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House Passes Anti-War Bill
AP via SFGate ^ | 11/14/7 | ANNE FLAHERTY, Associated Press Writer

Posted on 11/14/2007 7:15:48 PM PST by SmithL

House Democrats pushed through a $50 billion bill for the Iraq war Wednesday night that would require President Bush to start bringing troops home in coming weeks with a goal of ending combat by December 2008.

The legislation, passed 218-203, was largely a symbolic jab at Bush, who already has begun reducing force levels but opposes a congressionally mandated timetable on the war. And while the measure was unlikely to pass in the Senate — let alone overcome a presidential veto — Democrats said they wanted voters to know they weren't giving up.

"The fact is, we can no longer sustain the military deployment in Iraq," said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif. "Staying there in the manner that we are there is no longer an option."

The White House pledged to veto the bill, and Republicans said they would back the president.

"In addition to infringing upon the president's constitutional authority as commander in chief, the bill would mandate a precipitous withdrawal of troops that could increase the probability that American troops would have to one day return to Iraq to confront an even more dangerous enemy," an administration statement said.

The bill represents about a quarter of the $196 billion Bush requested for combat operations in the 2008 budget year, which began Oct 1.

It would compel an unspecified number of troops to leave Iraq within 30 days, a requirement Bush is already on track to meet as he begins in coming weeks to reverse the 30,000 troop buildup he ordered earlier this year. It also sets a goal of ending combat by Dec. 15, 2008, and states that money included in the bill should be used to redeploy troops and "not to extend or prolong the war."

The measure also would set government-wide standards on interrogation,...

(Excerpt) Read more at sfgate.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 110th; aidandcomfort; copperheads; cultureofcutandrun; democratparty; democratscandals; dopeydems; election2008; iraq; supportthemission; supportthetroops; unconstitutional; wot
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To: Fido969

Broken government at its best.


121 posted on 11/15/2007 1:29:32 PM PST by henkster (The koran is "Mein Kampf" written in funny curlie-Q's)
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To: SmithL
The Demoncrats are UN-AMERICAN, UN-PATRIOTIC, AND UN-BELIEVABLE!!! >:-(

San Fran Gran Nan will be declaring this "bipartisan" (gag me) crap as being what America needs to 'move in a new direction' (I may vomit).

VETO VETO VETO VETO VETO!

God save us from our own when they support the enemies of the USA (heck, THEY are the enemies of the USA!!!) WILLINGLY like this. :*(
122 posted on 11/15/2007 1:34:05 PM PST by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
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To: ari-freedom

They don’t care!! They WANT America to lose!! >:-(
I honestly am starting to believe they are in collusion with the enemies of the USA, I really do!


123 posted on 11/15/2007 1:35:07 PM PST by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
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To: matthew fuller

“Illegal war”??

Methinks me smells a troll/plant...


124 posted on 11/15/2007 1:38:05 PM PST by pillut48 (CJ in TX --Soccer Mom and proud RUSH REPUBLICAN! WIN, FRED, WIN!!!)
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To: NormsRevenge
It looks like the american socialist party is ratcheting up some more "war protest" drama as the election approaches ,

check out this Peacenik recruiting Ad that is running on craiglist in all the major cities;

link to peace army recruitment

makes any peace loving flower powered, bush hatin' fruitcake just want to go out and jump under a tank, don't it ?

125 posted on 11/15/2007 1:57:31 PM PST by KTM rider (..left or right,......... socialist, or socialist light ?)
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To: pillut48
"Methinks me smells a troll/plant... "

I was quoting RP. From the first debate, I believe. I really don't think that trolls would have been pushing to draft John Bolton as much as I did. Check it out. Blow your nose.:)

126 posted on 11/15/2007 2:33:17 PM PST by matthew fuller (Crop-circles, killer rabbits and UFO'S are caused by GLOBAL WARMING!)
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To: pillut48
It is not that I question their patriotism, it is only that I question which country they are being patriotic to, for it most certainly is not MY America. And you may quote me on that!
127 posted on 11/15/2007 3:16:10 PM PST by Blackhawk
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To: molette67
Them dogs needs a good one. I’m willin’ to hold the tail. I may have to look the other way though.
128 posted on 11/15/2007 3:38:55 PM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. General Creighton Abrams)
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To: matthew fuller; molette67
I was checking your tagline. I don't klnow about the other BS, but it was the German Nazis who invented the UFO:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Xj_noNvgZw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sABpGFzxebQ&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpCGemQ4ck0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aB53a-Byso&feature=related

http://www.searchforvideo.com/science/paranormal/ufo/nazi/

http://www.stevequayle.com/High.Jump/Vril.and.Andromeda.html

http://www.naziufos.com/

http://www.eyepod.org/Nazi-Disc-Video.html

http://www.burlingtonnews.net/hitlersufo.html

But of course, it could be the commies: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Huk2X9P2BPc&feature=related

129 posted on 11/15/2007 4:12:09 PM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. General Creighton Abrams)
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To: NonValueAdded

That’s a very good way to put it.


130 posted on 11/15/2007 4:51:13 PM PST by rdl6989
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To: MNJohnnie
The Democrats “slow bleed” strategy on Iraq” managed to do only one thing, slowly bleed their job approval numbers to record lows.

The Traitorcrats have no choice. They are all owned by the Left Wing Blogosphere (i.e., their base). They have to throw this red meat at them to keep them calm.

The Democrats are stuck between a rock and a hard place. I'm loving it. :)

131 posted on 11/15/2007 6:25:16 PM PST by Repeal 16-17 (Let me know when the Shooting starts.)
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To: bricklayer

I’m ashamed to acknowledge that Obey is from WI. He is a real nut job who can’t keep his foot out of his mouth.


132 posted on 11/15/2007 6:55:50 PM PST by Merlinator (Iraq will be a success story...that is the real "inconvenient truth" for the dems in 2008)
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Comment #133 Removed by Moderator

To: ari-freedom

They know we are winning. That’s the problem for them. They want to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory and avoid having to give any credit to Bush whatsoever.


134 posted on 11/15/2007 10:08:03 PM PST by SoldierDad (Proud Dad of a 2nd BCT 10th Mountain Soldier home after 15 months in the Triagle of death)
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To: ari-freedom

They know we are winning. That’s the problem for them. They want to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory and avoid having to give any credit to Bush whatsoever.


135 posted on 11/15/2007 10:08:52 PM PST by SoldierDad (Proud Dad of a 2nd BCT 10th Mountain Soldier home after 15 months in the Triagle of death)
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To: do the dhue
Yep they are loonie! or just plain nut jobs!
136 posted on 11/16/2007 7:10:15 AM PST by molette67
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To: SmithL

“The fact is, we can no longer sustain the military deployment in Iraq,” said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif. “Staying there in the manner that we are there is no longer an option.”

The fact is, Aunti Nan, that you are an idiot


137 posted on 11/16/2007 7:28:08 AM PST by roaddog727 (BS does not get bridges built)
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To: ari-freedom

Which is why they want the troops to come home ASAP.


138 posted on 11/16/2007 8:04:05 AM PST by spower
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To: Kevmo
We should withdraw from Iraq — via Tehran.

I read your tagline and ask: Could we even start a third war against Iran and hope to win?

139 posted on 11/16/2007 9:40:01 PM PST by mwollstonecraft (VFW member)
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To: mwollstonecraft

I read your tagline and ask: Could we even start a third war against Iran and hope to win?
***Yes.

Here’s my usual post regarding this area.

Maybe my tagline will come true.

We should withdraw from Iraq — through Tehran. Here’s how I think we should “pull out of Iraq.” Add one more front to the scenario below, which would be a classic amphibious beach landing from the south in Iran, and it becomes a “strategic withdrawal” from Iraq. And I think the guy who would pull it off is Duncan Hunter.

How to Stand Up to Iran

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1808220/posts?page=36#36
Posted by Kevmo to TomasUSMC
On News/Activism 03/28/2007 7:11:08 PM PDT · 36 of 36

Split Iraq up and get out
***The bold military move would be to mobilize FROM Iraq into Iran through Kurdistan and then sweep downward, meeting up with the forces that we pull FROM Afghanistan in a 2-pronged offensive. We would be destroying nuke facilities and building concrete fences along geo-political lines, separating warring tribes physically. At the end, we take our boys into Kurdistan, set up a couple of big military bases and stay awhile. We could invite the French, Swiss, Italians, Mozambiqans, Argentinians, Koreans, whoever is willing to be the police forces for the regions that we move through, and if the area gets too hot for these peacekeeper weenies we send in military units. Basically, it would be learning the lesson of Iraq and applying it.

15 rules for understanding the Middle East
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1774248/posts

Rule 8: Civil wars in the Arab world are rarely about ideas — like liberalism vs. communism. They are about which tribe gets to rule. So, yes, Iraq is having a civil war as we once did. But there is no Abe Lincoln in this war. It’s the South vs. the South.

Rule 10: Mideast civil wars end in one of three ways: a) like the U.S. civil war, with one side vanquishing the other; b) like the Cyprus civil war, with a hard partition and a wall dividing the parties; or c) like the Lebanon civil war, with a soft partition under an iron fist (Syria) that keeps everyone in line. Saddam used to be the iron fist in Iraq. Now it is us. If we don’t want to play that role, Iraq’s civil war will end with A or B.

Let’s say my scenario above is what happens. Would that military mobilization qualify as a “withdrawal” from Iraq as well as Afghanistan? Then, when we’re all done and we set up bases in Kurdistan, it wouldn’t really be Iraq, would it? It would be Kurdistan.

.
.

I have posted in the past that I think the key to the strategy in the middle east is to start with an independent Kurdistan. If we engaged Iran in such a manner we might earn back the support of these windvane politicians and wussie voters who don’t mind seeing a quick & victorious fight but hate seeing endless police action battles that don’t secure a country.

I thought it would be cool for us to set up security for the Kurds on their southern border with Iraq, rewarding them for their bravery in defying Saddam Hussein. We put in some military bases there for, say, 20 years as part of the occupation of Iraq in their transition to democracy. We guarantee the autonomy of Iraqi Kurdistan as long as they don’t engage with Turkey. But that doesn’t say anything about engaging with Iranian Kurdistan. Within those 20 years the Kurds could have a secure and independent nation with expanding borders into Iran. After we close down the US bases, Kurdistan is on her own. But at least Kurdistan would be an independent nation with about half its territory carved out of Persia. If Turkey doesn’t relinquish her claim on Turkish Kurdistan after that, it isn’t our problem, it’s 2 of our allies fighting each other, one for independence and the other for regional primacy. I support democratic independence over a bullying arrogant minority.

The kurds are the closest thing we have to friends in that area. They fought against Saddam (got nerve-gassed), they’re fighting against Iran, they squabble with our so-called ally Turkey (who didn’t allow Americans to operate in the north of Iraq this time around).

It’s time for them to have their own country. They deserve it. They carve Kurdistan out of northern Iraq, northern Iran, and try to achieve some kind of autonomy in eastern Turkey. If Turkey gets angry, we let them know that there are consequences to turning your back on your “friend” when they need you. If the Turks want trouble, they can invade the Iraqi or Persian state of Kurdistan and kill americans to make their point. It wouldn’t be a wise move for them, they’d get their backsides handed to them and have eastern Turkey carved out of their country as a result.

If such an act of betrayal to an ally means they get a thorn in their side, I would be happy with it. It’s time for people who call themselves our allies to put up or shut up. The Kurds have been putting up and deserve to be rewarded with an autonomous and sovereign Kurdistan, borne out of the blood of their own patriots.

Should Turkey decide to make trouble with their Kurdish population, we would stay out of it, other than to guarantee sovereignty in the formerly Iranian and Iraqi portions of Kurdistan. When one of our allies wants to fight another of our allies, it’s a messy situation. If Turkey goes “into the war on Iran’s side” then they ain’t really our allies and that’s the end of that.

I agree that it’s hard on troops and their families. We won the war 4 years ago. This aftermath is the nation builders and peacekeeper weenies realizing that they need to understand things like the “15 rules for understanding the Middle East”

This was the strategic error that GWB committed. It was another brilliant military campaign but the followup should have been 4X as big. All those countries that don’t agree with sending troups to fight a war should have been willing to send in policemen and nurses to set up infrastructure and repair the country.

What do you think we should do with Iraq?
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1752311/posts

Posted by Kevmo to Blue Scourge
On News/Activism 12/12/2006 9:17:33 AM PST · 23 of 105

My original contention was that we should have approached the reluctant “allies” like the French to send in Police forces for the occupation after battle, since they were so unwilling to engage in the fighting. It was easy to see that we’d need as many folks in police and nurse’s uniforms as we would in US Army unitorms in order to establish a democracy in the middle east. But, since we didn’t follow that line of approach, we now have a civil war on our hands. If we were to set our sights again on the police/nurse approach, we might still be able to pull this one off. I think we won the war in Iraq; we just haven’t won the peace.

I also think we should simply divide the country. The Kurds deserve their own country, they’ve proven to be good allies. We could work with them to carve out a section of Iraq, set their sights on carving some territory out of Iran, and then when they’re done with that, we can help “negotiate” with our other “allies”, the Turks, to secure Kurdish autonomy in what presently eastern Turkey.

That leaves the Sunnis and Shiites to divide up what’s left. We would occupy the areas between the two warring factions. Also, the UN/US should occupy the oil-producing regions and parcel out the revenue according to whatever plan they come up with. That gives all the sides something to argue about rather than shooting at us.

That leaves Damascus for round II. The whole deal could be circumvented by Syria if they simply allow real inspections of the WOMD sites. And when I say “real”, I mean real — the inspectors would have a small armor division that they could call on whenever they get held up by some local yocal who didn’t get this month’s bribe. Hussein was an idiot to dismantle all of his WOMDs and then not let the inspectors in. If he had done so, he’d still be in power, pulling Bush’s chain.


140 posted on 11/16/2007 10:16:06 PM PST by Kevmo (We should withdraw from Iraq — via Tehran. And Duncan Hunter is just the man to get that job done.)
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