Columbia's Conceit. Exactly what would it have accomplished to "engage in a debate" with Hitler?

opinionjournal.com ^ | September 25, 2007 | BRET STEPHENS

[Tolik]

...In his 1933 speech, Ambassador Luther made the case for Hitler's "peaceful intentions" in Europe, ...Millions of Europeans believed this right up to September 1939, just as millions of Americans did right up to December 1941.

...Let's assume, however, that Hitler had used the occasion of his speech not just to dissimulate but to really air his mind, to give vent not just to Germany's historical grievances but his own apocalyptic ambitions. In "Terror and Liberalism" (2003), Columbia alumnus Paul Berman observes ...prewar French socialists--keenly aware and totally opposed to Hitler's platform--nonetheless took the view that Germany had to be accommodated and that the real threat to peace came from their own "warmongers and arms manufacturers." This notion, Mr. Berman writes, rested in turn on a philosophical belief that "even the enemies of reason cannot be the enemies of reason. Even the unreasonable must be, in some fashion, reasonable."

So there is Adolf Hitler on our imagined stage, ranting about the soon-to-be-fulfilled destiny of the Aryan race. And his audience of outstanding Columbia men are mostly appalled, as they should be. But they are also engrossed, and curious, and if it occurs to some of them that the man should be arrested on the spot they don't say it. Nor do they ask, "How will we come to terms with his world?" Instead, they wonder how to make him see "reason," as reasonable people do.

In just a few years, some of these men will be rushing a beach at Normandy or caught in a firefight in the Ardennes. And the fact that their ideas were finer and better than Hitler's will have done nothing to keep them and millions of their countrymen from harm, and nothing to get them out of its way.

[Tolik]

Nailed It!

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[goldstategop]

The Bible says you shall hate evil people and destroy those - yes, kill those whose hands are full of blood and who spread deceit. You are not to have mercy on them. You are to vomit them out and bathe your feet in their blood as the Psalmist says, so justice may be established on earth and men can see you walk righteously with God. We should be arresting and trying Ahmedinenazi for war crimes. Instead, we treat him as a civilized man with whom we can do business. I find nothing more obscene and morally revolting as the spectacle of giving evil a good name it has never deserved.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[Jeff Head]

Exactly what would it have accomplished to "engage in a debate" with Hitler?

More innocent deaths, a longer war, and a greater chance for Hitler's triumph. Exactly the same things that are being accomplished by these fools engaging with this madman and giving him a podium from which he derives propoganda victories within his own controlled nation and others like it.

[IronJack]

There was no “debate.” This was not an exchange or a rhetorical give-and-take. It was nothing but Ahmanutjob standing on a bully pulpit denouncing reality for all the world to hear. It was brazen, defiant, and overflowed with utter contempt for American sensibilities. It served to advance the discourse as much as a fart in church contributes to the sermon.

[Vanbasten]

great article.

[laotzu]

Lee Bollinger: "We believe in accommodating the views of anyone who wants to kill us just as strongly as we condemn the views of people who spend their money and blood keeping us safe. We are not hypocrites."

[Southack]

One purpose served by letting such people speak is that their own words are aired instead of having sympathizers put more convenient phrases into their mouths at their leisure.

Had this occurred in the 1930’s, then more people than just the insightful Churchill would have seen Chamberlain’s folley of appeasement...perhaps even Neville himself.

[Mach5]

The socialists (pre-war French and those at Columbia) have the same premise - they can be reasoned with.

And it's not true.

Never has been, never will be.

They are deluded, and people like Ahmadinejad will kill us if left unchecked.

[goldstategop]

The point is reason and dialogue has never stopped those who evil. Only force has. Both Winston Churchill and President Bush have understood the necessity of using force to eliminate blood-thirsty regimes. The Left's response has been to condemn this morally courageous choice and counsel further appeasement. And its hard to see where reason creates the conditions for an enlightened and more peaceful world if you head is the one that is chopped off at the end of the "dialogue." A lot of people in this world don't get it.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[MrB]

You’re absolutely right, nutjob simply lied and denied any of the hard stuff, spoke the Democrat party line, and had a forum in which to gain credibility.

I find it interesting that holocaust denial, seeking extermination of the Jews, wiping out Israel, subjugation of women, seeking nuclear weapons with which to further his goals, actively seeking conflict and war to bring about the “end times” - none of this engendered much student ire - BUT -

deny that you have homosexuals in your country and they throw you under the bus.

[tomnbeverly]

Exactly, spot on... Amadmanjihad is a psychotic. His rants and raves about science and technology as the true path to Freedom were every bit as horrifying as revelations of Hilter’s final solution. The man spoke of pure hate... Carefully examine his inference that the holocaust should be viewed from various perspectives... that simple statement alone shows his madness... His view is not that the holocaust didn’t happen, no he didn’t deny it in fact he celebrated it, in his view the holocaust is not really a bad thing and besides that the Europeans are at fault not the muslims so why are the Palestinians being punished for it? Utter madness.

[Jeff Head]

Sorry...I disagree fundamentally.

The left is going to be the left, and, like the moonbat yesterday on Daily-Kos who indicated that she knew, as a lesbian, that IWannaMakeJihad would have her killed in Iran, that she nonetheless was swooning over the guy because of his speaking out against Bush. Such people's hate have caused them to become mentally deranged.

What yesterday accomplished was to give this utter tyrant a platform and legitimacy around the world (irrespective of what we think here), and particularly a platform to derive propoganda vistories amongst his own controlled nation, and others like it who are apt to seek to embolden and enrage their masses, who do not have the open communication and free information we have in this country.

They are the ones that sign up to kill our sons and daughters in Iraq and Afghanistan, and who these same madmen, particularly IWannaMakeJihad, would love to enlist to come here and do the same to myou and me.

Tragically, pathetically, disgustingly...and IMHO, yesterday was a vistory for the madman from Iran against fundamental American values and sensibilities...irrespective of Bollinger's attempt to put a sugar coating on a steaming cow paddy.

[Southack]

A valid, if pessimistic, view...but I’m seeing the bright side.

More Americans are now protesting Iran in public than before.

More Americans are aware of the Iranian threat than before.

...so our side is better off for the little man speaking here.

[traderrob6]

“Never debate a fool for the audience won’t know who he is.” Debating a fool AND a liar is twice as futile.

[ctdonath2]

Know thy enemy.

[tioga]

I found it appalling to hear the students applaud this nutjob.

[SengirV]

Very interesting, and nice ammo for my lib friends who think this very same way.

[AppyPappy]

Not only that, he is able to silence his critics by allowing the media to fawn all over him. The America-haters get to revel in his ability to “bell the cat”. The American media is powerless to criticize him so they slobber all over him.

This was a major victory for the terrorists.

[tomnbeverly]

However, when you cut and paste the media, in a self serving way, in your own country where you are truly; as Lee Bolinger proclaimed; “A petty and cruel dictator”, you can come off to your opposition as the god you believe yourself to be.

This entire experiment was a nightmare and did nothing but prop up this little dictator.