Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Mormons Aren't Christians (Columnist also calls Luther a heretic)
Dallas Morning News ^ | 12/16/07 | Rod Dreher

Posted on 12/16/2007 11:15:52 PM PST by Mobile Vulgus

Mormons aren't Christians ...

... and other thoughts on religion and politics sure to get your blood boiling

Herewith, my views on religion and the politics of the present moment, with something to offend just about everyone:

1. Mormons aren't Christians. I don't mean that as a criticism, only as a descriptive phrase. When Mormons claim Jesus Christ as their savior, there's no reason to doubt their sincerity and good will, or even to deny that they are in some way followers of Christ. Yet Mormonism rejects foundational doctrines of traditional Christian orthodoxy, such that it is impossible to reconcile with normative Christianity.

2. Anyway, the Latter-day Saints church teaches that all other Christian churches are apostate. A heretic is someone who rejects one or more doctrines of religion, but an apostate is someone who has rejected the religion entirely. How is it, exactly, that you can get mad when people you regard as apostates consider you to be ... apostate? How does that work?

3. Theologically, this is a big deal. But politically, so what? Mormons vote like Southern Baptists and come down on the same side of most issues of public morality like conservative Christians do. If you're a socially conservative lawmaker, wouldn't you rather have a Mormon in your legislative foxhole than a Kennedy-style cafeteria Catholic or progressive mainline Protestant? I'm no Romney fan, but is there really no meaningful political difference between Good-Mormon Mitt and Bad-Catholic Rudy, to say nothing of Liberal-Protestant Hillary?

4. There are plenty of good reasons for conservative Christians not to vote for Mr. Romney, but his religious beliefs are not among them. Do Christians want to be in the position of rejecting a candidate whose political views and moral values they agree with, solely because they don't like his religion?

(Excerpt) Read more at dallasnews.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: christians; dreher; mittromney; mormons
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 241-260261-280281-300 ... 441-449 next last
To: Soliton
Not bitter at all and a seeker, not an atheist.

That is what I thought until he wrote one of his regular columns in The Magazine of Fantasy and Science Fiction shortly before his death in which he made his position abundantly clear. I remember being disappointed in him for reaching such a conclusion based on pride alone.

261 posted on 12/17/2007 7:23:23 PM PST by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Huckabee asks if Mormons believe Jesus, devil are brothers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 251 | View Replies]

To: devere
"The U.S. constitution says very clearly there will be no religious test for federal office, but many so-called conservatives don’t seem to take that document very seriously, or so it seems to me."

-----

The U.S. Constitution says that you can't have a religious test as a qualification for office. It does NOT say that individual citizens can't have religious tests for their votes!

If I want to vote only for Scientologists, or 95th degree Masons, or bisexual Slavic poets, I am perfecdtly entitled to do so. And if I DON'T want to vote for Mormons or Methodists or those untrustworthy, scheming, no-good Bahai Faith people, that's entirely within my rights as well.

This is like when people say we have to give O.J. Simpson or this guy Drew Peterson, or Terri Schiavo's husband the presumption of innocence. NO...the JURY has to give them the presumption of innocence. The JUDGE has to give them the presumption of innocence. I have to do no such thing!

Hank

262 posted on 12/17/2007 7:24:53 PM PST by County Agent Hank Kimball (Well, really just plain Hank Kimball. Well, not "just plain" Hank Kimball, just Hank Kimball....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Diego1618
"Here is Biblical proof that Mary and Joseph had other children younger than Our Lord."

Thanks for clearing that up. I think using a verse written hundreds of years before Jesus was born backed up by an eliptical reference reminiscent of Nostradamus seals the deal.

263 posted on 12/17/2007 7:26:15 PM PST by Soliton (Freddie T is the one for me! (c))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 260 | View Replies]

To: Soliton
Why are you so sure that the Mormons can’t be right, when your religion has changed so much without Biblical evidence?

I am not herein arguing that the Mormons can't be right. I am making descriptive rather than prescriptive arguments. My point in this case is not what is true, but rather what is Christian. A Christian is one who accepts the Nicene Creed. By this argument, the LDS might be true, but it would not be Christian.

264 posted on 12/17/2007 7:30:21 PM PST by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Huckabee asks if Mormons believe Jesus, devil are brothers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 256 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla
"A Christian is one who accepts the Nicene Creed"

So your definition of "Christian" is Roman Catholic exclusively?

265 posted on 12/17/2007 7:33:22 PM PST by Soliton (Freddie T is the one for me! (c))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 264 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla
"based on pride alone."

I think you mean "science" alone.

266 posted on 12/17/2007 7:35:01 PM PST by Soliton (Freddie T is the one for me! (c))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 261 | View Replies]

To: Soliton
So your definition of "Christian" is Roman Catholic exclusively?

Not exactly. 'The Nicene Creed is an ecumenical Christian statement of faith accepted in the Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, Oriental Orthodoxy, the Assyrian, the Anglican Communion, Lutheranism, the Reformed churches, Methodism, and many other forms of Protestantism.' - wikipedia. This is well over 90% of all who consider themselves Christian

267 posted on 12/17/2007 7:38:57 PM PST by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Huckabee asks if Mormons believe Jesus, devil are brothers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 265 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

“And I believe one holy Catholic and Apostolic Church;”

Isn’t this part of the Creed?


268 posted on 12/17/2007 7:46:23 PM PST by Soliton (Freddie T is the one for me! (c))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 267 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla
A Christian is one who accepts the Nicene Creed.

Poppycock! [Acts 11:26] And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

This predates Nicaea by 300 years....and what came out of that council bore no resemblance to first century Christianity!

269 posted on 12/17/2007 7:48:16 PM PST by Diego1618
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 264 | View Replies]

To: Diego1618

Not exactly proof, but an indication. The younger may not have been fatehred by Joseph for we do not actually know when Joseph died or if Mary was married after Joseph to someone who already had children thus these siblings wound be ‘half-brothers and sisters’. We just don’t know.


270 posted on 12/17/2007 8:07:07 PM PST by MHGinTN (Believing they cannot be deceived, they cannot be convinced when they are deceived.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 260 | View Replies]

To: AnotherUnixGeek

“It’s likely that we can even do a better job of devising such standards than the iron-age desert dwellers who created the major religions of the West.”

Yeah ...OK ...Good luck with that.....we are doing a great job so far

Mel


271 posted on 12/17/2007 8:14:36 PM PST by melsec (A Proud Aussie)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: Soliton
So your definition of "Christian" is Roman Catholic exclusively?

Not exactly. 'The Nicene Creed is an ecumenical Christian statement of faith accepted in the Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, Oriental Orthodoxy, the Assyrian, the Anglican Communion, Lutheranism, the Reformed churches, Methodism, and many other forms of Protestantism.' - wikipedia. This is well over 90% of all who consider themselves Christian

272 posted on 12/17/2007 8:20:08 PM PST by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Huckabee asks if Mormons believe Jesus, devil are brothers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 265 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

Whoopie! Hitler was elected by the popular vote! I guess you think that makes him right also?


273 posted on 12/17/2007 8:21:29 PM PST by Old Mountain man (Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 272 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

Read your Bible before you decide what is and is not Christian.


274 posted on 12/17/2007 8:23:46 PM PST by Old Mountain man (Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 264 | View Replies]

To: Soliton

The Four Marks of the Church, sometimes referred to as the Marks of the Church or the Marks of the True Church, are a group of four adjectives describing the true Church as established by Jesus Christ. They are commonly acknowledged by most Christian denominations, as they are included in many of their creeds. The marks are often listed as follows: one, holy, catholic, and apostolic. They refer to four aspects that are intrinsic to the true Church: unity, sanctity, catholicism (or universality), and apostolicity.


275 posted on 12/17/2007 8:26:34 PM PST by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Huckabee asks if Mormons believe Jesus, devil are brothers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 268 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

You’re going to have to simplify your vocabulary for Old Mountain man, he can’t understand the difference in words like prescriptive and descriptive ... “I am making descriptive rather than prescriptive arguments.” LCS


276 posted on 12/17/2007 8:26:53 PM PST by MHGinTN (Believing they cannot be deceived, they cannot be convinced when they are deceived.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 264 | View Replies]

To: Old Mountain man

The New Testament is what the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church said it was, no more and no less.


277 posted on 12/17/2007 8:29:06 PM PST by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Huckabee asks if Mormons believe Jesus, devil are brothers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 274 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

Read it sometime.


278 posted on 12/17/2007 8:32:04 PM PST by Old Mountain man (Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 277 | View Replies]

To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

Folks have posted links to OMm which can teach him how the particualr books in the New Testament were decided, but he prefers ignorance so he can plead innocent as he denigrates the Bible, all very stealthily by his reckoning don’tchaknow.


279 posted on 12/17/2007 8:33:05 PM PST by MHGinTN (Believing they cannot be deceived, they cannot be convinced when they are deceived.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 277 | View Replies]

To: Old Mountain man
I guess you think that makes him right also?

My arguments here generally have not been about what is right and true, but what factually describes Christians. Membership in a church that accepts the Nicene Creed is true of virtually all Christians. This of course is no argument that it is the truth, if one is not a Christian.

280 posted on 12/17/2007 8:33:11 PM PST by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Huckabee asks if Mormons believe Jesus, devil are brothers)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 273 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 241-260261-280281-300 ... 441-449 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson