The myth of Rudy's electability [MUST READ!]

North Star Writer's Group via The Keizer Times ^ | November 2, 2007 | Paul Ibrahim

[2ndDivisionVet]

Most Republican presidential candidates can brag about attracting followers with their valiant stances on important issues.

Rudy Giuliani's followers support him because they think he can beat Hillary Clinton.

In and by itself, the reasoning of Giuliani's supporters is not illogical. Many people do take into account electability when voting for a primary candidate (although most will not sacrifice their basic principles in the name of an election victory).

The problem is, this perceived electability is the only thing going for Giuliani.

But here is the real kicker: Giuliani is not electable.

In fact, he is far less electable than the only other Republican frontrunners understood to be capable of beating Hillary, namely Fred Thompson and John McCain.

To this, Giuliani's people inevitably shout the following talking points: First, Giuliani's moderate standpoint will attract unaffiliated voters, and can help Republicans make up for the unpopularity they have inherited from the George W. Bush years. Second, Giuliani has a lot of conservative accomplishments going for him – just look at how he handled 9/11, reduced crime in New York City, and how he reduced crime in New York City while handling 9/11!

They fail on both points.

First, Giuliani is a liberal. He supports abortion, and welcomes illegal immigrants to sanctuary cities. He opposes gun rights. He supported a Democratic candidate for governor in New York, and among his 75 judicial appointments, Democrats outnumbered Republicans by more than eight to one.

Though he attempted to knock Thompson on tort reform in the last presidential debate, he failed to mention his own poor record on the matter. Only a few years ago he sued two dozen gun manufacturers and distributors for essentially being functioning gun manufacturers and distributors, calling them "an industry which profits from the suffering of innocent people."

Giuliani's supporters will concede that he is not that conservative on social issues, but that really it is a good thing because we don't want extremist evangelical Christians taking over the GOP. But opposing abortion, illegal immigration, gun control and liberal judges does not make you an extremist. It merely makes you conservative.

Knowing they lose on the social issues, the Giuliani team holds on tight to fiscal matters allegedly showing that the man is really conservative. Since economic questions are often not as black and white as social topics, the Giuliani team knows that critics will have a harder time debunking the myth of Giuliani's economic conservatism.

But it can be done, and briefly so.

Giuliani tenaciously battled the line-item veto, which allows the executive to cut waste from legislative bills, taking the fight as far as he could in the courts. Giuliani also defied the promise of free trade – perhaps the only concept economists virtually unanimously support – through his ardent opposition to NAFTA.

These facts might explain why Giuliani indiscriminately answers "crime" and "George Will said I'm conservative" during the presidential debates as many times as Ron Paul brings up "foreign policy" in response to completely unrelated questions. Giuliani has nothing else to run on in order to win over conservatives. Unlike the other candidates, he cannot brag about his primary strength – the perception that he is electable.

But the fact is, the general election will be no head-to-head match up if Giuliani is the Republican nominee. In 2004, the Constitution Party ran Michael Peroutka against President Bush, now widely considered to have pandered to social conservatives in extreme fashion. You bet these social conservatives would run a candidate against nominee Giuliani. You bet the Libertarian Party would eat away more Republican votes. And you bet Clinton would win.

Giuliani is a liberal. And if nominated by the GOP, he would be a liberal running against someone who is better at being liberal. He would have to compete just as hard for conservative votes as for liberal and moderate votes, and he will lose.

Giuliani is not conservative. Giuliani is not electable. A thorough look at his record, the polls and the political reality cannot lead to any other conclusion. He's got the worst of both worlds.

[JoanVarga]

Finny, I hope you're right.

I don't trust my own Party anymore. None of 'em.

Put all the dem-wits and republicans in a burlap sack and hit it with a stick. You won't hit the wrong one.

I want to believe in the Fred! The cynic in me is just looking for the meanest dog for the fight.

I know, cynicism is too easy.

-Joan

[Finny]

Joan, no offense, honest -- but cynicism is worse than simply "too easy" -- it's destructive to everything it touches. Cynics create the illusion of being "clever" yet exhibit zero smarts, origninality, or optimism. Rush is right when he says it's the easiest thing in the world to be a pessimist, to be negative. IMO, the ONLY scenario in which the cynic is half-way worthwhile is when he's a professional comedian, and even then, the cynic-comedian becomes predictable and tiresome quickly.

Skeptical is one thing. Cynical is quite another. I tend to think you're probably more skeptical than cynical. I hope so.

[Liz]

DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY MAP----TERRORIST ENTRY POINTS

MAP OF TEXAS-CANADA-MEXICO TRADE CORRIDOR BROKERED BY Bracewell & Giuliani

CONSTRUCTON OF TRADE ROAD IN MEXICO

Bracewell & Giuliani Firm Advises Cintra in First Privatization of Toll Road in Texas DALLAS (March 1, 2007) Bracewell & Giuliani LLP (Texas-based law firm with global connections) advised Cintra Concesiones de Infraestructuras de Transporte, S.A., a Spanish transportation company, in its successful bid to develop State Highway 121 into a toll road through Collin and Denton counties ("trade road" is four football fields wide). The award to Cintra, approved by the Texas Transportation Commission, is the first privatization of a Texas toll road. Bracewell is acting as project counsel to Cintra with respect to the 50-year concession from the Texas Department of Transportation. Cintra will pay a $2.1 billion upfront and annual lease payments totaling $700 million. "Cintra was awarded this project because of its proven expertise and competitive proposal," said Thomas O. Moore, partner with Bracewell & Giuliani. "This is the largest transportation deal of 2007. This is one of only five deals in the country." http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1803916/posts

NASCO Members: United States: Texas Dept. of Transportation Iowa Department of Transportation State of Oklahoma Minnesota Dept. of Transportation Bell County, Texas Denton County, Texas Tarrant County, Texas Webb County, Texas Jackson County, Missouri City of Denton, Texas City of Ft. Worth, Texas City of Gainesville, Texas City of Kansas City, Missouri International Trade Institute of the Americas Free Trade Alliance San Antonio Port San Antonio United States - Mexico Chamber of Commerce Kansas City SmartPort The Ardmore Development Authority, City of Ardmore, Oklahoma Belton Economic Development Corporation The Des Moines Area Metropolitan Planning Organization The Allen Group Hillwood - Alliance Texas The Ambassador Bridge Detroit/Windsor Crossing American Airlines Blackwood, Langworthy & Tyson, an established Kansas City law firm Cadre Technologies Franco Eleuteri & Associates EWI Risk Services, Inc. GrowthNet Trading, LLC International Bank of Commerce Love's Travel Stops & Country Stores PROTECT-US, Inc. Scrub Oak Technologies Strasburger & Price Law Firm Trans Am Group Yellow Roadway Corporation Worldwide The NAFTA Superhighway

AND NASCO member Lockheed Martin (the only Pentagon defense contractor listed)

[sport]

I stand with you!

[JoanVarga]

Skeptic, then. I wanna have good self-esteem!
:o)

Thanks, Fin.

[stevie_d_64]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1920548/posts

Reference post #44

I see what you are saying there...

The assumptions of our leadership and the pundits are going to slice and dice us up even before November ‘08 roll around...

Why else has the Republican field not tackled ILLEGAL immigration on as a cornerstone issue of the election, yet???

I figure some will do so rather quickly after the first primaries, but that may be too little too late...

That issue alone is ripe for the picking, the democrats can’t touch it because its a deathnail in their own political future...They can’t go on record either way...

Not even going to blither on with the “war” because I figure personally it could have been taken care of a lot quicker, but ironically the dems are the ones allowing it to go on and on with no real game plan to finish it...They can’t because it keeps the country on edge about it and benefits them to regain even more power politically...At which time they can lay out the Vietnam failure plan to drive a nail in conservative politics for a long time...

Oops...I need to go take care of something...

[Dad yer funny]

FR *bookmark*

[Finny]

Yes, I think of all the cynics I’ve dealt with — and in my biz of PR, they are legion — and they do have deep self-esteem “iss-yews.” They’re also lousy at PR and generally depressed about life in general; they don’t know how to be sincere, even when they want to. I tell you again, cynicism is destructive to everything it touches. Like jealousy, it is as “cruel as the grave.”

[Finny]

... they don’t know how to be sincere ...

Warming to one of my favorite soap-box topics!! More specifically, cynics have so honed the art of ridiculing sincerity, that they often cannot comfortably indulge in it themselves. Pity (as opposed to mercy) is an awful thing, very close to contempt -- which is why I have contempt for cynics. They inspire pity (which I resent), and they're immune to mercy by their own choice. Very sad.

So you want to know my REAL opinion about cynicism?? ;^)

[b9]

I think of all the cynics I’ve dealt with — and in my biz of PR, they are legion — and they do have deep self-esteem “iss-yews.”

cynicism = selfish steam

[Clintonfatigued]

While Rudy has a lot of accomplishments, this is something that has to be taken into account. A conservative third-party candidacy is a real threat if it happens, and it could happen. Those thinking of supporting him have to face this reality.

A Thompson/Giuliani ticket could be very appealing, with a lot of star power.

[JoanVarga]

Don't hold back, Fin!

:o)

I'm the eternal optimist about most everything, actually. Even if I ever threw myself off a building in despair--why, every floor down you'd hear me say, "so far, so good!"

-Joan

[wagglebee]

I certainly don’t agree with Rudy G on everything, but fact is the abortion genie is never going back in the bottle. Homosexuality is now open, that’s not going to change either. Some level of gun control is gonna happen. Deal with these things.

So, your idea is to embrace liberalism?

Rudy is smart, tough, and ready to defend this country. He is the terrorists’ worse nightmare.

A totally unsubstantiated lie put forth by Rooty and the Rooty Rooters.

I think he might be another Teddy Roosevelt.

Yep, he will sue corporations, strengthen unions, push enviornmentalism, create more government bureaucracy, just like the leftist Roosevelts did.

[penowa]

I think you’re correct in how you’re reading the situation. It looks to me like there is a well thought out plan to divide the Republicans and divide conservatives so many ways, Hillary’s 50% negatives won’t make any difference.

Neutering conservative talk radio by threatening them with the Fairness Doctrine has had its effect. Nothing will happen until there is a Democrat president to sign the bill or to make a new appointment to the FCC, but it has turned most of the talkers into hypocrites without principles because they are so concerned about being unemployed they would advocate voting for Hillary if she were running as a Republican in order to keep their jobs!

The MSM is creating a constant barrage of bad news, and worse news, then polling to see if we’re getting the message that it’s hopeless and we may as well give up.

The only thing they can’t plan for is something out of left field they are unaware of that MIGHT breathe new life into the downtrodden and bring us back to life.

[sport]

Im not downtrodden.

I’m not down.

I’m just not going to vote for a Hillary lite a/k/a Rudy.

No matter what color dress or high heels you dress him in, the end result is the same.

[perfect_rovian_storm]

Beautifully written and 100% spot on as always! :)

[Finny]

Excellent! Well put!

[Finny]

Cute!

[Brices Crossroads]

Thanks. It is not difficult to defend Fred. History and familiarity with the GOP primary process tell me how this is likely to turn out.

Poor Romney and Rudy posters have to twist themselves into knots to defend those two. And the attacks on Fred are so pathetic, never on substance, always on “style “ or “energy” or some subjective claptrap that can neither be proven nor refuted. Rarely on the issues, and never on the principles, do they try to attack.

Some twist the truth so much it reminds me of that old saying down south, “They ain’t got a shame bone in their bodies.” I am presuming that at least some of them are being paid. That must be where some of Mitt’s $50 million went.

[penowa]

Good! Neither am I going to vote for Rudy under any circumstances. They want us to be downtrodden and despondent, but I don’t plan to get depressed about it as long as there’s hope.