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To: Badeye; untrained skeptic; Texas Patriot; Reagan Man
I agree that your SSAN has become a de facto identification number, but it is not a secure document, nor is it biometrically tied to you. There is no fingerprint or photo of you on it. Anyone can forge one, steal one, or buy on on the streets.

Ditto with State Driver's Licenses and IDs. In some states, they will give them out to illegals. (We can't have someone who is in this country illegally, flaunting our immigration and work laws, break our Motor Vehicle Code, now can we?)

I know that there is the "uniform document act" or some such that is suppose to require states to make their Driver's Licenses and State IDs more secure, but that is still a state by state thing, and as was shown here in Michigan, Secretary of State workers will still sell lawful IDs to illegals for a few bucks. Therefore you cannot trust the validity of a State ID.

Combine the illegal immigrant problem with the airport security problem, and we are heading towards the day when we will be required to carry a National ID or Internal Passport.

Now, where did I put my tinfoil? My head is getting cold...

72 posted on 05/03/2007 1:18:25 PM PDT by Yo-Yo (USAF, TAC, 12th AF, 366 TFW, 366 MG, 366 CRS, Mtn Home AFB, 1978-81)
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To: Yo-Yo

‘Anyone can forge one, steal one, or buy on on the streets.”

correct, but only to a point. You can verify if the number provided is ‘valid’ and if ‘death benefits’ have been paid out associated with it. You can also verify the previous names and addresses associated with it, then compare that to the physical characteristics of the applicant, and with the addresses listed by same.

That costs a whole 45 cents, and less than 30 seconds with the correct software and database, again easily obtained and very cheap.

You don’t need biometrics for 95% of all the job openings in this country, a simply SNN verification works just fine.

If you freep mail me, I’ll explain to you directly how I know all this stuff professionally.


74 posted on 05/03/2007 1:22:24 PM PDT by Badeye (Hiding the kooks in the biker bar won't help, Sally)
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To: Yo-Yo
If you read the Real Id act, and the DHS proposed regulations regarding it, it does require verifying legal status and require a reasonable process for doing so.

Some state legislatures are making a show of fighting it. Some are denying it is a requirement despite the fact that it clearly is. I suspect that is the usual liberal political posturing. The usual lies they spout and their constituency for some reason believes.

No state is going to actually follow through and have their driver's license no longer accepted for any federal purpose, such as boarding an airplane.

What they have managed to do is delay its implementation for several more years, and even then it will be up to eight more years for the drivers licenses that had already been issued to expire and be replaced in some states.

The act even requires that applicants for Ids provide a SSN which is verified to make sure it matches the applicant. I'm personally opposed to that particular part of the act. That should be the responsibility of the Social Security Administration when people apply for a job. They shouldn't be shifting the responsibility on to the states just because the Social Security Administration hasn't been doing their job.

Combine the illegal immigrant problem with the airport security problem, and we are heading towards the day when we will be required to carry a National ID or Internal Passport.

We as a society have developed a reflexive opposition to a National Id. In practicality if probable cause exists, our government should have the authority to require that we identify ourselves. I'm less convinced about Terry Stops, but the Supreme Court has ruled that they are Constitutional.

It doesn't really matter if the Id is State issued or if it's federally issued.

What we really need to fight against is how that Id might be used.

The real question is do you want the government to be able to track you wherever you go without having probable cause?

Should the government have unfettered access to airline reservation and passenger lists? Since Ids are required, the passenger lists could also uniquely identify each passenger rather than just be a list of names as well.

How about passenger lists for trains and buses? Some liberal legislators have suggested requiring Id for trains, and even major bus routes.

How about requiring an Id to purchase gasoline and having the government be able to track that as well.

It seems to me that these are the real threats to our freedom that the idea of a National Id represents to most, not the Id itself. It seems like fighting against a national Id itself is a bit misdirected since a National Id would infringe on our rights no more or no less than State Ids do.

What we don't want is our government tracking the every move of its citizens and prohibiting freedom of travel without probable cause. It seems to me that many of those loudly opposing a National Id have lost sight of that.

84 posted on 05/03/2007 2:27:27 PM PDT by untrained skeptic
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