Posted on 05/18/2007 4:36:41 AM PDT by Liz
Jews think that Christians are “duped” by the false story of Jesus Christ being the Son of God. Moslems believe that Christians have perverted the truth of the prophet Jesus Christ by making Him God. There are wonderful protestant Christians who believe the Pope to be the Great Whore spoken of in the New Testament.
One person’s cult is another persons truth. Just because you do or don’t believe in something your family believes in or because you believe in something your family does not believe in does not make it so or not so.
Who appointed you the judge of anyones faith? Will you decide for me if my religious beliefs are good or bad?
The fact is Mr. Romney appears to live what most of us would call a good life. He has raised up good kids that are productive Americans paying taxes. The one wife he has had since youth supports him and thinks he is a good man.
I don’t care anything about whether or not the reason he is good is because of a false story or because of the truth. None of that changes the fact that he is a good man.
It also happens that he has a proven track record of leadership. He is well spoken, articulate, good looking and has no skeletons in his closet.
He is not everything I want, certainly Mr. Hunter is a lot closer to that but I don’t believe Mr. Hunter has the ability to gain the support that Mr. Romney has. Mr. Romney has already raised a lot of money. While we may not like it, in the USA you have to raise money to get elected. I think that Mr. Romney is the JFK of this era and can gain the support of many Conservative Democrats just as many Rebublicans voted for Mr Kennedy. You can’t win the White House without that support, Mr. Hunter, as wonderful as his ideals are will never win that support.
I would much rather have Mr. Romney win the presidency while supporting most of my political goals than have Mr. Hunter who probably supports nearly all of my goals loose.
Dissaffected Mormons have no good reason that I can think of for maligning the good name of good practicing Mormons.
It is OK for people to have different religions.
IOW, #21 is the good old “bigot” line we get to see so much.
“Romney should be given a fair shake.....his policies and leadership qualities should be scrutinized, not his religious affiliation. That kind of bigotry should have gone by the wayside with the 1960 election of John F. Kennedy, a Roman Catholic....beyond the good looks and stylish presentation of Romney, is a highly intelligent, very driven and skillful politician. He’s a caring man with a nice family. Why should he be criticized for having that? It used to be the American ideal; maybe it’s time to have it again. Manhattan”
I’d go with that, as long as everyone is comfortable with looking the other way when a muslim jihadist runs, or a scientologist as nutty as Tom Cruise, or an atheist runs who has substituted Earth worship for belief, or . . . or. . . .
How people can believe the religious beliefs of a man, which are the foundation of his whole moral decision making process, can be ignored in a presidential contest are beyond me. That doesn’t mean anyone is excluded from running, just how can you exclude examining all fundamental thinking processes?
Perhaps we should become totally politically correct and not discriminate on age (an 18 year old or 90 year old would be fine), sexual orientation (transvestite president anyone?), mental background (straight out of a mental ward), legal status (convicted of fraud?). Then we could have a convicted transvestite 18 year old lunatic satanist in office because no one could question their protected status with out having a scarlet ‘B’ for bigot branded on their forehead.
The only status that logically shouldn’t be taken into account are race and sex, because they don’t correlate with the capacity to lead - Condeleeza Rice would have been quite a viable candidate if she had wanted. But calling people bigots for not supporting someone who believes in seer stones and that God lives with his many wives on a planet circling the star Kolob is asking a bit much.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigotry
In post #21 you in essence called colorcountry a bigot, something we see leveled all the time at anyone who opposes Romney because of his "religion."
Add me to your bigot list too.
It is my right to discern if something is, or is not true. Are you saying we must all honor someone's irrational beliefs? There was a man in Salt Lake City who thought he was a prophet of God. He crept into a little girls bedroom and kept her as a wife for a year because he thought God commanded it. Do I have to honor his "faith?" Should Elizabeth Smart and her family questioned his belief?
The fact is Mr. Romney appears to live what most of us would call a good life. He has raised up good kids that are productive Americans paying taxes. The one wife he has had since youth supports him and thinks he is a good man.
Yeah, I've done that too, I've raised five successful adult children. You don't seem to buy into my opinion just because I've been married to my husband for many, many years and have five grown productive children now do you?
Dissaffected Mormons have no good reason that I can think of for maligning the good name of good practicing Mormons. It is OK for people to have different religions.
I don't malign Romney, I see him for what he is. I do malign Mormonism. I perhaps have MORE right than most others. I do question people's rationality who believe it, since I have come to the conclusion that it can't be anything but false. I do think the belief system is detrimental. I do believe that others in America think like I do. In fact, I think more American think like me in private, than believe in Mormonism. I do think that Romney is bad news for our party. I may be proven wrong. I doubt it.
The American ideal is a flip-flopping cultist?
Yikes.
Please, give me a bag of Other People’s Money, with no accountability whatsoever.....let me see how rich, successful and self-made I become.
How many people realize how much money the LDS Inc has. Approximately 30,000,000,000 thats BILLON dollars. Much of it is invested by people just like Mitt. It is very difficult to prove, but it can be done. Most of the members of the twelve apostles of the CoJCoLDS are CEOs just like Mitt....and very successful.
As for the beliefs of Mormons about where God lives or how many wives He has if any, what difference does it make? How do you know their beliefs are any further away from the truth than yours?
Whose job is it to judge people and their superstitions? While you say it is your job I think it is mostly none of our business. I didn’t care that JFK was a Catholic and I certainly didn’t care that Mr. Nixon was a Quaker. From what I have seen of Mormons if all of us lived like they do it would be a better place for all.
In post #21 you in essence called colorcountry a bigot, something we see leveled all the time at anyone who opposes Romney because of his “religion.”
Add me to your bigot list too.
______________________________________________
I suppose if the shoe fits . . .
Is a Jewish holocaust survivor a bigot because they hate Nazism?
That’s how I view my position on Mormonism. I am a survivor, I think it is evil and insidious. You may disagree with me, but I certainly don’t fit the definition of “bigot.”
Do you really think that calling Americans “bigots” because they view Romney’s faith irrational is a help to him. Calling people who rightfully judge a bigot, is just going to alienate them further. I’d be careful using that tack if I were you.
“Whose job is it to judge people and their superstitions? “
You are sooooo right. I am a crystal gazer myself who believes in the use of magic underwear to ward away evil. I’m sure glad no one has a right to question my superstitions, especially if I run for office.
Liz I agree. As the day goes by, more and more people are questioning the Senate Bill. We DO NOT NEED A BILL. Just increase exports - ship ‘em home! (Shiup the racist Geraldo out too.)
People are waking up that the Congress represents the Political Parties, not the people.
You are right, the GOP cheap labor plays into the Dem political machines in the long run. The Dems are screwing themselves too as the upside is that Abortion will be a thing of the past.
_____________________________________________________
How does this statement have anything to do with the argument? The Nazi’s have very little in common with modern Conservatives, but Mormons do. Nazi’s are socialist, Mormons’ are not. The Mormon religion comes from a very conservative time in American history.
If you are not Christian or if you have no religion at all then any one of these Christian religions sound as weird as another. Most practicing Christians regardless of how weird we may think they are are very good people and good citizens. I may not believe what they believe or act the way I do because of the things they believe but we do have some good things in common. The fact is they are true to their faith and their faith does not seem to be doing me any harm.
The Pilgrims that came here from Holland and England came here to practice what the rest of Europe thought was Weird religion. More power to them. Look what came of that weirdness. Please stop letting your hatred of a group of religious people affect your otherwise good judgement.
Right out of the playbook. “You hate Mormons” instead of “You hate Mormonism.”
*Yawn*
I am not comparing Nazism to Mormonism. There is no comparison.
You called me a bigot. I said someone who has come to a conclusion based upon experience is not a bigot....just as a survivor is not a bigot.
Is a person who left Islam and become a Christian now a bigot against Islam? No, they are not. Likewise a person who has escaped Mormonism is not a bigot against Mormons, they are simply convinced that Mormonism is a failed doctrine.
For you to twist my words to try and suggest I compared Mormonism to Nazism, or to suggest my knowledge of Mormonism is somehow bigotry, is just simply dishonest.
Romney -- a dream come true ping!
I am for Duncan Hunter, but would support Romney if he achieved the nomination. Giuliani? I would vote by write in or third party.
Oh, you're right. Instead of going to a made-up L.Ron Hubbard planet for science fiction, LDS depicts its own reality of a distant star allegedly called "Kolob."
Instead of going to a made-up L. Ron Hubbard planet for science fiction, LDS create their own sci-fi in the central & southern portions of the Americas by describing vast wars where millions die, where civilizations of great industry were prevalent when trace-able evidence fails them, and where the natives are supposedly of Jewish descent.
As for which teachings are closer, in one of the most basic elements I think Scientologists are closer to Christians in that both have not put out teachings that you have the opportunity to become gods post-death.
Just because plenty of Christian cult offshoots exist and some stick to basic Bible teaching, doesn't mean that most of them twist them to the degree that LDS prophets have. Note this speech from former LDS prophet-prez Spencer W. Kimball:
"Brethren, 225,000 of you are here tonight. I suppose that 225,000 of you may become gods" (from speech published in official LDS church pub Ensign Magazine, 11/75 + 1980).
So tell me, what does polytheism have to do with monotheism? (If you can't even get the number of gods straight, so much for "common ground.") What does inheriting God's gifts on the other side of death have to do with attempting to work your way into godhood and be "like the Most High"--other than joining the original entity who tried that route and failed (Isaiah 14:13-14)?
The bottom line is that Mitt thinks he'll become a god someday. So you want a divine-to-be in office?
If you thought you were to be a god upon death, what kind of power surge adrenalin does that pour through your political decisions?
If you hate Mormonism because you were one but now have seen the light do you also hate Catholicism? How about Judaism? How about Pentalcostisism?
My experience is that most people that leave their faith simply fade away from it and have respect for the good people that they left behind. You do not seem to have that respect. Because you lack that respect and judge them to be evil I think that indeed that you fall into the category of “bigot”. Perhaps I simply misunderstand your words but that is what it looks like.
Who appointed you to judge Color Country's faith (labeling her a bigot)? Will you decide for her if her religious beliefs are good or bad?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.