

ONE WAY TO GAUGE what might happen under a President Romney would be to look at what happened during the period of the 2002 Olympic Winter Games. Held in Salt Lake City, they were dubbed the "Mormon Olympics."

...

Despite all the increased attention, worldwide the Church grew only slightly, and in fact in the year leading up to the games the total number of congregations fell. Overall, from 2000 to 2004, there was a 10.9 percent increase in memberships and a 3.6 percent increase in congregations.

...

The LDS church is likely to continue its current modest-but-impressive growth whether or not Romney wins the White House. Perhaps the only real worry for evangelicals is that, if elected, the former Massachusetts governor will demonstrate to Americans that Mormons don't have horns.

Carrie Sheffield, a member of the LDS Church, is a writer living in Washington, D.C.

[Elsie]

You do realize that God is omnipotent, he can do anything...

And if He were impotent; He couldn't do anything.

[Elsie]

It is very arrogant to give the answer "I don't read it that way so what you are saying is false."

But... you guys do it all the TIME!

[greyfoxx39]

I know...can’t find the updated one...FM to me if you will.

[DelphiUser]

U Said: Drag that worn out argument that has already been explained away.

No it has not.

U Said: Chiasmus was understood before Smith's time, (By Gospel scholars in monasteries, not by Farmers in New england who were 14-20 with a third grade education) it is a pattern found in other languages and cultures (That was not thought to be significantly until computers started examining scriptures) and in fact Smith's journals and the D&C contain Chiasmus. (Yep, he was an inspired man, After God speaking to you in Chiasmus for a while you start to talk and communicate in them too. however, in the Book of Mormon there are Chiasmus sometimes span chapters, the ones in Joseph's journal are short.) That means it is probably nothing more than his writing style. (Yeah, he just happens to have a writing "style" that is painstaking in its thought process and is used by Scholars of the scriptures and Prophets, almost exclusively, he just happens to use a device he could not have known about to authenticate a book and he never bothered to mention it, he waited for people to discover it over a hundred years later, lousy planning, but lucky him, it's all coincidence...) IF we had the bom plates, the could be referenced - but alas, you have to resort again to simple inuendo inspite of alternative explainations.

Yeah, if we had the plates there would be no criticism, if we had the plates that would be enough evidence, LOL! IF we had the plates returned to us tomorrow you would probably complain that the chain of evidence was broken or that we had had them manufactured or some such balderdash. You ignore all counter evidence, so your whining about the plates not being shown to you is just that whining for effect.

I Said: He certified it as Egyptian before he was told it was being translated by a prophet of God.

U Said: That is not what Anthon formally put down in writing.

Which time...

U Said: But that as it may, modern research suggests that, given the state of knowledge of Egyptian in 1828, Anthon's views would have been little more than opinion and not a basis of fact, unless you can provide the certificate or trust the word of an individual branded as a liar by Smith.

Jesus was branded a liar by the Sanhedrin, yet you take his word, why?

There are a bunch of witnesses tot he Plate's existence, what if the engravings would not be recognized as Egyptian? So? They said they had altered them for their own use. so that would even be consistent.

U Said: Is Joey around to ask? There is nothing to indicate that he didn't know either.

No he's not around, Anti Mormons killed him thinking that if his work was of men, it would end with his death, well Mormons are still here, that's because it is a work of God.

Oh, and how many people with a third grade education today know what a Colophon is? Ho many fifth graders? High School seniors? Anyone who believes Joseph Smith figured all this out, studied all this stuff, and put the Book of Mormon together, in his spare time, while farming for a living, is an Idiot.

[Elsie]

Oh, and how many people with a third grade education today know what a Colophon is? Ho many fifth graders?

Don Imus!?

Is that YOU??

(The answer is pink, black, blue, chrome or BLING.)

http://www.discountcell.com/cellular/phoneMakeCat/12

[MHGinTN]

Here is another excellent example of the sort of twisted deceitful tactic the mormonism apologists use. This poster has been given chapter and verse of why his assertion was a lie, a deceit meant to toss on its head the clear teachingas offered at New Advent regarding the Trinity. You might find this one instructional as well. And he will persist in the blindness because he has invested so much in the deceit that to fall silent would—in his mind—amount to admitting he was caught in his deception. It never occurs to such deceivers that they have been offered a way to gracefully stop deceiving ... their ‘victimhood’ is so precious to their worldview and feeds what is needed to remain willfully blind to TRUTH.

[Elsie]

No he's not around, Anti Mormons killed him thinking that if his work was of men, it would end with his death, well Mormons are still here, that's because it is a work of God.

The FUNDAMENTALIST Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is still here; too.

I guess THEY are a 'work of GOD' too!

(And a LOT closer to the teachings of your founders!!)

[DelphiUser]

Thank you, Maybe you should get together with CC and explain to her that a Virgin is someone who has not had sex with anyone including God. She doesn’t seem to know that the Virgin birth is church doctrine, and contained in both the Book of Mormon and the Bible.

Thanks for setting everyone straight form a non member perspective.

[MHGinTN]

Satan is very persistent, as Joe’s heresies show so well when you promote them repeatedly and with such vigor.

[DelphiUser]

Elsie has intimated that it pretends to be a female to elicit sympathy.

This I did not know.

Elsie, Is this true?

[Old Mountain man]

Yes, you do promote Satan very well in all you do.

[Elsie]

No he's not around, Anti Mormons killed him thinking that if his work was of men, it would end with his death, well Mormons are still here, that's because it is a work of God.

Speaking of his death...

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Top 10 Things You Didn't Know About Joseph Smith's Death

06/11/2005 by rmw

 1) Joseph Smith abandoned his garments some time before he was imprisoned. He was not wearing them when he died.

 2) Joseph Smith was arrested and put in Carthage Jail because he ordered the destruction of a printing press that was exposing the truth about his polygamy and his plans to take over the U.S. government and institute a theo-democracy.

 3) Joseph Smith tried running away from arrest by fleeing with Hyrum to Texas.

 4) Joseph Smith drank wine the night before he was killed.

 5) Joseph Smith sent a secret message to the Nauvoo Legion commander to bring troops to break him out of jail which the commander refused to do.

 6) Joseph Smith was smuggled a gun by a church friend which he fired frantically at the storming mob eventually killing two of them.

 7) Joseph Smith went to the window of the jail in view of the mob to scream the Masonry distress call hoping to influence help by fellow Masons.

 8) Joseph Smith was wearing an occult object called a Jupiter Talisman on him on the day he was killed.

 9) Joseph Smith left 33 widows, one as young as 15 and eleven that were already married to other men.

10) Joseph Smith died as a "King." He was voted this office by a secret Council of Fifty over which he was head.

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[Elsie]

Elsie, Is this true?

What!!?

You doubt an ATHEIST??

HE has no dog in this fight!

[DelphiUser]

I Said ROTFLOL! Didn't you just accuse me of Circular logic a few posts ago?

U Said No logic needed when it's a fact.

so if you have neither, you post on the internet?

[Elsie]

1) Joseph Smith abandoned his garments some time before he was imprisoned. He was not wearing them when he died.

I would guess that by not wearing them, he lost their protective qualities. DUH!

[Elsie]

so if you have neither, you post on the internet?

Nope; you write a book and claim an angel led you to it.

[DelphiUser]

I Said: But your use of them is a lie.

U Said: No, it's not.

Yes it is.. (Cue Rubber and Glue arguments)

[Paved Paradise]

Your points are well taken. I am an evangelical Christian and I like Romney a lot. I never had ANY worries that a win for Romney would boost interest in the Mormon church. I’m more concerned with how this country is going to move forward an deal with our problems and continue to protect our interests, both domestic and foreign, and so on.

[Paved Paradise]

He he. I love your comment about Nixon. Yeah, when Nixon was in office, I was seriously considering going Quaker (oats, that is).

[DelphiUser]

I Said: ...if the Prosecutor does not convince the Jury..

U Said: Not to worry; the history of your organization is quite convincing.

So is your posting history...