Fighting Pornography: A New Approach

Family Fragments.com ^ | 8/15/07 | Justin Hart

[LightedCandle]

Ed Meese, former attorney general under Ronald Reagan and Judith Reisman, noted author and scholar kick off "FamilyFragments.com" a website dedicated to fighting pornogrpahy.

[JeffAtlanta]

Clueless. The addicts that are used as 'actors' are forced as surely as if guns had been used.

They are "forced" in the same way that Walmart employees are "forced" to work for low wages and minimal healthcare coverage.

By your logic, addicts that steal or murder people for money are simply victims and are "forced" into their actions.

[amchugh]

The site no longer depicts that picture, but rather a for sale page.

[amchugh]

You make good points, and I started to write a long post refuting some and disagreeing with others, but instead I will state what I feel but can’t prove about porn as succinctly as possible.

Porn appears to you to be a negative and damaging thing. To me it appears to be a thing that attracts negative and damaged individuals. I hope you can see why I think trying to address the latter condition with Gov’t policy and law is somewhat futile, and could erode first amendment rights with little to no benefit.

[amchugh]

Nobody is ever forced to buy or watch porn. Nobody is ever forced to produce it.

I generally defend pornographer's first amendment rights, but I'd be surprised if there weren't counter examples to both of those statements. Especially with human trafficking and forced prostitution being what it is.

[amchugh]

Is one of them the prophet Mohammed? Just kidding.

[amchugh]

Excellent point.

[CitizenUSA]

I swear libertarians are some of the most naive people in the entire world. Childlike, they spout their anger at anyone who dares impose any restrictions on their behavior whatsoever.

First off, I believe Ed Meese is writing about a non-profit organization...NOT a government program. Before they rage against big government, I suggest the libertarians read the article.

Secondly, a free society only works as long as people self-regulate their behavior. Libertarians always spout off about how THEY can smoke dope or read porn without harming themselves. Again, like a bunch of children, it’s all about THEM. Well, just because someone can play with fire without getting burnt doesn’t mean it’s a good thing if everyone plays with fire. Unless the libertarians can make a case that pornography and pot smoking are positive activities on the whole, then so what if they aren’t personally harmed? After all, who cares about the considerable negative impact of drugs, promiscuity, and adultery on society as long as we are free, right?

Thirdly, if people cannot regulate their own behaviors and act as responsible citizens, understanding that what they do isn’t only about them and affects others in society, government always inevitably steps in to fill the void. Why do we have so many laws with more created every day? Because a significant number of citizens no longer believe in a God who will punish them and/or they don’t have enough self discipline to do what’s right even when others aren’t watching them. I seriously wish we could shrink government, but how is that ever going to happen if the majority of people can’t act like responsible citizens?

Feel free to flame me, libertarians. Personally, I think you’re as great a threat to our society as the liberals.

[KeepUSfree]

Wow, you just plagiarized Mullah Omar. You are not a conservative....just a religious thug on a "mission from God" - and no better than any Talibani - just with a different God.

I suppose you would like to set up the new Caliphate? - expressing your personal morality...

Disgusting.

[CitizenUSA]

Quuestion_Assumptions wrote: “You can simply summarize by explaining exactly what role you think government should have, if any, in encouraging or protecting public safety.”

Don’t bother. The libertarians don’t want government doing anything that might restrict their liberty to do whatever they want whenever they want. The rest of society be d*****!

[CitizenUSA]

bvw wrote: “The better we act individually, the less we may need to act under the charter of a group, but even in the most sophisticated of cultures, where humans are fully responsible trustworthy and honest there still will be laws and regulations of social behavior.”

Well said! Social behavior must always be regulated to a certain extent. Everyone gives up some liberty in order to enjoy the benefits of society.

[goldstategop]

Its a private group. I oppose government dictating what adults can read and watch but I have no difficulty with private groups like the Lighted Candle Society doing what they can to curtail the spread of porn in our society.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[goldstategop]

The Left... the ACLU has employed civil litigation for decades to move our Judeo-Christian heritage to the social margins. The LCS would simply be using the same tools to revitalize the traditional values of our society.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[goldstategop]

Adults can still view sexual material. However, the production and distribution of porn is obscene material NOT protected by the First Amendment. Private citizens certainly have the right to go after the producers and purveyors of porn. In any event, the First Amendment only prohibits government censorship. It does not prevent individuals and businesses from being the arbiters of our culture life.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[goldstategop]

It has never been. There is a difference between Ulysses and Hustler. The latter has no literary, artistic, or scientific merit that would make it protected speech.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[goldstategop]

Exactly. There is nothing wrong with holding them accountable for the harm they do to our society. Porn is a multi-billion dollar business. It will never be eradicated but it can be checked.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[goldstategop]

You're NOT always free to do that. Robert Bork pointed out the issue of "externality" - an illicit act is not necessarily private and its public effects may be detrimental to the welfare of our community, such as our children. Liberals and libertarians ignore the issue altogether. Still, it exists.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[goldstategop]

It depicts sexual activity. Nothing wrong with sexuality but a lot of people feel the constant depiction of it devalues and transvalueizes the most intimate aspects of a union between a man and a woman. Such people are not necessarily prudes.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[goldstategop]

That's the kind of porn every one should oppose. Its a far cry from Playboy models and certainly even from depictions of adults engaging in sex. Nothing in our Constitution says we have to put up with child pornography. It should be unacceptable in a civilized and decent society.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[CitizenUSA]

traviskicks wrote: “A true utopia is where every imaginable vice is available, legal, and plentiful, but yet, the people, and by ‘the people’ I mean each individual person, chooses, volitionally, without the coercion of government, not to partake in these deviations because they are enlightened as to the nature of themselves and are deeply reflective of their thoughts and actions.”

Your libertarian utopia is as unrealistic as the others you mentioned. What you are completely ignoring are the harmful effects of “plentiful” vices. While your citizens are learning and growing, they aren’t just harming themselves. Many decisions have impacts that last decades if not a lifetime. It’s a little late to sit back and contemplate your thoughts and actions when you’re dying of AIDS or have three children who you cannot afford to raise. Even if you personally can dabble and experiment without getting burnt, most people cannot survive the learning process unscathed, and guess what, I bet most of them will come looking for you to help pay for their mistakes.

[goldstategop]

Those are all good reasons for opposing pornography. We seek to shield our children from it, not that we think sex is something to be ashamed of or certainly that making love is not the worthiest expression of human nature. In the right circumstances, it can be ennobling and beautiful. Indeed, religion has regarded sex as a prototype of the human relationship with the Almighty. Its as close to ending human loneliness and alienation as exists on this earth. What people do think is wrong with porn is that it inverts all these impulses and reduces it to an expression of mechanical activity that exists largely to gratify mercenary and then selfish impulses. It is those dark aspects of sexuality we seek to shield from our children as well as make sure they understand it is also a reproductive act as well as an act of mutual pleasure between a man and a woman at an appropriate age in their upbringing. It has physical and psychological consequences that are life-altering. That is why society in every age has sought to control sexual expression, out of an awareness of both its beneficial and destructive aspects alike.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus