Posted on 07/12/2007 11:13:17 AM PDT by USFRIENDINVICTORIA
Rumblings in the automotive world suggest that Honda killing its Accord hybrid may have been just the canary in the over-hyped hybrid coal mine. Honda’s decision raises the question: Are hybrids just a fad -- a short-term solution to a long-term problem?
Until now, the big reason why people bought hybrids was the dual promise of frugal fuel consumption and zero emissions — save your money, save the Earth.
Trouble is, the media has generated enough hybrid hype that dealers are reluctant to negotiate on the purchase price. Beyond the current get-‘em-while-you-can government rebates, zero per cent financing or cash-back incentives on hybrids in Canada are about as rare as free gas.
Hybrid operating costs also need to be heeded.
Do you drive at the speed of traffic on the highway in less than ideal conditions (i.e., when it's windy and the road is hilly?) Or live in a climate where you use your car’s defroster or air conditioning (which, here in Ottawa, where we go from winter frost to summer humidity over lunch, is about 365 days of the year)? Using the condenser in the A/C system uses more power, which uses more fuel.
If this sounds like your driving lifestyle, you can pretty much forget about achieving the typically surreal fuel consumption estimates that most hybrids claim.
(In addition, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency is in the process of updating its fuel consumption testing for the first time in more than 40 years to include real-world conditions. Not surprisingly, hybrids — like all other cars — take a beating. Some experts are estimating a 20 per cent increase in consumption compared to the current EPA ratings.)
The final reason hybrids may end up as a passing fancy is that, in a traditional sense, they effectively remove the act of driving as a visceral experience.
So hybrids are expensive to own, don’t deliver on advertised fuel consumption and are about as exciting to drive as a Kenmore side-by-side. Yet hybrid fans can absolve their vehicles of all these sins by self-righteously claiming ownership of the low emissions crown, right?
Yes, up until now.
New car customers are demanding vehicles that are cleaner, and more fuel-efficient — without the extra costs and driving compromises that are inherent with hybrids. And automakers are responding.
One example is the very non-hybrid Mini D. Not planned for Canada (yet), it will arrive in Europe later this summer.
The “D” is for diesel. And if you’re thinking, “Oooo, a stinky, soot emitting diesel” you would be wrong. In addition to achieving a better-than-60 U.S. m.p.g. (3.9 L/100 km) rating, the Mini D’s carbon dioxide tailpipe emissions are 104 g/km — a figure that, not incidentally, matches the cleaner-than-thou Prius.
And it’s not just the Mini D that can achieve hybrid-like fuel consumption and emissions without asking owners to sacrifice traditional car ownership expectations.
By way of stop-and-start technologies, sophisticated aerodynamics or the use of low weight materials, European-only cars like BMW’s 118 D, Volkswagen’s Polo Bluemotion or Peugeot 107 are not only mean with fuel, but also green.
Hybrids have been perceived as a panacea to our planet’s non-renewable energy and dirty skies crisis. But they’re really only one solution. There needs to be a greater variety of “green” vehicles that can meet the diversity of people’s needs, which would have a further-reaching positive environmental impact.
As a more mainstream solution that’s cheaper to own, and more fun to drive, maybe we can look at what Honda will be replacing its Accord hybrid with in 2009: an ultra clean 2.2-litre D-I-E-S-E-L.
We all need to remember Carnot and his famous “cycle.”
I am a Prius owner, i forget there are any others. :-)
Natural gas has a higher proportion of hydrogen (and lower of carbon) compared to gasoline or diesel — so a car using CNG would also have lower CO2 numbers, even though the fuel change wouldn’t improve the Carnot efficiency of the engine.
Dump the hybrid, forget ethanol in order to bring food prices down, build refineries, and drill for oil where we have it.
I know, it isn’t popular.
Turbo Diesel’s are cool.
Their exhaust is terribly hot, and lots of it also.
M-1A Abrams tank drivers used to take care of tailgating BMW’s on the Autobahn by gunning the engine. Exhaust would peel the paint off the Beemer. Melt some of the plastic too!
“the Civic Hybrid is a *car* first,”
That’s not a car, it’s closer to a toy for a 3 year old.
The current Civic is bigger than the Accord two generations back, and it’s about the same size as the 80s Chevy Malibu.
It’s not a toy any more.
We have the same low-sulfur diesel as they do now.
Parts for these death traps are gonna be WICKED expensive. Who would be dumb enough to buy one of these poisonous dogs? Algore? I've heard he's into Cadillac Escalades and private jets...
Im glad you posted that. My sister is a die hard toyota fan and hates fords. She visited my parents recently and was givin the use of my mom’s old tarus(96 I think). She said she was totally amazed how well it did on gas and claimed the one she borrowed sipped fuel more slowly than a camry. She decided there must’ve been something wrong with it, plugged fuel pump or something, for it to use such small amounts of gas.
Couldn’t the exhaust be put through a cooling radiator of some sort?
OMG, you have a good point there. I never thought of that. Those EPA goons are sneaky!
A “Nuke Gay Whales” bumper sticker might do the trick.
Or did that end with the Probe?
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1731002/posts
It’s way off at one end of the scale & isn’t a hybrid — but it sounds like it would be a fun drive. The noise sounds like an even worse problem than the exhaust.
You need to do a little more research on the geo metro. On the highway, the geo metro will DEFINITELY utterly destroy your precious prius in mileage. I used to own one. Mine was the 3 door 3 cylinder 5 speed stick.
First of all, the geo metro is TINY. It is pushing half the volume of air that a prius does. Later on, the geo got a little bigger, taller, and larger wheels/tires. But the older ones had skinny little 12 inch rims and tires. They hugged the ground. Tires for the metro could be had for 20 bucks each back when I had one. If you didn’t mind if your new set of tires didn’t match, you could get them for as low as 9 bucks each, that’s right, less than a ten spot per tire. Mine did not have air conditioning or electric anything or even power steering. It may not have even had power brakes. I can’t remember for sure. It had a heater, AM/FM radio and windshield wipers...and that’s all folks. No air bags, no anti lock brakes, no surround sound or elecric seats or tilt steering...NOTHING. The motor was a 998cc single overhead cam 2 valve per cylinder 3 cylinder with I think 59 horsepower. This is all from memory so don’t hold me to it. By contrast, my motorcycle has 1450cc and 85 horsepower. I think the geo gas tank held 9 gallons, but again, from memory, don’t hold me to it.
I remember one time I got 48 MPG @ 90 MPH. It was rated for something like 58 MPG highway. Maybe more. I think the chevy sprint, which was the precuser to the metro, was rated for 60MPG, but my girlfriend had one at the time and claimed 65MPG highway.
The car weighed something like 1900 pounds. If you put four full sized males in one(180 to 220 pounds each), you would be dragging bumpers and muffler everywhere you went, and probably would have to downshift twice to climb a hill. Back in college, I had four large males in mine once. Along with two large computers in the back and two very large monitors(50 to 100lbs each) on the laps of the backseat passengers. I remember thinking the car was gonna fall apart. Sparks were flying everywhere.
In town, I’d say it would be a tossup between a prius and a geo metro equipped as mine was. But on the highway? NO CONTEST!
Trains too.
Nothing beats a lugger diesel for efficiency. Many years ago, they built Huge two cylinder opposed flat twin diesels, and also nat gas burning versions, for pumping. They ran so slow, you could almost cound the revolutions of the exposed flywheel. The pistons were in the neighborhood of 2-3 feet in diameter. These are the most efficient kinds of IC engines ever made.
I like them too. You know, I heard Chrysler builds diesel Sebrings here in the States for EXPORT to Europe.
At 90,000 it is just getting warmed up. I haven’t had the first problem with it, and the battery hasn’t lost any power as far as I can tell.
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