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They Shoot Mormons, Don't They? Religious Bigotry, alive and well today
Saundra Duffy

Posted on 05/04/2007 5:46:36 AM PDT by Saundra Duffy

They Shoot Mormons, Don't They? Religious bigotry, alive and well today

May 4, 2007 - by Saundra Duffy-Hawkins

“I wouldn’t vote for a Mormon for dogcatcher, much less President of the United States!” There’s a lot of that kind of hateful rhetoric going around since Mitt Romney decided to throw his hat in the ring – as if Mormons are some kind of hideous evil monsters. The loudest anti-Mormon shouts, sad to say, are coming from America’s so-called “Christian right”. How can Mitt Romney hope to get a fair shake in this spiritually polluted atmosphere?

There was another man running for President who faced the same dilemma – John F. Kennedy – only he was the target of anti-CATHOLIC bigotry. In his 1960 speech to the Greater Houston Ministerial Association, JFK said the following: “. . .I believe in an America where religious intolerance will someday end - where all men and all churches are treated as equal - where man has the same right to attend or not attend the church of his choice - where there is no Catholic vote, no anti-Catholic vote, no bloc voting of any kind - and where Catholics, Protestants and Jews, at both the lay and pastoral level, will refrain from those attitudes of disdain and division which have so often marred their words in the past, and promote instead the American ideal of brotherhood.” John F. Kennedy Library & Museum (Speeches, 1960). By the way, if you listen to the audio version of JFK’s speech, you will hear the hurt and frustration in his voice and the unfair treatment surely must have caused many a sleepless night.

Fast forward to 2007 where JFK might as well have been “whistlin’ Dixie”. The hostility toward Mormons today, in my opinion, is even worse than that suffered by JFK. Although it is said that JFK lost about a million votes to religious intolerance, Romney stands to lose even more if the anti-Mormon evangelicals hang together.

According to Media Matters for America - “. . . a Web-based, not-for-profit, 501(c)(3) progressive research and information center dedicated to comprehensively monitoring, analyzing, and correcting conservative misinformation in the U.S. media” - FOX News is not reporting accurately on the level of evangelical hostility to the Romney run. Media Matters for America points out that among evangelical leaders rejecting Mormons: Shirley and James Dobson (National Day of Prayer and Focus on the Family, respectively), the Southern Baptist Convention (collectively), Pat Robertson (Christian Broadcasting Network), and Dr. D. James Kennedy (Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church in Florida). “Among many conservative evangelicals – who comprise a significant part of the Republican base – Mormonism is considered an un-Christian cult.” Media Matters for America (2007)

While stumping in Florida, a man in the audience stood up during the Q&A portion and said the following to Romney: “You, sir, you’re a pretender. You do not know the Lord. You’re a Mormon.” Media Matters for America (2007). This is the kind of un-American, disrespectful treatment Mitt Romney will apparently have to endure throughout the entire campaign – as if just being a Mormon is reason enough to open the floodgates for free flow of pent-up hatred and vindictiveness.

For the record, the Mormon bashers know full well that the official name of Romney’s church is “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints” and the members should rightfully be called “members of the LDS Church” but the words “Mormon” and “Mormonism” have an aura of negativity so they prefer to use the “M” word as if it were dirty.

Less than five minutes cruising around the official LDS website (LDS.org) will show anyone who’s interested that the Church is a Christian organization, with Jesus Christ at the Head. There are no paid clergy – all are volunteers. Humanitarian aid is legendary. Members of the LDS Church believe in strong family values; they are patriotic, they are law-abiding upstanding citizens of their community. Many LDS young men right out of high school go on two-year missions – you know, the guys on bikes – and during their mission they don’t date, read newspapers, go to movies or watch TV; but rather they dedicate two years of their lives to serving others. Many women go on missions as well, and couples, only theirs is 18 months in length but the obligations are basically the same. Most members do not shop or go out to eat on Sundays – reminiscent of the good old days when shops and stores were closed in obedience to the Commandment, “Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy”. If they can help it, LDS Church members do not work on Sundays, either, preferring to spend the day at church and with their families. Church members are encouraged to store up a year’s supply of food and water so they will be able to care for their families in the event of an emergency. The LDS Church believes in self-sufficiency and self-reliance but in the event of a financial hardship the Church distributes food and supplies through their welfare (Bishop’s Storehouse) program. Members of the LDS Church do not drink alcohol nor do they use illicit drugs; they do not drink coffee and tea. A Mormon in good standing, therefore, will not be found in a drunken stupor puking her guts out at 3 a.m. anywhere in the world. Furthermore, members of the church are encouraged to dress modestly, be polite and courteous. And members of the LDS Church are faithful tithe payers. Come on, people, what’s not to love?

So what on earth is their beef, the anti-Mormon zealots? Why is there such disdain for the LDS Church and its members? In Hugh Hewitt’s book, “Mormon in the White House?” he states his thesis that the fierce anti-Mormon sentiment among main-stream Christians stems from one or two or all three of the following factors (in order of importance):

1) “It is just too weird.

2) “A Mormon president will supercharge Mormons’ missionary work.

3) “If there is a Mormon in the White House, Salt Lake City will call the shots, at least on the biggest issues.” Hewitt (2007, p. 221-227)

Hugh Hewitt has written an exquisite book about the Romney campaign and overcoming the “Mormon problem.” It’s a good read and I highly recommend it. Of the three problem points listed in the previous paragraph, Hewitt believes – unless some unforeseen blunder destroys his chances – none of the three is insurmountable for Mitt Romney. (Plus, he has the best hair.)

Well, I’m no Hugh Hewitt, not even close; he’s an icon on the conservative radio talk show circuit. Hewitt could talk circles around me (I’ve seen him in action in Sacramento); he’s brilliant; he’s well educated, well read, no doubt a genius, plus he’s kind of cute. I’m basically a “nobody” – an overweight grandma – but after having researched for this paper, I have come to a totally different conclusion as to why there is such in-your-face angst over Romney’s religion of choice: It’s all about money, power and control (in that order). I think they’re (the evangelical religious bigots, that is) scared half to death and are revving up their attacks, not to save souls, but to save their reputations (which if tarnished would lead to financial ruin).

As I said, all one must do is browse around the LDS official web site to see what the LDS Church believes and stands for. Any reasonable person would conclude that Mormons are not evil monsters at all. In fact, they are God fearing, Christ believing, Holy Ghost following people going about doing good. “You will know them by their fruit” and the LDS has plenty of fruit and they are willing to share.

Earlier, I stated that some high-powered ministries have publicly condemned Mormons: Shirley and James Dobson, the Southern Baptist Convention, Pat Robertson, and Dr. D. James Kennedy – just to name a few. There are hoards of others. Sunday after Sunday, preachers, evangelists, reverends and ministers from all Christian denominations pound the pulpit with anti-Mormon rhetoric. I heard the message loud clear when I was a Baptist and when I tiptoed through evangelical/Pentecostal territories. Was I ever miffed when I later learned for myself the Gospel truth about the LDS Church.

Just think about it, please. If Dr. D. James Kennedy, for example, who wrote the book, The Wolves Among Us, were to admit he’d been wrong in labeling the LDS Church a “cult” that leads unwary ignorant people astray (to hell), what would become of his multi-million-dollar ministry? Suffice it to say, there’s big money to be had by sale of books, tapes, CD’s, videos, and other anti-Mormon propaganda, not to mention speaking engagements and world-wide religious crusades. We’re talking trillions, all told. I realize the anti-Mormon aspect of these ministries is but a small portion of the business, but if the truth came out, that they had been using falsehoods about the LDS Church as a cash cow, their entire empires could tumble.

The ABC News program 20/20 aired on March 23, 2007, exposed the lavish lifestyles of some of the top evangelical preachers – million dollar mansions and personal jets. ABC News - 20/20 (2007) (Again, the LDS Church has no paid clergy.)

It’s nothing new. Severe harassment and persecution has been the lot of the LDS Church since it’s inception in 1820 when a 14-year-old boy named Joseph Smith saw visions and communed with heavenly beings. Rather than discuss the spiritual aspects of the LDS Church, however, let’s stick to facts of history. Taken from a college-level early American history textbook, Joseph Smith, upon experiencing the visions and visitations, believed “that God had work for me to do, and that my name should be for good and evil among all nations, kindreds and tongues.” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 292). The textbook continues, “They were met with hostility virtually everywhere they went . . . . As the movement gathered momentum, hundreds of people joined the church; entire congregations of churches of other faiths joined . . .” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 293)

During the dark time of American history when slavery was flourishing and when Native Americans were forced from their lands, the pioneers of the LDS Church also suffered at the hands of unscrupulous politicians, governmental leaders, and angry hate-filled mobs. “In the face of relentless persecution, Joseph Smith, the founder of the church, had led his flock to Illinois. There they had established the town of Nauvoo, which by the mid-1840’s had become the largest city in Illinois with over 15,000 people. . . In June 1844, a mob of non-Mormons broke into the jail where Smith was being held and killed both him and his brother. . .The Mormons abandoned Nauvoo in the spring of 1846 as anti-Mormons pounded the town with cannon, destroying the Great Temple. In a well-coordinated migration, 15,000 Mormons moved in stages to the Great Salt Lake.” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 334-335) Many walked all the way and many died along the way, including innocent babes.

Joseph Smith at one time was tarred and feathered by a mob. No jury, no trial, no judge – and they had planned to castrate him, too. On October 27, 1838, the then governor of Missouri issued an “extermination order”: “The Mormons must be treated as enemies, and must be exterminated or driven from the State if necessary . . .” Far West History (n.d.) Please note that the order called for exterminating “Mormons” making no distinction between men, women and children, and indeed women and children were subject to the extermination order.

In an event known in LDS history as “the Haun’s Mill Massacre”, precipitated by the extermination order, 30 to 40 LDS families were surprised by some 200 to 250 militia. After the smoke cleared, seventeen LDS people lay dead including a ten-year-old boy. Thirteen LDS members were wounded including a woman and a seven-year-old boy. “A few Missourians returned the next day and took plunder.” LDS FAQ (n.d.) No Missouri militiamen were killed but three were wounded. Just a few years earlier, the LDS folk who died that day had been members of other churches - Congregational or Methodist or Baptist or Presbyterian.

In l976, Governor Bond of Missouri officially rescinded the extermination order and presented apologies for the “unfortunate developments” it caused. Quoting from Governor Bond’s Executive Order: “WHEREAS, Governor Boggs’ order clearly contravened the rights to life, liberty, property and religious freedom as guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States, as well as the Constitution of the State of Missouri; and . . . Expressing on behalf of all Missourians our deep regret for the injustice and undue suffering rescind Executive Order Number 44 dated October 27, 1838, issued by Governor W. Boggs. . .” Far West History (n.d.) The individuals who harassed, abused, and even murdered Mormons in cold blood were never tried for their crimes.

I read Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.’s Letter from Birmingham Jail and it really touched my heart. There he was, suffering for the Lord in jail, and these religious leaders with highfalutin titles on the outside wrote an open letter (“A Call for Unity”) in which they criticize King’s tactics and basically blame King for the racial turmoil of the time. Though you can tell King is upset and hurt by the attack – made worse because he’s stuck in jail and can’t confront the religious leaders face-to-face – his response is gentle genius. “I wish you had commended the Negro sit-inners and demonstrators of Birmingham for their sublime courage, their willingness to suffer, and their amazing discipline in the midst of great provocation. One day the South will recognize its real heroes.” Barnet and Bedau (2005, p. 881)

King has a few choice words for the Church, too: “If today’s church does not recapture the sacrificial spirit of the early church, it will lose its authenticity, forfeit the loyalty of millions, and be dismissed as an irrelevant social club with no meaning for the twentieth century. Every day I meet young people whose disappointment with the church has turned into outright disgust.” Barnet and Bedau (2005, p. 880)

King signs off with “Yours for the cause of Peace and Brotherhood”.

There’s an eerie commonality between what JFK and MLK endured at the hands of the religious bigots of their day and what Mitt Romney is facing today. I hope and pray that Romney will be able to fend off these undeserved attacks from the religious hypocrites with the same grace, dignity and God-inspired resolve displayed by the other two.

A few popular bumper stickers read: “Honk if you love Jesus” and “Christians aren’t perfect, just forgiven” or “Jesus is my co-pilot”. Yet, apparently, these same bumper-sticker Christians are the ones waging war against Mitt Romney’s run for the Presidency solely on the basis of his chosen faith in a Church that bears the name of the Savior of the world.

References

ABC News - 20/20 (2007). Philanthropic donations come from your heart, but where do they end up? Ex-money manager says "enough!" to secretive Christian Ministry spending. Glenn Ruppel & John Stossel. United States: ABC News.

Ayers, E. L., Gould, L. L., Oshinsky, D. M., & Soderlund, J. R. (2004). American Passages - a history of the United States - Volume I: to 1877 (2nd ed.). Belmont, California: Thomson/Wadsworth.

Barnet, S., & Bedau, H. (2005). Letter from Birmingham Jail. Current Issues and Enduring Questions - a guide to critical thinking and argument, with readings (7th ed., pp. 867-882). Boston and New York: Bedford/St. Martin's.

Far West History. (n.d.). The Extermination Order and how it was rescinded. Retrieved April 28, 2007, from http://www.jwha.info/mmff/exorder.htm

Hewitt, H. (2007). A Mormon in the White House? 10 things every American should know about Mitt Romney. Washington, D.C.: Regnery Publishing, Inc.

John F. Kennedy Presidential Library & Museum. (1960, September 12). Address of Senator John F. Kennedy to the Greater Houston Ministerial Association. Retrieved April 22, 2007, from http://www.jfklibrary.org

Lds Faq. (n.d.). What was the Haun's Mill Massacre? Retrieved April 28-2007, 2004, from Brigham Young University Web Site: http://ldsfaq.byu.edu/view.asp?q=57

Media Matters for America. (2007). Fox News whitewashes evangelical hostility to Romney's faith. Retrieved April 22, 2007, from http://mediamatters.org/items/printable/200702280002


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: boggsforgovernor; cuespookymusic; election; lds; mormon; mormons; romney; whitesalamanderblues
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To: tantiboh

You seem to think Utah would be lost to conservativism without Mormonism. That is my point. That you think Mormonism is what makes Utah conservative....and not that the principals of conservatism make Utah conservatism.

Your view is troubling - - and it was that view that I was addressing specifically.


601 posted on 05/05/2007 5:31:45 PM PDT by colorcountry (An Honest Man will change his thoughts to match the truth and a Dishonest Man will change the truth)
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To: Ditter
"Did Joseph Smith find gold tablets and then lose them?"

Our detractors will call what I'm about to tell you "spin." Nevertheless, it is what the LDS Church teaches, and is the opposite perspective from what you have read.

Joseph Smith was directed to ancient records written on plates made of gold. Now, utter the word "gold," and you instantly get fantastic ideas. Examine according to its elemental properties, however, gold is an excellent long-term medium for storing information.

Joseph Smith was then commanded to translate these records; he did so with the help of several other people. The plates were later shown to 11 different witnesses, whose testimony of having seen and handled the records was written and signed by each.

This translation was called "The Book of Mormon." It is a record of prophecies and events from the Lord's people in ancient America.

Our detractors have long tried to discredit The Book of Mormon using any evidence they can find or invent; the record has withstood the test of time.

When the work of translation was done, the original record was returned to the Lord. In my opinion, this was done as a trial of faith.

A more complete record of these events, in Smith's own words, may be found here: Joseph Smith - History

"Did JS advocate polygamy?"

Joseph Smith taught "plural marriage" - as it's referred to in LDS circles. I won't get caught up in another apologetic debate as to this teaching; suffice it to say that there is much misunderstanding and misinformation regarding the practice - among which is the idea that it was practiced widely. In reality, Smith taught the doctrine reluctantly, and its practice was tightly controlled. I will not get into another argument about whether the practice was "right" or "wrong."

But, yes, the early LDS Church did accept polygamy until, for various reasons, the practice was abandoned in 1890. Suffice it to say, that we believe it was commanded by the Lord, just as it was to the Patriarchs of old (Abraham, Isaac, etc.), and we obeyed; likewise, when the Lord commanded that it be done away with, we obeyed. For more information on that, see here: Official Declaration 1 Today, those who practice it are not affiliated with the LDS Church; to do so is an excommunicable offense.

If you would like to know more about the LDS perspective on the topic, please visit the following: http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ai049.html

I appreciate your honest questions. I hope my answers have been satisfactory. Please feel free to ask if you are curious about anything else regarding the LDS Church.

For a "Cliff's Notes" overview of the primary doctrines of the LDS Church, go here: Articles of Faith

Best regards.
602 posted on 05/05/2007 5:34:38 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: colorcountry; tantiboh

I don’t call what non LDS have done electing Rocky Anerson, bars, strip joints, tatoo parlars, taror card readers, etc. is part of Conservatism CC.


603 posted on 05/05/2007 5:38:48 PM PDT by restornu (Elevate Your Thoughts!)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks; GrandEagle; Saundra Duffy

“Same here. The only one I wouldn’t vote for is MeCain.”

Yours is an interesting point. I would never vote for Giuliani. You would never vote for McCain. Others on this thread have stated they would never vote for Romney.

It looks like we’re destined to be split no matter who gets the nomination (of the current top three). What I’m wondering is if those who would never vote for McCain or Giuliani outnumber those who would never vote for Romney. Somehow, I get the sense that the conservative base is more concerned with conservatism than with religion, so I think they might.

Is there ever going to be a good candidate that everybody can agree on? I’m not so sure. I would guess that Reagan had plenty of detractors of his own.


604 posted on 05/05/2007 5:41:01 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: restornu
I don’t call what non LDS have done electing Rocky Anerson, bars, strip joints, tatoo parlars, taror card readers, etc. is part of Conservatism CC.

Nope Salt Lake city is part of the Urban phenomenon I was talking about Resty. Salt Lake City according to Church records is 48% Mormon, yet they allowed a complete, moron athiestic ex-mormon like Rocky Anderson to control it's mecca for eight years. It is sickening isn't it.

Thank you so much for clarifying my point.

605 posted on 05/05/2007 5:41:51 PM PDT by colorcountry (An Honest Man will change his thoughts to match the truth and a Dishonest Man will change the truth)
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To: tantiboh
Thank you for the info. You are very nice and polite I am just not interested in learning more about your religion. I won’t hesitate to vote for Romney if he is the nominee.
606 posted on 05/05/2007 5:41:57 PM PDT by Ditter
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To: andysandmikesmom

There are good stories and bad stories out there. I’m glad your parents were the recipients of good and not bad. I know people that had bad experiences and even got letters saying they were no longer baptised because they wanted out. They were so distraught, I had a hard time reminding them that God knows their hearts and that the LDS church couldn’t take away their baptism. Oh, and why they left? Because they were dirt poor and couldn’t pay their tithing bills that kept coming in the mail. These elders had been to their home and could see what I saw. Broken steps, peeling paint and wallpaper. A few years later the house was condemned, that’s how bad it was, yet, they were sent tithing bills they couldn’t pay and they asked to leave because they couldn’t pay the tithes. For that, they got a letter saying they were unbaptised.


607 posted on 05/05/2007 5:45:04 PM PDT by Netizen (If we can't locate/deport illegals, how will we get them to come forward to pay their $3,250 fines?)
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To: greyfoxx39

“This is an oath taken by Romney in the mormon temple. Are you certain that if Romney took the presidential oath of office it would supersede this oath?”

What you fail to understand, greyfoxx, is that the Kingdom of God and Zion are spiritual organizations, referring to the LDS Church itself. This oath has nothing to do with politics or nations. It means being willing to serve in the Church and help to build it up.

Therefore, to ask if the oath of office would supersede this oath is a moot question. They are not incompatible; Romney is perfectly capable of fulfilling both simultaneously.

You read the oath through the lens of your own interpretation, rather than that of those who actually take it. This is a mistake.


608 posted on 05/05/2007 5:45:23 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: George W. Bush

“If you can think of a single reason why he’s the Dim majority leader other than as a lure to Mormons toward the Dim party, I’d love to hear it.”

I can’t. The choice mystified me at the time, too. Still, as a conservative, I like it; he’s remarkably inept.

“And I don’t think it’s any coincidence that Salt Lake has gone after the FLDS with a vengeance now (but not before the Olympic there). We’ve all know about FLDS for decades. Why now, eh?”

I don’t know; frankly, I hadn’t heard that it was happening at all. Do you have a couple of articles where I might learn more? I know nothing about Utah politics. If they are finally cracking down, that would be nothing but a good thing.

“But I do think the Mormon vote and the public reputation of Mormons in general are in extraordinary focus right now.”

I agree. It has been interesting, as a Mormon, to be a part of that focus. If Romney wins the nomination, it will only intensify exponentially. Quite a nudge out of one’s comfort zone!


609 posted on 05/05/2007 5:52:21 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: colorcountry

I’ve never met a Mormon I didn’t like - all very sweet people, good family people. There are many Mormons in my neighborhood. But I think the Mormon church, maintains more control over it’s members than other churches do. And that bothers me a bit.


610 posted on 05/05/2007 5:52:46 PM PDT by Paperdoll ( on the cutting edge,)
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To: greyfoxx39

“If Romney gets the nomination, the hounds of hell (meaning the Clinton machine) will be set loose on him through the mainstream media and the Republicans will go down in flames, White House, House and Senate.”

I really think this is alarmist. Don’t generalize your negative perspective of the LDS Church to the populace in general - most people are pretty unthreatened, even admiring, of the LDS Church, even if they disagree on theological grounds.

If the Clintons and MSM go after Romney on the basis of religion, they will be walking on a shaking tightrope. I give it ten-to-one odds it’ll backfire.

In any case, even if you’re right, what makes you think that the same tactics won’t be applied, regardless of who is the nominee? The difference is, releasing Giuliani’s “drag” pictures or publicizing McCain’s marriage troubles won’t backfire and result in a backlash against the Clintons. From that perspective, Romney becomes a much safer bet.


611 posted on 05/05/2007 5:58:13 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: DelphiUser

AAhhhhhhh, didn’t know that! Here in GA I don’t think there are all that many Mormons (Baptists, OTOH, are a whole other story! Every other church is a Baptist church of some sort or other! And us Catholics are the ones who are the recipients of the slanted glances! But I am used to it, it doesn’t bother me. And as it turns out, the Baptists are really nice people. Their churches are always where the Upward basketball and football teams are, so my son plays ball with them!), so I have never seen anything “anti-Mormon” at all. In fact, these threads are the first introduction I have ever had to the Mormon faith, other than commercials for a free BOM on TV. Maybe you might want to consider relocation :-)


612 posted on 05/05/2007 6:00:37 PM PDT by VRWCer ("The Bible is the Rock on which this Republic rests." - President Andrew Jackson)
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To: George W. Bush; greyfoxx39

“That guy who tried to Mormon-bash Romney down in the South a while back clearly repelled all the other Baptists and evangelical types in the room. Romney handled it quite gracefully.”

That’s an excellent example of what I’m talking about. Nobody else has dared try the same tactic again since that incident. It did nothing but give Romney face time in the media and a chance to appear “presidential.”


613 posted on 05/05/2007 6:02:23 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: colorcountry

“FARMS and FAIR are not official sites, or haven’t you been notified?”

This is true, but they’re still Mormons, doing outside research. They are not speaking for the Church, but it still demonstrates my point that the LDS Church “allows” us to read anything we darned well want.


614 posted on 05/05/2007 6:05:57 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: colorcountry

The last I learn in math CC 48% is less than half so it is not more are enought to swing the tide!


615 posted on 05/05/2007 6:08:11 PM PDT by restornu (Elevate Your Thoughts!)
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To: George W. Bush

“Who on that stage can come closest, in totality, to Reagan and with the potential for crossover appeal for a Reagan-sized landslide, large enough to bring us back to the majority in one or both house of Congress?”

I agree. I think Romney scares the pants off the MSM. That’s why we’re going to see a lot of hit-pieces such as the recent PBS documentary and the upcoming “Mountain Meadows Massacre” movie. The Boston Globe has been writing snide things about Romney for years.

Personally, that’s the kind of candidate I want on my side.

And, like you said, the hair doesn’t hurt.

“Salt Lake had better expect attacks via the libmedia arm of the Dim party.”

The LDS Church is quite experienced at dealing with our detractors; we’ve got going on two centuries of experience at it. I’m confident the Church will handle the whole thing quite gracefully.

As for individual members, well, we’ll see.


616 posted on 05/05/2007 6:13:17 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: restornu
I thought mormons vote in higher number than the general public resty, because they are such good, responsible, upstanding citizens.

You would think that 48% Mormon population would be more than sufficient to swing the election. But it just wasn’t so. I suspect quite a few Mormons voted for Rocky Andersen. I would also suspect that more than a majority of Mormons in his State voted for Harry Reid. Look what THAT got us.

So now, Mormons want us to trust them that Romney is conservative when every indication points to the fact that he is not. He is a flipper, who has backed abortion rights, gun rights restrictions, and gay rights.

I will never vote for Romney even if he IS the Republican nominee. I guess we’ll just have to wait and see how this all plays out. I also did not vote for about 1/2 the Mormons who were running in Utah for political office - of course that half that I didn't vote for were Democrats.

617 posted on 05/05/2007 6:17:40 PM PDT by colorcountry (An Honest Man will change his thoughts to match the truth and a Dishonest Man will change the truth)
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To: colorcountry

Of course Mormons make Utah conservative! Just as Southern Baptists and other Evangelists make the South conservative!

If a predominantly conservative group of people makes up half an area’s population, then they are making that area more conservative. It’s math.

How is it that we are talking past each other on this?

The simple fact of the matter is that Mormonism embraces and nourishes the principles of Conservatism, just like any other Christian group does.


618 posted on 05/05/2007 6:18:02 PM PDT by tantiboh
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To: tantiboh

You’re on the same threads, too. What are you trying to divine from the stars, as to this significance?


619 posted on 05/05/2007 6:21:00 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Life isn't fair. It's just fairer than death, that's all.--William Goldman)
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To: tantiboh

By your reasoning then Baptists would also make Utah more conservative.

I’d depend rather more on the Baptists. They don’t go around spouting if we don’t support their candidate, then they’re leaving and taking home their ball.

This ‘threat’ that if we don’t support Romney, the Mormons will abandon conservativism is very disturbing.


620 posted on 05/05/2007 6:22:18 PM PDT by colorcountry (An Honest Man will change his thoughts to match the truth and a Dishonest Man will change the truth)
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